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Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: WLJ on March 22, 2019, 01:35:55 PM



Title: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 22, 2019, 01:35:55 PM
Quote
After nearly two years, Special Counsel Robert Mueller has finished his investigation into the 2016 presidential election. The report has been submitted to Attorney General Bill Barr, who will review it and decide what will be made available to the public. A timeline for when that review will be finished has not been released.
BREAKING: Robert Mueller's Special Counsel Report is Finally Done
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2019/03/22/breaking-robert-muellers-special-counsel-report-is-finally-done-n2543538

I predict Mueller will be labeled a Russian spy by libs and the MSM if nothing come out of this mess.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: HankB on March 22, 2019, 02:09:01 PM
BREAKING: Robert Mueller's Special Counsel Report is Finally Done
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2019/03/22/breaking-robert-muellers-special-counsel-report-is-finally-done-n2543538

I predict Mueller will be label a Russian spy by libs and the MSM if nothing come out of this mess.
If there's no evidence Trump is a Russian operative, that will be proof that his treason is hidden SO well that MULTIPLE CONGRESSIONAL INVESTIGATIONS RUN BY DEMOCRATS ARE NEEDED TO UNCOVER THE TRUTH!!

And these investigations will last through the end of Trump's second term - and beyond. (Or until Dems lose the House again.)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on March 22, 2019, 02:13:30 PM
So the final report is in ... but not out. Mueller submitted it to Barr, who is "reviewing" it.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/mueller-sends-report-trump-investigation-ag-barr-n974006

Quote
"I am reviewing this report and anticipate that I may be in a position to advise you of the Special Counsel's principal conclusions as soon as this weekend," Barr wrote in a letter on Friday to a group of lawmakers on the House and Senate judiciary committees.

 ??? A report that took two years to compile doesn't include an executive summary that spells out the principal conclusions?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on March 22, 2019, 02:22:33 PM
??? A report that took two years to compile doesn't include an executive summary that spells out the principal conclusions?

Mueller's dog ate it.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 22, 2019, 02:32:15 PM
Mueller's dog ate it.


Russian Spaniel?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on March 22, 2019, 02:37:02 PM
More likely a Bolonka.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on March 22, 2019, 02:58:17 PM
(https://s.hdnux.com/photos/01/01/21/54/17111855/3/1024x1024.jpg)


(https://s.hdnux.com/photos/01/01/21/54/17111857/3/1024x1024.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 22, 2019, 05:06:43 PM
Oh, Brother: Schiff Is Already Preparing to Subpoena These People Over The Mueller Probe
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2019/03/22/schiff-and-friends-were-prepared-to-subpoena-mueller-and-barr-if-need-be-n2543576


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on March 22, 2019, 05:15:14 PM
As if on cue ...

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/msnbcs-chris-matthews-livid-over-mueller-report-how-could-they-let-trump-off-the-hook



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 22, 2019, 06:54:13 PM
As if on cue ...

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/msnbcs-chris-matthews-livid-over-mueller-report-how-could-they-let-trump-off-the-hook


(https://media1.tenor.com/images/147b4efa44e99ee8be152051c514d744/tenor.gif?itemid=7642189)

 :rofl:

I've heard a lot of talk about how Lefties live in a much different bubble from the rest of us (we like our own bubble, thank you). Matthews' ranting is the most graphic example of that I've seen. He's obviously convinced that Mueller is going to bring Trump down for collusion, and it never occurs to him that there may be no crime to charge anyone with, or any evidence of the hypothetical crime.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 22, 2019, 07:03:35 PM
So the final report is in ... but not out. Mueller submitted it to Barr, who is "reviewing" it.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/mueller-sends-report-trump-investigation-ag-barr-n974006

 ??? A report that took two years to compile doesn't include an executive summary that spells out the principal conclusions?

It might, but perhaps the Attorney General of the United States is expected to read the whole thing, and reach his own conclusions about what's inside.

I heard reporting earlier today that the White House has asked to see the report before it's released. They probably want to be prepared, so they can get out in front of whatever's in there. Maybe that's why Barr is stalling.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: bedlamite on March 22, 2019, 07:52:58 PM

I've heard a lot of talk about how Lefties live in a much different bubble from the rest of us

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/scientist-may-have-discovered-alternate-universesyes-really_us_563a1212e4b0307f2cab4d14


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 23, 2019, 04:38:57 AM
For some reason my coffee tastes extra sweet this morning

(http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x383/WLJohnson1/Politics/20180607_152611-RS_zps8btg5jap.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: 230RN on March 23, 2019, 06:09:38 AM
Every once in a while I have to remind myself that hyperlibs / Communists  figure that anything, anything at all,which tends to disrupt the current system is a good thing to them.

Because Communism / socialism thrives on stressed political systems.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 23, 2019, 07:13:04 AM
https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1109356876578213888/photo/1

(http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x383/WLJohnson1/Politics/D2U6MxfVYAUZs3T_zpsjnb3jkl9.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 23, 2019, 07:21:56 AM
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2019/03/23/brian-krassenstein-denies-these-tweets-have-aged-horribly-holds-out-hope-for-trump-family-indictments/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 23, 2019, 07:54:27 AM
Up until a few days ago: "It's Mueller Time! The entire Trump regime is going down!"

Today: "Mueller was always just a side show! The real action is with the New York AG!"


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 23, 2019, 10:02:13 AM
Dems now turning on their hero Mueller. Also it turns out he's a Russian agent.  :rofl:

These people and their "everybody is a ruskie" stuff.  ;/

https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2019/03/23/there-it-is-house-dems-set-sights-on-robert-mueller-as-many-predicted/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 23, 2019, 10:31:09 AM
Quote

    Currently watching a CNN crew confront Mueller in his driveway, asking him if he's a Russian agent.

    — BT (@back_ttys) March 22, 2019

 :rofl:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 23, 2019, 10:36:44 AM
(https://media.makeameme.org/created/mueller-you-jerk.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: 230RN on March 23, 2019, 12:01:16 PM

https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1109356876578213888/photo/1

(http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x383/WLJohnson1/Politics/D2U6MxfVYAUZs3T_zpsjnb3jkl9.jpg)


I am highly amused by the  cartoonist's inclusion of the Heinz ketchup bottle.

Terry, 230RN


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 23, 2019, 12:16:54 PM
Quote
CNN reports:

    Democratic presidential candidate Beto O’Rourke said Saturday that he believes “beyond the shadow of a doubt” President Donald Trump colluded with Russia to influence the 2016 election, stopping short of saying Trump should face impeachment proceedings.

    “You have a president, who, in my opinion, beyond the shadow of a doubt, sought to — however ham-handedly — collude with the Russian government — a foreign power — to undermine and influence our elections,” O’Rourke said at a town hall in Charleston, South Carolina.

