Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: WLJ on February 28, 2019, 07:43:44 AM
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I'm not surprised, figured Kim would stonewall on something.
Be interesting to see how Kim reacts to this, Kim has a lot more to lose than Trump in this.
Cue the MSM's "We're all going to die!" routine
President Trump abruptly walked away from negotiations with North Korea in Vietnam and headed back to Washington on Thursday afternoon, saying the U.S. is unwilling to meet Kim Jong Un's demand of lifting all sanctions on the rogue regime without first securing its meaningful commitment to denuclearization.
Trump cuts short North Korea summit after dispute over sanctions: 'Sometimes you have to walk'
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-wasnt-prepared-to-lift-us-sanctions-on-north-korea-leading-to-abrupt-end-to-summit
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More interesting is going to be how the left reacts to this.
I'm sure that they'll be celebrating in the streets because they'd rather have a nuclear war than Trump being successful on anything.
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More interesting is going to be how the left reacts to this.
I'm sure that they'll be celebrating in the streets because they'd rather have a nuclear war than Trump being successful on anything.
Trump talks tough on NK: Orange Man bad, we must talk peace with NK just like Hillary would have.
Trump talks peace with NK: Orange Man bad, we must talk tough on NK just like Hillary would have.
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Good for Trump.
I read an article on Business Insider about the situation before Trump took office.
It claimed that Obama told Trump that the USA was planning a military strike on NK if NK developed missles that could hit the USA. True? I don't know.
If all Trump does is get NK to halt missile development, it will still be a huge accomplishment.
A second war with NK would be a horrific bloodbath.
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More interesting is going to be how the left reacts to this.
I'm sure that they'll be celebrating in the streets because they'd rather have a nuclear war than Trump being successful on anything.
Yup. They don't seem to care too much about it - some MSM reporters on site still had to ask questions about Cohen. I thought that was absolutely ridiculous. Even if you're a TDS schmuck reporter, one would think you'd still want to root for nuclear de-escalation on the peninsula, and concentrate your questions on that.
I so far like the way Trump has been handling this. While he walked away, he did so in what I thought was a thoughtful manner ("Do it right rather than do it fast"). None of the "Twitter Trump" burning bridges on the way out. Slow and steady may win the race here. If so, it will take a good 20 years for Trump to get any credit.
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Aren't we still formally at war with North Korea?
I'm sure that they'll be celebrating in the streets because they'd rather have a nuclear war than Trump being successful on anything.
Too true to be funny.
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More interesting is going to be how the left reacts to this.
Well, here's a start:
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2019/02/28/thank-you-rep-ted-lieu-calls-out-libs-for-promoting-the-trumpfail-hashtag/
How do you know when you have terminal TDS? When Ted Lieu calls you out for your TDS.
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Good. Glad someone has the balls to stand up to their regime rather than trying to diplo-maneuver their way into some touchy feely deal with no substantive benefit other than talking points.
Brad
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Well, here's a start:
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2019/02/28/thank-you-rep-ted-lieu-calls-out-libs-for-promoting-the-trumpfail-hashtag/
How do you know when you have terminal TDS? When Ted Lieu calls you out for your TDS.
Wow!
Think hell just had a snow storm.
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"Do it right rather than do it fast."
Absolutely correct.
Remember back in the 1980s when the left and the press went absolutely screaming *expletive deleted*ing nuts when the Reykjavik Summit ended with no agreement?
That summit didn't result in anything there. But it resulted in a LOT more in later years.
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I had a weird thought that he might agree to whatever they wanted and have a plane load of cash dropped off to seal the deal, but no one would be stupid enough to do something like that.
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Wow!
Think hell just had a snow storm.
Same.
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Kim still wants to play by the old rules.
He promises to be good. Clinton sends money, food and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Bush sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Obama sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
Kim promises to be good. Trump says, do good first, then I send the money, food, and oil. Kim is surprised. Trump walks.
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Good move by Trump. I very much doubt that Rocketboy saw that coming, and that's definitely a YUUUGE plus for Trump. This meeting was supposed to be about NK denuclearizing. That was what the previous meeting supposedly set up as the end game. As anyone who has ever negotiated to buy anything knows, you have to know your bottom line and be prepared to walk away if you can't make a deal you'll be satisfied with. Trump showing that the U.S. is willing to walk away must have scrambled more than a few NK brains.
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And don't think the Chinese trade negotiators weren't watching also...