If it was done “ham-handedly,” wouldn’t Robert Mueller have found plenty of evidence of collusion?
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2019/03/23/robert-francis-orourke-goes-full-beto-says-trump-colluded-with-russia-beyond-a-shadow-of-a-doubt/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 23, 2019, 01:15:17 PM
Dems now turning on their hero Mueller. Also it turns out he's a Russian agent.  :rofl:

These people and their "everybody is a ruskie" stuff.  ;/

https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2019/03/23/there-it-is-house-dems-set-sights-on-robert-mueller-as-many-predicted/

 :facepalm:

After hearing/reading a little Mollie Hemingway and Andrew C. McCarthy, I came to realize that our politics has become a game of dueling conspiracy theories. One side believes the President conspired with Russia, the other side believes the Feds conspired with the Democratic Party (the latter is correct). This is just further evidence of such. Mueller spends 2 years, and millions on this investigation, and says there's no conspiracy - well then he must be in on the conspiracy. Classic conspiracy-monger "thinking."


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on March 23, 2019, 01:26:21 PM
Anyone that has had the time to follow the evidence as it has been revealed has known, almost from the start, that this was all a farce / coup attempt .  Amazingly the plotters left written evidence everywhere … They all expected Hillary to win and failed to cover their tracks.  That said, so many ordinary folks know the truth and have seen the evidence that I can't believe that all politicians both Red and Blue, all news casters, and all of TV's talking heads didn't know it was all a lie.  President Trump has been attacked because he is standing up for the American taxpayer and has gotten between America's wealth and those who want a part of it. I'm sure that for many politicians the resistance to Pres Trump has been self preservation.   The fact that so many ordinary folks are proving to be useful idiots is the thing that surprises me … massive exercise in brain washing.  They hate because they are told to hate.  
 [popcorn]


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on March 23, 2019, 10:57:34 PM
Ken Starr (remember him?) has produced a very interesting analysis of the situation. Not of the contents of the report, but of what is supposed to be done (and what is NOT supposed to be done) with the report.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/03/ken-starr-muellers-report-shouldnt-go-congress/585577/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 04:12:47 AM
It's the end!

Quote
O’Rourke warned that America may not see another year if details of Russian interference in the 2016 election included in the Mueller report are not made public, saying, “This is an unprecedented attack on this country and on our democracy, and we are owed the facts. And if we do not receive them, 243 years in, there’s nothing that guarantees us a 244th.”
Beto O’Rourke: If Mueller Report Is Held, America May Not See 244th Year
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/03/23/beto-orourke-if-mueller-report-is-held-america-may-not-see-244th-year/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 04:21:10 AM
And apparently it was never about Russian collusion because, you know, no evidence of Russian collusion was found I guess.  :facepalm:

Lara Logan: Media Created False Impression Mueller Indictments Were for Russia Collusion
https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2019/03/23/lara-logan-media-created-false-impression-mueller-indictments-russia-collusion/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 24, 2019, 04:23:40 AM
Ken Starr (remember him?) has produced a very interesting analysis of the situation. Not of the contents of the report, but of what is supposed to be done (and what is NOT supposed to be done) with the report.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/03/ken-starr-muellers-report-shouldnt-go-congress/585577/

It would be very interesting to see the reaction of progressives if this were handled in the same way the Starr report was handled post-report.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 24, 2019, 04:27:01 AM

Lara Logan: Media Created False Impression Mueller Indictments Were for Russia Collusion
https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2019/03/23/lara-logan-media-created-false-impression-mueller-indictments-russia-collusion/

Slight tangent, but it has been interesting to me to see how this woman is suddenly being trashed in the media. One minute she's a CBS star reporter, then the minute she questions the MSM, she's a nutjob hack. Sort of like what happened to Sheryl Attkinson.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 04:34:46 AM
Slight tangent, but it has been interesting to me to see how this woman is suddenly being trashed in the media. One minute she's a CBS star reporter, then the minute she questions the MSM, she's a nutjob hack. Sort of like what happened to Sheryl Attkinson.

I consider it an example of just how quickly the left can turn on their own and throw a once useful useful idiot under the bus.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on March 24, 2019, 05:01:49 AM
Today: "Mueller was always just a side show! The real action is with the New York AG!"

Andrew McCarthy has been saying that for awhile now
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/02/sdny-investigation-real-peril-for-trump/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 06:51:20 AM
Good Morning, Have A Great Day!
Aaaaaaand then all hell breaks loose

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1109787378242240514?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on March 24, 2019, 08:06:20 AM
It would be very interesting to see the reaction of progressives if this were handled in the same way the Starr report was handled post-report.

As Starr's article points out, though, the regulations have changed since his report, so if Mueller's report is handled the same -- it will be a violation of the law.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 09:52:37 AM
The excuses so far I've hear so far

The investigation was too limited.
The investigation didn't have enough time.
The investigation wasn't handled right.
No evidence was found of Russian collusion because the investigation was never actually looking for Russian collusion.
Evidence of Russian collusion was not found because of Russian collusion.
Mueller is a Russian Agent

Did I leave any out?

Putin must be laughing his arse off at us.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on March 24, 2019, 09:57:27 AM
There is one school of thought that Pres. Trump wants the report made public even more than the dems.  He is giving them the chance to make fools of themselves clamoring for transparency so that when he shows them that transparency works two ways that there will be little they can say about it.  Things are either gonna get real interesting or real frustrating … stay tuned …

 [popcorn]


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 10:23:24 AM
There is one school of thought that Pres. Trump wants the report made public even more than the dems.  He is giving them the chance to make fools of themselves clamoring for transparency so that when he shows them that transparency works two ways that there will be little they can say about it.  Things are either gonna get real interesting or real frustrating … stay tuned …

 [popcorn]

Watch the dems do whatever they can to keep the report private and then blame Trump for that.  I'm sure the MSM would gladly play along.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on March 24, 2019, 10:41:58 AM
It's time for Trump to have the Justice Department appoint a special investigator to look into the DNC's contacts with the Rooshans during the campaign. IMHO, there's a lot more to suggest actual collusion on the part of the Democrats than there ever could be to show collusion on the part of Trump and his campaign.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on March 24, 2019, 12:27:35 PM
It’s official.

No evidence of collusion.

The AG sees no evidence of obstruction of justice so no investigation or charges forthcoming.

Trump wins. Again.




Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: RoadKingLarry on March 24, 2019, 12:29:07 PM
Is that crying I hear on the wind?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6845121/Justice-Department-says-Mueller-report-does-not-exonerate-President-Trump.html (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6845121/Justice-Department-says-Mueller-report-does-not-exonerate-President-Trump.html)

As to the "obstruction" bullshit, if there was no underlying crime what the *expletive deleted*ck would they have been guilty of obstructing?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on March 24, 2019, 02:51:42 PM
I had the misfortune of having to work today.

For some god awful reason I have the inability to change the channel on the TV in the grooming room, and I was stuck sitting around in the grooming room for most the morning.

Meet the Press made my blood pressure rise. In fact, this whole week has been hell on me, what with that retarded The Today Show.

I had hoped... I know it was futile, but I had hoped that this would *finally* get them to STFU about Russia, but it hasn't. If anything, it's made the liberal news double down on this *expletive deleted*it.
What's worse is that they were talking today that the report *might* show evidence that, though there is no collusion with Russia, there was collusion with other countries.  :facepalm: So basically, they're setting up that Trump was colluding with some other country instead of Russia and then they'll scream about that for two years.

As far as I can tell, Trump's only "colluded" with supermodels and rich party people, and that wasn't to win any election...


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 02:54:38 PM
What's worse is that they were talking today that the report *might* show evidence that, though there is no collusion with Russia, there was collusion with other countries.  :facepalm: So basically, they're setting up that Trump was colluding with some other country instead of Russia and then they'll scream about that for two years.


Trump is colluding with America, that is the worst crime someone can commit in the eyes of the left


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 24, 2019, 03:06:40 PM
Meanwhile
https://twitter.com/Comey/status/1109930531389472768/photo/1

 


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on March 24, 2019, 05:29:37 PM
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/54799930_10216303351351195_3746558817647722496_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&oh=8342b09205658bf229f9d75e3d838b9f&oe=5D01C16D)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on March 24, 2019, 05:35:31 PM
(https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/54458035_10157478135144239_1821552259377397760_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&oh=cd958f220bea62becc2ccfb8af7a6990&oe=5D08C98C)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 24, 2019, 07:00:13 PM
Quote
OUR COCKTAIL THIS WEEKEND IS THE MUELLER REPORT:  It costs millions to make, takes two years to be served. Rumors and expectations about it are stoked to fever pitch. Arrives as an empty glass.  Every news source claims it’s the finest Russian Vodka. Rachel Maddow most affected.

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/325372/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 24, 2019, 08:28:36 PM
 https://babylonbee.com/news/mueller-orders-trump-to-sit-on-scale-to-see-if-he-weighs-the-same-as-a-duck


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 06:49:41 AM
Still banging on that drum

Quote

    Fox's Henry Challenges Donna Brazile: Will You Now ‘Accept the President’ as Legitimate? https://t.co/5hCWWZLQjz pic.twitter.com/FXhzZ4Iq45

    — Mediaite (@Mediaite) March 24, 2019

    NO> Mueller confirmed that Russia helped him

    — Jennifer Rubin (@JRubinBlogger) March 24, 2019

Quote

    .@staceyabrams on the Mueller findings: “Until Mueller’s full report is released to the public, we may never know the extent to which Trump and his allies worked with Russia to alter the outcome of the 2016 election.” #gapol pic.twitter.com/R04kUSkNly

    — Greg Bluestein (@bluestein) March 24, 2019


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: BTR on March 25, 2019, 07:49:33 AM
I had the misfortune of having to work today.

For some god awful reason I have the inability to change the channel on the TV in the grooming room, and I was stuck sitting around in the grooming room for most the morning.


Sounds like you might need this:

https://smile.amazon.com/TV-B-Gone-Universal-TV-Control-Keychain/dp/B0006GD9CE/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=universal+tv+off&qid=1553528898&s=gateway&sr=8-1

I would like one.  I can't stand TV news.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 07:53:30 AM
Sounds like you might need this:

https://smile.amazon.com/TV-B-Gone-Universal-TV-Control-Keychain/dp/B0006GD9CE/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=universal+tv+off&qid=1553528898&s=gateway&sr=8-1

I would like one.  I can't stand TV news.

"With expert setup +$91.24 per unit"
It has one, count them, one button :facepalm:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 08:09:52 AM
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2019/03/25/you-have-been-exposed-rep-dan-crenshaw-just-brought-down-the-thunder-on-adam-schiff-and-daaamn-son/

Quote

    Mueller spent two years investigating obstruction of justice and found evidence that “does not exonerate” Trump. Barr took two days to set aside that evidence.

    The entire report must be published and evidence provided to Congress so the American people can judge for themselves.

    — Adam Schiff (@RepAdamSchiff) March 24, 2019
Quote

    Mueller did not find sufficient evidence to establish conspiracy, notwithstanding Russian offers to help Trump’s campaign, their acceptance, and a litany of concealed interactions with Russia.

    I trust Mueller’s prosecutorial judgement, but the country must see the evidence.

    — Adam Schiff (@RepAdamSchiff) March 24, 2019
Quote

    You. Have. Been. Exposed.

    Stop the charade. There was no collusion.

    You used your unique position on the Intel Cmte to convince the American people that you had access to evidence of collusion.

    You lied and misled in order to pursue your political agenda. Move on. https://t.co/9GRVkBmeVS

    — Dan Crenshaw (@DanCrenshawTX) March 25, 2019


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: brimic on March 25, 2019, 08:39:47 AM
Let's see those FISA warrants declassified now.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on March 25, 2019, 08:47:31 AM
Let's see those FISA warrants declassified now.
Yes. This.

Quote from: https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/03/trump-russia-investigation-mueller-report-full-disclosure-documents-testimony/
Well, if we’re going to have disclosure, fine. But let’s have full disclosure: Mueller’s report in addition to the FISA applications; the memoranda pertinent to the opening and continuation of the investigation; the testimony in secret hearings; the scope memorandum Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein issued on August 2, 2017, after failing to cite a crime when he appointed Mueller — let’s have all of it.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on March 25, 2019, 01:11:19 PM
Sounds like you might need this:

https://smile.amazon.com/TV-B-Gone-Universal-TV-Control-Keychain/dp/B0006GD9CE/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=universal+tv+off&qid=1553528898&s=gateway&sr=8-1

I would like one.  I can't stand TV news.

 :O

I want. I hate going to dinner with my mother when there is a tv in the restaurant. It produces this slack jaw effect that's really unbecoming.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 01:19:16 PM
The article goes on about some of what the report said about the FBI and it ain't good.

WSJ Columnist: This Is What's Being Glossed Over In The Mueller Report On Russian Collusion
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2019/03/25/wsj-columnist-this-is-whats-being-glossed-over-in-the-mueller-report-on-russian-collusion-n2543660

This was in there

Quote
    I never thought I’d see the day where Democrats are visibly upset that the President of The United States DIDN’T collude with the Russians.
    — Donald Trump Jr. (@DonaldJTrumpJr) March 25, 2019

How true.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on March 25, 2019, 01:36:45 PM
I have stood maybe three feet away from Junior, and I found him to be remarkably unimpressive in person. Basically, I have always thought of him as a jerk.

I may have to revise my opinion somewhat in an upward direction.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 01:55:28 PM
(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/03/24/12/11389556-6844325-image-a-15_1553431318743.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 25, 2019, 01:56:18 PM
I found this fascinating:

https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/435552-apologies-to-president-trump

Not that Sharyl Attkinson wrote it, as she seems to be a standup gal, but that The Hill of all outlets actually published it. It's getting kinda chilly down here in hell.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on March 25, 2019, 02:04:53 PM
New York Post: https://nypost.com/2019/03/24/we-should-all-be-celebrating-the-collapse-of-hillarys-big-lie/

Quote
No American — not a single one — took the Russian bait. And that includes every member of the Trump campaign.