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Good move by Trump. I very much doubt that Rocketboy saw that coming, and that's definitely a YUUUGE plus for Trump. This meeting was supposed to be about NK denuclearizing. That was what the previous meeting supposedly set up as the end game. As anyone who has ever negotiated to buy anything knows, you have to know your bottom line and be prepared to walk away if you can't make a deal you'll be satisfied with. Trump showing that the U.S. is willing to walk away must have scrambled more than a few NK brains.
This... Oh so much this. After so long of the US just playing along and letting them get away with whatever they want to, I imagine the abrupt change in approach was rather akin to a paradigm shift without a clutch.
And don't think the Chinese trade negotiators weren't watching also...
I strongly imagine that's a large part of Trump's endgame with the Norks and China. Trump is a shrewd businessman. The left seems to forget that/ignore it unless they want to talk about how he was an evil businessman
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Kim still wants to play by the old rules.
He promises to be good. Clinton sends money, food and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Bush sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Obama sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
Kim promises to be good. Trump says, do good first, then I send the money, food, and oil. Kim is surprised. Trump walks.
Succinct, I’m stealing it, thanx.
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And of course, Nancy Pelosi is screeching about how Kim was the BIG winner in the failed summit. Psychotic bitch.
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My take going into this was Kim won't do anything serious. Spring is here. Every failed strategy we have had to talk to the works has failed spectacularly in the spring when they look forward to not starving (more than usual) and need less fuel. You choke then in the late fall.
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I wouldn't be surprised if they more or less had an agreement and Kim tried to throw in additional demands in the final hours hoping Trump would not want to walk away without a deal. Trump walked and then talked to the media like it might be a long time before they meet again.
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And of course, Nancy Pelosi is screeching about how Kim was the BIG winner in the failed summit. Psychotic bitch.
The master legislator. ;/
Again, given the great negative connotations of the NK we were seeing during Obama's last years and the first six months of Trump, you would think people like her would at least temper their comments regarding the talks. I guarantee her that an unleashed NK would be way worse than Trump.
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Expectations should be low and walking away with nothing is better than signing a bad deal. The can is kicked down the road.
My only real gripe is Trump's continued praise of Kim and stuff like this:
Talking in Vietnam on Thursday about Kim's role in the fate of Warmbier, who died in June 2017, Trump said: "He felt badly about it. He felt very badly." He added that the two leaders had discussed Warmbier’s death privately. He added: "He tells me that he didn't know about it and I will take him at his word."
He did the same thing with Putin. Saying stuff like this about Kim is really unnecessary:
"He likes me, I like him. Some people say 'you should not like him.' I say, 'Why shouldn't I like him?' I like him. Get along great."
People will try to 'whatabout Obama' or setup a false dichotomy between him talking like this or nuclear war but I don't think it's unreasonable to demand better from our president.
Don't give me "the alternative was nuclear war"! No, it absolutely was and is not. Face-to-face meetings with gulag-masters without any pre-negotiation are amateur hour. Flattering a man who murders American citizens and his own relatives with impunity is unconscionable. You don't get points for "effort" when the "effort" involves pretending Otto Warmbier wasn't murdered, and that the US has a "special relationship" with the worst dictator on the planet -- and when that "effort" results in less than nothing.
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More interesting is going to be how the left reacts to this.
I'm sure that they'll be celebrating in the streets because they'd rather have a nuclear war than Trump being successful on anything.
Well, the streets of San Francisco or L.A. are the most likely to be hit with Kim's limited missile technology. I'm not sure if the left is sober enough or connected to reality enough to understand the implications of nuclear war with NK.
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Well, the streets of San Francisco or L.A. are the most likely to be hit with Kim's limited missile technology. I'm not sure if the left is sober enough or connected to reality enough to understand the implications of nuclear war with NK.
Just give them something else to blame Trump for
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Dumb as it sounds to us, I "presume" Trump is buttering Kim up to try to get a deal. Hearing praise of the evil little toad is revolting, but if it works, it will be worth it.
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Expectations should be low and walking away with nothing is better than signing a bad deal. The can is kicked down the road.
My only real gripe is Trump's continued praise of Kim and stuff like this:He did the same thing with Putin. Saying stuff like this about Kim is really unnecessary:People will try to 'whatabout Obama' or setup a false dichotomy between him talking like this or nuclear war but I don't think it's unreasonable to demand better from our president.