That is a fact worthy of celebration, for it shows our democracy is strong and our institutions uncompromised.

Other implications of the report’s findings are also enormous.

We now know that Hillary Clinton and her supporters misled the country in claiming that the White House was stolen from her. She started the Russia, Russia, Russia hoax and her claims, aided by the Obama White House and magnified by a thoroughly partisan media, set in motion a wild-goose chase.

The chase undermined a duly elected president and cost taxpayers more than $30 million for an investigation that proved the accusations were flat-out false.

Quote
Let’s remember, too, that her campaign actually did work with Russians, through FusionGPS and British agent Christopher Steele, to create a fictional scenario about Trump being compromised.

{Edit to add}

Quote
Yet as I wrote Sunday, the end of Mueller must not mean the end of investigating what happened in 2016. It was, after all, the Clinton-financed Russian dossier that formed the basis of the FBI investigation launched by the disgraced James Comey that summer.

How did that happen? How did a partisan dirty trick result in an FBI probe of the other party’s presidential candidate?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 25, 2019, 02:07:12 PM
New York Post: https://nypost.com/2019/03/24/we-should-all-be-celebrating-the-collapse-of-hillarys-big-lie/


It will be interesting to see if the MSM, to deflect from their own culpability, will now make people on the left, like Clinton, scapegoats.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on March 25, 2019, 02:16:46 PM
I will be interesting to see if the MSM, to deflect from their own culpability, will now make people on the left, like Clinton, scapegoats.

Not if they want to avoid being suicided.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 02:22:30 PM
It will be interesting to see if the MSM, to deflect from their own culpability, will now make people on the left, like Clinton, scapegoats.

They'll just stop talking about it and within a week most Americans will totally forget about it and then it's on to the next made up crises. 


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 25, 2019, 05:35:28 PM
I can understand if he feels that maybe there's some classified material in it that shouldn't be released but either way it's not going to play well in the media   

McConnell Blocks Resolution To Make Full Mueller Report Public
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2019/03/25/mcconnell-blocks-resolution-to-make-full-mueller-report-public-n2543730


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: 230RN on March 25, 2019, 11:04:15 PM
=D


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on March 26, 2019, 04:06:21 AM
maybe there's some classified material in it that shouldn't be released

That's always been the excuse.  :mad:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on March 26, 2019, 04:10:08 AM
As we listen to the BS being shouted by the Pundits and Politicians I think it's important to remember that anyone over the position of janitor knew this was all a pack of lies made up and spread to hurt the President and his MAGA agenda .  Some may be surprised that President Trump is so clean that Mueller didn't find a way to make things up about him, but the truth about Russia has been known by all from the start.  Does anyone think if Mueller could have found anything bad we wouldn't have heard about it.

 [popcorn]


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on March 26, 2019, 04:12:20 AM
Earlier I read that Sarah Sanders used the word treason in describing some of what has occurred.

Now I ran across a link that quotes President Trump using the word treason to describe what some people engaged in during the collusion mass mania.

Maybe more heads are going to roll at the FBI, Justice Dept. and other agencies, we can only hope.

Looks like the adults may actually be in charge and criminals will be held to account, maybe even for treason.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/03/25/donald-trump-robert-mueller-investigate-left-evil-things/


https://www.marketwatch.com/story/sarah-sanders-says-mueller-probe-accusations-were-equal-to-treason-in-heated-interview-with-savannah-guthrie-2019-03-25






Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on March 26, 2019, 04:17:14 AM
Had I just participated in a failed coup attempt I think I'd be keeping a very low profile … It's never smart to double down on stupid but when your Freedom is at stake would be a good time to clam up.  Thankfully nobody ever accused the LEFT of being smart and clamming up isn't in their DNA.

 :rofl:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: makattak on March 26, 2019, 04:56:48 AM
Had I just participated in a failed coup attempt I think I'd be keeping a very low profile … It's never smart to double down on stupid but when your Freedom is at stake would be a good time to clam up.  Thankfully nobody ever accused the LEFT of being smart and clamming up isn't in their DNA.

 :rofl:

They believe that the old rules apply, namely, that the rules don't apply to them.

So far, they haven't been proven wrong on that count.


Title: Re: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on March 26, 2019, 05:06:04 AM
They believe that the old rules apply, namely, that the rules don't apply to them.

So far, they haven't been proven wrong on that count.
The window of discourse has broadened.

The President and press secretary using the word treason is huge.

To me, its looked like treason for a while.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on March 26, 2019, 05:14:40 AM
They believe that the old rules apply, namely, that the rules don't apply to them.

So far, they haven't been proven wrong on that count.


Agreed … Witness how blatantly Avanatti tried to shake down Nike … he thought he was untouchable.  Might have worked if he had tried his ham handed tactics w/ a less Left Leaning company than NIKE …. Would he have been stopped if the company he attempted to scam had been a firearm company ?  He got away with being a scumbag for a long time ... perhaps a failure of victim selection.
 [popcorn]


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on March 26, 2019, 05:36:20 AM
Wow. I'm reading one article this morning that the NYT has an editorial about dems needing to stop doing this stuff, and another article about John Brennan backpedaling and using the "I was fed false information" excuse.

Lots more similar stuff out there. I think Covington, Smollett, and now this all in a short timeframe has created enough blowback that many on the left, and in the MSM (bit I repeat myself) are scared that they have cried "wolf!" one too many times.

I'm thinking it's already too late, and they still have a commie contingent that is full bore on resistance and socialism. I saw this morning that Kamala Harris bucked the trend of the current dem presidential pack and said something nice about Jews. She was immediately attacked by the fringe left.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Mike Irwin on March 26, 2019, 05:40:27 AM
Even that gun grabbing *expletive deleted*che bag Piers Morgan is saying this whole Russian collusion thing was crap, and by continuing it the Dems are handing Trump the 2020 election.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 26, 2019, 05:48:30 AM
Even that gun grabbing *expletive deleted*che bag Piers Morgan is saying this whole Russian collusion thing was crap, and by continuing it the Dems are handing Trump the 2020 election.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Mike Irwin on March 26, 2019, 06:09:29 AM
Even a broken clock is right twice a day

Unless it's a digital clock, and then it's just likely blank...


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: RocketMan on March 26, 2019, 06:19:17 AM
The whole notion of any Democrats being held accountable for their almost treasonous behavior by the spineless leadership of The Stupid Party is laughable.   :rofl:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 26, 2019, 08:13:43 AM
That's always been the excuse.  :mad:

I thought current regulations were that an independent counsel report can't be made public.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/22/us/politics/trump-mueller-report.html
Quote
Although there have been high-profile exceptions, the Justice Department generally does not publish derogatory information about individuals not charged with crimes. As a result, it is not clear how much information, if any, Mr. Barr would choose to include about Mr. Trump and other key figures in the investigation if there are no charges against them.



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on March 26, 2019, 08:17:49 AM
The whole notion of any Democrats being held accountable for their almost treasonous behavior by the spineless leadership of The Stupid Party is laughable.   :rofl:

Hope springs eternal   =)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: brimic on March 26, 2019, 08:45:18 AM
Both Trump and Huckabee-Sanders dropped the word 'Treason' multiple times on social media over the last few days.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on March 26, 2019, 09:01:00 AM
I thought current regulations were that an independent counsel report can't be made public.

There is no requirement it be made public but the president has claimed he wants it released and the house has indicated the same.
https://theweek.com/speedreads/829157/house-votes-4200-make-muellers-report-public
Quote from: Rep. Will Hurd (R-Tex.)
“I want the American people to know as much as they can and to see as much as they can. The taxpayers paid millions for this information, and they should get to see all of it.”
I don't have any polling handy but from what I've seen the public at large feels the same way.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 26, 2019, 01:15:31 PM
(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/FB_IMG_1553608796280.jpg)

(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/Collusion.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 26, 2019, 09:01:37 PM
Today in memes that didn't age well:


(http://politicalpunchline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/trump-mueller-bad-news.jpg)



(https://pics.onsizzle.com/to-bob-mueller-please-hurry-america-were-waiting-for-the-27423977.png)



(https://i0.wp.com/skepticreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/DVHMF6DU0AEUWFK.jpg?resize=300%2C290)



(http://memecrunch.com/meme/BVWOU/mueller-maga-meme/image.png?w=400&c=1)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 26, 2019, 09:10:16 PM
(https://screenshotscdn.firefoxusercontent.com/images/b0be32bf-e2ea-4d6d-96ea-a4bca8b2d3d2.png)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 27, 2019, 04:23:59 AM
Yeah, I googled "mueller meme" and had a good laugh the other day.
Just did it again and I could swear a bunch of the anti Trump ones have disappeared


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 27, 2019, 09:50:25 AM
https://taibbi.substack.com/p/russiagate-is-wmd-times-a-million

A long-ish read. I haven't finished it yet.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on March 27, 2019, 10:02:33 AM
Is it possible that the President called the Mueller investigation a witch hunt because Mueller was also looking into Hillary …  :angel:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on March 27, 2019, 11:05:47 AM
Hitler finds out the Mueller investigation is over:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cVsmuxOj28



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on March 27, 2019, 11:10:34 AM
Hitler finds out the Mueller investigation is over:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cVsmuxOj28


Has that become the new version of Godwin's Law?  Not just a comparrison to Nazi's, but recycling the Hitler movie scene. 


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: brimic on March 27, 2019, 11:37:12 AM
Today in memes that didn't age well:


(http://politicalpunchline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/trump-mueller-bad-news.jpg)



(https://pics.onsizzle.com/to-bob-mueller-please-hurry-america-were-waiting-for-the-27423977.png)



Duh. The left can't meme.

(https://i0.wp.com/skepticreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/DVHMF6DU0AEUWFK.jpg?resize=300%2C290)



(http://memecrunch.com/meme/BVWOU/mueller-maga-meme/image.png?w=400&c=1)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: RoadKingLarry on March 27, 2019, 05:00:29 PM
Today in memes that didn't age well:



(http://memecrunch.com/meme/BVWOU/mueller-maga-meme/image.png?w=400&c=1)

MAGA - Mueller Ain't Got Anything!


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: 230RN on March 27, 2019, 09:24:50 PM
Per Angel Eyes' link:

https://youtu.be/7cVsmuxOj28 (3:59)

"It's OK, Anna.  We still have Joe Biden."  (2:55 and following)

:rofl:



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 28, 2019, 04:29:01 AM
https://townhall.com/political-cartoons/2019/03/26/164368
(https://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/mrz032619dAPR_A20190326104912.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: 230RN on March 28, 2019, 08:23:27 AM
So tell me, did any of those people who threatened to leave the U.S. if this or that happened actually leave after the aforesaid this or that actually happened?

That would be the best thing ever.



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 31, 2019, 06:29:48 AM
(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/B81ED437-14AD-4F3E-A780-B3E0BA8AB549.jpeg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on March 31, 2019, 06:33:21 AM
So tell me, did any of those people who threatened to leave the U.S. if this or that happened actually leave after the aforesaid this or that actually happened?

That would be the best thing ever.



When they said leave they were using the word “colloquially” for public consumption


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 31, 2019, 06:34:08 AM
When they said leave they were using the word “colloquially,” for public consumption

 :laugh:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on March 31, 2019, 09:15:35 AM
(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/Screen-Shot-2019-03-30-at-1.09.20-PM.png)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 18, 2019, 07:48:51 AM
From the AP

Quote
The two-volume, 448-page report recounts how Trump repeatedly sought to take control of the Russia probe.

Mueller evaluated 10 episodes for possible obstruction of justice, including Trump's firing of FBI Director James Comey, the president's directive to subordinates to have Mueller fired and efforts to encourage witnesses not to cooperate.
Trump tried to seize control of Mueller probe, report says
http://www.wave3.com/2019/04/18/barr-discuss-redacted-mueller-report-before-releasing-it/

And then from Fox

Quote
The special counsel also reviewed whether the president had obstructed justice in any way, but ultimately did not come to a conclusion on that issue. Barr and Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, though, said the evidence was “not sufficient to establish that the President committed an obstruction-of-justice offense.”
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/justice-department-releases-redacted-version-of-special-counsels-russia-probe-report

(https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/t/undecided-two-executives-different-view-opinion-direction-isolated-white-background-51423362.jpg)



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 18, 2019, 07:58:29 AM
CNN Panel: Barr Repeating 'No Collusion' So Often Was Very 'Suspicious'
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/cortneyobrien/2019/04/18/cnn-panel-barr-repeating-no-collusion-so-often-was-very-suspicious-n2545007

Quote
Not so fast, according to a CNN panel, which was moderated by Jake Tapper. Tapper noted that while Americans "should be happy" our president did not conspire with the Kremlin, Barr's repeating that fact six or seven times was rather "obsessive."

CNN legal analyst Laura Coates took it to the next level by noting it was "suspicious."

 :facepalm:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: TommyGunn on April 18, 2019, 08:23:35 AM
IT'S OVER!!!!!!  =D [tinfoil]




....except it's not. :mad:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Angel Eyes on April 18, 2019, 10:09:24 AM
Now Eric "I'll nuke gun owners" Swalwell is demanding Barr's resignation:

https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2019/04/18/you-first-bro-rep-eric-swalwell-makes-this-demand-of-ag-barr-annnd-we-are-officially-so-dead/

... apparently because the Mueller report didn't say what he wanted.



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on April 18, 2019, 10:33:18 AM
Now Eric "I'll nuke gun owners" Swalwell is demanding Barr's resignation:

https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2019/04/18/you-first-bro-rep-eric-swalwell-makes-this-demand-of-ag-barr-annnd-we-are-officially-so-dead/

... apparently because the Mueller report didn't say what he wanted.