I'm conflicted on that stuff. From the 30,000' view, I don't like it. Digging in deeper (these are questions/potential reasons whether I agree with them or not, vs excuses):
He might be buttering them up (a common business tactic for businessman Trump) for "the greater good".
On Kim, while the buck always stops at the top, it is conceivable he did not know what happened to Warmbier when it happened, just like our president wouldn't know immediately if some guy in Gitmo was about to be beaten half to death by an overzealous E-4. Kim and Trump both seemed to be very specific in the wording about what Kim "didn't know".
Obviously, giving Kim the benefit of the doubt isn't a good look on the face of it. We all know about deaths he has ordered and how those deaths were carried out. But again, the ethics question is on "the greater good" of an agreement that locks down Nork nukes. Is making Kim look good/innocent "on camera" during negotiations regarding one death worth potentially saving hundreds of thousands of lives? It's a philosophical debate, IMO, and again, I'm not sure where I stand on it with my limited information sitting in the nosebleed section of the geopolitical bleachers.
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Just what did listening to the diplomatic establishment for decades get us?
Has Trumps unorthodox methods born any fruit up to this point?
There are always unexpected consequences to actions, so admittedly there may be some negative blowback from Trumps methods.
We already know the absolute failure of traditional diplomacy regarding the Norks and where that was heading.
So far I like the gamble.
Of course we only know what we’ve been allowed to know so we aren’t making decisions based on all the facts.
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New development: It appears we're going to suspend military exercises with South Korea.
The right seems to be almost more up in arms over it than the left. Maybe someone with more expertise can explain it to me, but given it's a suspension versus permanent, I'm not sure how it's a major deal? Can't we still train on tactics, but just not on NK's doorstep? Maybe not ideal, but I would see this as a carrot for NK to return to the table and deal to our benefit.
https://twitchy.com/sarahd-313035/2019/03/01/what-in-the-ever-loving-report-trump-admin-to-make-major-announcement-regarding-us-south-korea-military-exercises/
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Kim still wants to play by the old rules.
He promises to be good. Clinton sends money, food and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Bush sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Obama sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
Kim promises to be good. Trump says, do good first, then I send the money, food, and oil. Kim is surprised. Trump walks.
Hilfrickenarious.
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Kim still wants to play by the old rules.
He promises to be good. Clinton sends money, food and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Bush sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
He promises to be good. Obama sends money, food, and oil. Kim continues to be bad.
Kim promises to be good. Trump says, do good first, then I send the money, food, and oil. Kim is surprised. Trump walks.
Setting that to haiku:
The new sheriff came
Kim wanted to play the same
New day brings new rules
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President Trump abruptly announced Friday that he was withdrawing sanctions on North Korea, immediately after his own Treasury Department imposed them.
“It was announced today by the U.S. Treasury that additional large scale Sanctions would be added to those already existing Sanctions on North Korea. I have today ordered the withdrawal of those additional Sanctions!” Trump tweeted Friday afternoon.
???
(https://i.imgflip.com/2wphii.jpg)
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Well I guess somebody wasn't happy
Unconfirmed at this point BTW
North Korea has reportedly executed five officials over the failed nuclear summit in Hanoi with the United States, a South Korean newspaper reports.
Kim Hyok Chol, North Korea's special envoy to the U.S., and four other foreign ministry executives were reportedly killed by a firing squad in March at the airport in Pyongyang after being charged with spying for the U.S., the Chosun Ilbo paper reported, according to Reuters.
“He was accused of spying for the United States for poorly reporting on the negotiations without properly grasping U.S. intentions,” the paper’s source was quoted as saying.
North Korea Reportedly Executes Nuclear Envoy to US
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahbarkoukis/2019/05/31/north-korea-execution-n2547152
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Well I guess somebody wasn't happy
Unconfirmed at this point BTW
North Korea Reportedly Executes Nuclear Envoy to US
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahbarkoukis/2019/05/31/north-korea-execution-n2547152
Translation: You didn't guess what Trump was going to do/say... So it's the firing squad for you.
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Translation: You didn't guess what that Trump was going to do/say...meant what he said, unlike past presidents. So it's the firing squad for you.
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Well I guess somebody wasn't happy
Unconfirmed at this point BTW
North Korea Reportedly Executes Nuclear Envoy to US
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahbarkoukis/2019/05/31/north-korea-execution-n2547152
Meanwhile in the U.S., someone who commits straight-up treason walks free and gets a book deal.