Translation: I'm running for president. Please notice me! I'm cool, like Mayor Pete!


Quote
He’s lost the credibility of the American people.

English language much?

Quote
He’s not recused from an investigation where he should be recused. He’s embedded deeply into the Trump team. And that affects the credibility that the attorney general must have.

That's right. Barr is so deeply embedded in the "Trump team" that he's the Attorney General!!


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 18, 2019, 10:40:16 AM
Well you know, the fact that there isn't proof in the report that there WASN'T collusion proves there was collusion.

 


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 18, 2019, 10:47:05 AM
Wouldn't Mueller be screaming his head off if anything was remotely fishy with Barr's presentation?


Oh that's right, Mueller is a Russian agent now.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on April 18, 2019, 10:55:22 AM
This ^^^^


So IIRC, Putin spent about $325,000 on FB ads, Figure another $300,000 for the folks creating the fake FB groups.

So for ~$600,000 Putin accomplished his goal of splitting this country in two.

That's a pretty good ROI on a disruption operation.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: grampster on April 18, 2019, 01:05:51 PM
Now the implication is that the 30,000 e mails sent by Hillary weren't Hillary's e-mails at all.  They were constructs of the Russian hacking and they sent them over her unsecured server.  Hillary didn't delete them, the Russians did to make her look even worse.   That implication was given birth when Barr said that there were "no Americans" involved in any collusion.  Sigh.....


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on April 18, 2019, 03:02:17 PM
Quote
He’s lost the credibility of the American people.

It doesn't matter unless the American people realize their credibility has been misplaced, and start asking for it back.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on April 18, 2019, 03:24:49 PM
On a slight tangent. So annoyed by NBC.

The other day, I found out about Notre Dame because I checked my FB. I was at work, sitting right in front of the TV and I learned that one of the most famous buildings in the world was burning down because I checked FB.

Today? They had NBC Special News Report breaking into the regularly programmed shows a good 10 minutes BEFORE the actual release.  :facepalm:

And they wonder why people doubt their reporting...


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 18, 2019, 05:57:02 PM
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2019/04/18/ratio-party-wapo-correspondent-says-mueller-report-proves-most-reporting-was-on-the-mark/
Quote

    This report makes clear that the vast amount of reporting by mainstream outlets about Trump and Russia was on the mark.

    — Philip Bump (@pbump) April 18, 2019

 :rofl:




Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 19, 2019, 06:04:06 AM
Heeeeere's Yathmuth

Quote
“Today, Attorney General Barr made clear that he does not serve the American people, as law dictates, but instead the political expediencies of President Trump. The Mueller report makes clear that investigators did not feel they had the authority to bring charges against a sitting president, and contrary to the show put on by the Attorney General today, explicitly did not exonerate President Trump. Rather, the report paints a disturbing picture of our nation’s president, laying out 10 very compelling cases for Congress to pursue. It is the responsibility and indeed the Constitutional obligation of this Congress to analyze this report and upcoming testimony from the Attorney General and Special Counsel, and then take any necessary action to restore integrity to the executive branch.”

Spin, Spin, Spin!

Congressman Yarmuth speaks out on redacted Mueller report
http://www.wave3.com/2019/04/19/congressman-yarmuth-speaks-out-redacted-mueller-report/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 19, 2019, 07:52:59 AM
More from within the MSM bubble

Long story short: According to NBC the report flat out says Trump is a criminal.
To me the whole article reads like someone at NBC needs a doughnut ring seat pad to sit on.

President Donald Trump has evaded criminal charges — but special counsel Robert Mueller’s report is a brutal indictment of his campaign and his presidency.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/mueller-didnt-charge-trump-—-but-his-report-is-a-brutal-indictment/ar-BBW66nY?ocid=spartandhp (https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/mueller-didnt-charge-trump-—-but-his-report-is-a-brutal-indictment/ar-BBW66nY?ocid=spartandhp)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 19, 2019, 08:09:49 AM
NYTs and WaPo headlines https://twitter.com/PoliticalShort/status/1119190251476529152?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
 :facepalm:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 19, 2019, 09:16:35 AM
Heeeeere's Chucky

Quote

    The Mueller report shows how dense the Trump swamp is, how dishonest this president is, and how erratic this administration is.

    It’s no wonder the middle class is not making progress under this administration.

    — Chuck Schumer (@SenSchumer) April 19, 2019
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2019/04/19/thats-your-takeaway-chuck-schumers-middle-class-spin-on-the-mueller-report-shows-how-truly-desperate-the-dems-are/

I'm running out of popcorn, hope Costco still has some.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on April 19, 2019, 09:18:08 AM
And talk about stepping on a rake
Note the writer

Quote

    If you see CliffsNotes written by William Barr, I suggest you don’t trust them. Better read the original.

    — Dan Rather (@DanRather) April 19, 2019


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: bedlamite on April 20, 2019, 08:03:09 AM
I seem to recall saying that the Mueller report might just dig up some dirt on the D party ...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/19/opinions/mueller-report-obama-jennings/index.html

And if that's the best CNN can spin it ...


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on April 20, 2019, 08:40:16 AM
I seem to recall saying that the Mueller report might just dig up some dirt on the D party ...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/19/opinions/mueller-report-obama-jennings/index.html

And if that's the best CNN can spin it ...

Quote
Why did Obama go soft on Russia? My opinion is that it was because he was singularly focused on the nuclear deal with Iran. Obama wanted Putin in the deal, and to stand up to him on election interference would have, in Obama's estimation, upset that negotiation. This turned out to be a disastrous policy decision.

My take is because Obama knew the Clinton campaign was colluding with the Russians, and he wanted/expected Clinton to win so he turned a blind eye to the collusion.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on May 02, 2019, 06:29:50 PM
AG Barr looks to be the hero here. Great article that describes him as the assassin brought in to end the Mueller investigation.

 https://humanevents.com/2019/05/01/checkmate/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 02, 2019, 07:32:29 PM
AG Barr looks to be the hero here. Great article that describes him as the assassin brought in to end the Mueller investigation.

 https://humanevents.com/2019/05/01/checkmate/


Is there any way to read the article without subscribing?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on May 03, 2019, 03:48:56 AM
Most people heard "No Collusion" and took that to mean "No Collusion".

Causing this:   CNN's ratings crater, drop 26% in April (https://www.forbes.com/sites/markjoyella/2019/04/30/cnn-drops-26-percent-in-prime-time-as-fox-news-dominates-april-cable-ratings/#36402893c59a)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on May 03, 2019, 04:13:20 AM
Is there any way to read the article without subscribing?

They must be punishing you for your high security. They let me right in.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: dogmush on May 03, 2019, 04:39:22 AM
Is there any way to read the article without subscribing?
just above the upper right corner of the big red box that wants you to subscribe is a little grayed out "X".  That gets you out of the subscribe popup and lets you read the article.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on May 03, 2019, 05:30:24 AM
AG Barr looks to be the hero here. Great article that describes him as the assassin brought in to end the Mueller investigation.

 https://humanevents.com/2019/05/01/checkmate/

Interesting read.  It needed to be done.  I imagine it would be difficult to move forward with the reelection campaign and other issues with that hanging out there.  It was actually hard for me to believe that people actually thought Mueller had evidence that would sink Trump, but they apparently did.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 03, 2019, 06:15:27 PM
Interesting read.  It needed to be done.  I imagine it would be difficult to move forward with the reelection campaign and other issues with that hanging out there.  It was actually hard for me to believe that people actually thought Mueller evidence that would sink Trump, but they apparently did.

Some of them still think so.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on May 03, 2019, 08:21:40 PM
Some of them still think so.

They think Mueller (and apparently also Rosenstein) was somehow compromised. Which is pretty funny, considering all the incentives run in the other direction.

Also, Comey thinks Trump got to Barr, somehow. Nevermind that Barr was defending Trump from obstruction charges before Sessions even resigned...


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on May 06, 2019, 01:20:35 PM
(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/TrumpWallMuellerReport.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on May 08, 2019, 07:27:03 PM
https://www.dailywire.com/news/46962/democrats-vote-hold-ag-barr-contempt-heres-what-ryan-saavedra


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 08, 2019, 09:12:10 PM
https://www.dailywire.com/news/46962/democrats-vote-hold-ag-barr-contempt-heres-what-ryan-saavedra

Pot, allow me to introduce Kettle.

Sauce ==> goose ==> gander.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 29, 2019, 07:46:58 AM
He really is done

Quote
"I'm speaking out today because our investigation is complete," Mueller said. "We are formally closing the Special Counsel's office and I am resigning from the Department of Justice to return private life."
Quote
"I hope and expect this to be the only time that I will speak to you in this manner. I am making that decision myself," Mueller said. "I do not believe it is appropriate for me to speak further about the investigation."

"The report is my testimony...Our written work speaks for itself," he continued. "Any testimony would not go beyond our report...We chose those words carefully."

But then he throws the media a bone

Quote
"I will close by reiterating the central allegation of our indictments, that there were multiple, systematic efforts to interfere in our election. And that allegation deserves the attention of every American,” Mueller said.

Mueller: The Special Counsel Report Speaks for Itself, I'm Not Commenting Further
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2019/05/29/robert-mueller-statement-n2547007


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 29, 2019, 07:56:22 AM
From the AP
In short: No evidence proves he's guilty 

Quote
WASHINGTON (AP) — Special counsel Robert Mueller said Wednesday he believed he was constitutionally barred from charging President Donald Trump with a crime but pointedly emphasized that his report did not exonerate the president. He cautioned lawmakers who have been negotiating for his public testimony that he would not go beyond his report in the event he appears before Congress.
Quote
Trump, who has repeatedly and falsely claimed that Mueller's report cleared him of obstruction of justice, modified that contention somewhat shortly after the special counsel's remarks. He tweeted, "There was insufficient evidence and therefore, in our Country, a person is innocent. The case is closed!"

Mueller: Special counsel probe did not exonerate Trump
https://www.wdrb.com/news/national/mueller-special-counsel-probe-did-not-exonerate-trump/article_8d8d0ae7-4146-5eca-8223-bd94090dba17.html


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on May 29, 2019, 08:37:50 AM
It really isn't the prosecutor's job to exonerate someone. 


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: HankB on May 29, 2019, 09:20:30 AM
It really isn't the prosecutor's job to exonerate someone. 
And proof of innocence can be difficult to establish - for example, how many people who drive the typical 10k - 20k miles per year can prove they never exceeded the speed limit in 2016?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: RoadKingLarry on May 29, 2019, 09:45:32 AM
It really isn't the prosecutor's job to exonerate someone. 

Unless the prosecutor is Comey and the someone is Hillary...


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 29, 2019, 10:01:00 AM
Comey doesn't want to go out like a kamikaze


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on May 29, 2019, 12:04:32 PM
They are all but coming out and daring Nancy to pull the trigger on impeachment.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on May 29, 2019, 12:49:45 PM
He really is done


He may be done but the news media idiots aren't.  :facepalm:

How NBC managed to turn a 9 minute speech that could be summed up in less than two minutes into almost a full hour Special News Report is really obnoxious.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on May 29, 2019, 12:59:15 PM
He may be done but the news media idiots aren't.  :facepalm:

How NBC managed to turn a 9 minute speech that could be summed up in less than two minutes into almost a full hour Special News Report is really obnoxious.

Remember, these people don't understand summaries. They thought Barr's summary should have been the entire, non-redacted document.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: BobR on May 29, 2019, 01:17:29 PM
I am catching some of the fallout on the online news sources. The many Senators (D) are all calling for impeachment proceedings knowing that they will mostly be safe from the fallout because they aren't the one bringing it home, they will just be able to say we could not succeed because of the other side of the aisle. I think they think having the House run this up the pole is as good as an all out win. I think they misjudge us uneducated, smelly Walmart shoppers.

bob


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 29, 2019, 03:00:27 PM
I guess the new norm is going to be convicting anyone who can't prove they didn't commit a crime. 


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: RoadKingLarry on May 29, 2019, 04:37:32 PM
I guess the new norm is going to be convicting anyone who can't prove they didn't commit a crime. 

The facts of the case are irrelevant, it is the seriousness of the allegations that matter.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on May 29, 2019, 04:46:47 PM
On the other side of things, I really hope Trump does a scorched earth campaign against the federal employees who pushed this stuff.  I would love to see a smack down of elected officials also, but I think the most important part is setting an example of the federal employees who effectively participated in an attempted coup.  His order to declassify everything would be a good start.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 29, 2019, 07:25:25 PM
Remember, these people don't understand summaries. They thought Barr's summary should have been the entire, non-redacted document.

And yet they're perfectly happy with certain other "summaries": ["Some people did something"]


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 29, 2019, 09:03:00 PM
It appears that Mueller really is done -- or, at least, he wants to be:

https://www.newser.com/story/275811/muellers-2-years-of-silence-are-about-to-end.html

Quote
He also made clear that "any testimony from [our] office would not go beyond our report. ... We chose those words carefully and the work speaks for itself," and that he would not provide information beyond what has already been made public in any appearance before Congress: "Beyond what I've said here today and what is contained in my written report, I do not believe it is appropriate for me to speak further."

Here's the take-away for me: We have a legal system that says a person is considered to be innocent until proven beyond a reasonable doubt to be guilty. Them's the rules. Mueller said:

Quote
He made clear that his office "concluded we would not reach a determination one way or the other about whether the president committed a crime,"

So, irrespective of whether or not Mueller's team had enough proof of Trump's innocence to come out and say so unequivocally, the fact is they also didn't have enough proof of guilt to say so. So, the way the system works, if a special prosecutor's team could not uncover enough evidence after two years of digging to say with any degree of certainty that they thought Trump was guilty ... then by the rules of our system Trump is innocent.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: freakazoid on May 29, 2019, 09:37:00 PM
The article goes on about some of what the report said about the FBI and it ain't good.

WSJ Columnist: This Is What's Being Glossed Over In The Mueller Report On Russian Collusion
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2019/03/25/wsj-columnist-this-is-whats-being-glossed-over-in-the-mueller-report-on-russian-collusion-n2543660

This was in there

Quote
I never thought I’d see the day where Democrats are visibly upset that the President of The United States DIDN’T collude with the Russians.
    — Donald Trump Jr. (@DonaldJTrumpJr) March 25, 2019

How true.

(https://pics.me.me/but-i-wanted-north-korea-to-nuke-us-to-make-32568985.png)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 30, 2019, 04:59:45 AM
I guess the new norm is going to be convicting anyone who can't prove they didn't commit a crime. 

That is the Mueller, Weismann, Comey MO. Those three especially the first two have a history of questionable prosecutions/persecutions. Mueller should never have been appointed if any special counsel was even really warranted. He should definitely have been blocked from hiring Weismann.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on May 30, 2019, 05:16:55 AM
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/05/office-of-inspector-general-finds-top-fbi-official-illegally-leaked-to-media-including-sensitive-info-sealed-by-fed-courts-doj-declines-prosecution/

Quote
Despite the fact that this senior FBI official, who was not named in the summary, clearly broke multiple laws, the Department of Justice declined to prosecute the individual.

What's the use of catching them if there are no consequences … :facepalm:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: makattak on May 30, 2019, 05:19:25 AM
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/05/office-of-inspector-general-finds-top-fbi-official-illegally-leaked-to-media-including-sensitive-info-sealed-by-fed-courts-doj-declines-prosecution/

What's the use of catching them if there are no consequences … :facepalm:

So they can get a stern talking to and told that it was BAD. Maybe even told to think about what they did.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on May 30, 2019, 05:36:01 AM
Could someone tell me what law(s) Trump is accused of breaking (other than "Didn't let Hillary win".)   My understanding is that if there is NO crime (i.e. collusion) there there can't be any obstruction of justice.   Maybe some of our resident tile-crawlers can explain to this rube from flyover country what I'm missing.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on May 30, 2019, 05:36:35 AM
So, irrespective of whether or not Mueller's team had enough proof of Trump's innocence to come out and say so unequivocally, the fact is they also didn't have enough proof of guilt to say so. So, the way the system works, if a special prosecutor's team could not uncover enough evidence after two years of digging to say with any degree of certainty that they thought Trump was guilty ... then by the rules of our system Trump is innocent.

I'm not sure that interpretation is correct. I think Andrew McCarthy is correct (as usual) in his analysis.
Quote from: https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/05/robert-mueller-press-conference-impeachment-politics-democrats/
What matters is that Mueller can be fairly understood to be saying he believed President Trump committed obstruction of justice. That is not the only possible interpretation, but it is the most likely interpretation.

Mueller said Wednesday that if he had concluded there was insufficient evidence to charge Trump with obstruction, he would have said so (as he did with collusion). He then emphasized that he did not say so. That strongly implies that he believes the evidence is sufficient (notwithstanding that the attorney general has found otherwise). Mueller added that, in deciding not to allege obstruction even though the evidence was arguably sufficient to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, he relied on the OLC guidance. Finally, he deduced from this, and from his understanding of the Constitution, that in our system it is for Congress, not federal prosecutors, to deal with presidential misconduct.

Now, as I said, this is not the only conceivable interpretation. We could conservatively construe Mueller as saying that, because the OLC guidance prevents a sitting president from being indicted, he decided not to think about whether there was sufficient evidence to charge obstruction. But this is unlikely.
...
A much more straightforward interpretation is that Mueller believes there is enough evidence to indict, he decided he could not do so under the guidance, and he intentionally left the matter for Congress to resolve — with the advice that felonies may have been committed.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on May 30, 2019, 07:38:49 AM
Could someone tell me what law(s) Trump is accused of breaking (other than "Didn't let Hillary win".)   My understanding is that if there is NO crime (i.e. collusion) there there can't be any obstruction of justice.   Maybe some of our resident tile-crawlers can explain to this rube from flyover country what I'm missing.
My understanding from the Mueller report is they found no evidence of this collusion stuff.  They had no direct evidence of obstruction either, but they are trying to say that Trump's statements and tweets about ending the investigation and firing Mueller amount to some form of obstruction even though President Trump never actually did anything.  The tile crawling lawyers are doing their best to twist things to make it seem like there was obstruction.  Apparently the lack of an actual crime is important, but the relevant law has a clause that could maybe be interpreted by an aggressive prosecutor to say there doesn't need to be a crime if you cross your eyes hard enough.  I heard the intent of the people who drafted that law was that a crime was necessary.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 30, 2019, 07:40:54 AM
Coming soon to an impeachment near you

(https://i.imgflip.com/1ezjm3.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 30, 2019, 09:10:54 AM
I'm not sure that interpretation is correct. I think Andrew McCarthy is correct (as usual) in his analysis.

It's difficult to support a conclusion that Mueller was certain Trump had committed a crime when Mueller said this:

Quote
He made clear that his office "concluded we would not reach a determination one way or the other about whether the president committed a crime,"

That doesn't say definitively that Trump is innocent, but it very clearly does say that the entire Miueller team could not agree that Trump had committed a crime ... any crime.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: cordex on May 30, 2019, 09:35:06 AM
It's my understanding that Trump told some people to do things that would have almost certainly been obstruction if they had actually obeyed.  He's quick to lash about and does not consider his actions.  As far as obstruction existing in absence of a crime, yes, that is a thing.

My best read is that Trump was justifiably upset about being endlessly investigated for something he didn't do.  Because of that frustration he talked about and allegedly even tried to terminate the investigation administratively.  Had he actually done that it would have been worthy of an obstruction charge but because people refused to comply he was barely protected from crossing that line.

Trump is no lily white hero.  He's a jerk that goes off half-cocked and doesn't think before he acts.  Sometimes he makes good decisions and sometimes his decisions suck.  I'll give him credit for the good things he accomplishes but I'm not about to get sucked into defending everything he says or does just because people I don't like constantly attack him.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 30, 2019, 10:28:49 AM
Yeah, but he's our jerk    :laugh:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 30, 2019, 10:35:18 AM
It's my understanding that Trump told some people to do things that would have almost certainly been obstruction if they had actually obeyed.  He's quick to lash about and does not consider his actions.  As far as obstruction existing in absence of a crime, yes, that is a thing.

My best read is that Trump was justifiably upset about being endlessly investigated for something he didn't do.  Because of that frustration he talked about and allegedly even tried to terminate the investigation administratively.  Had he actually done that it would have been worthy of an obstruction charge but because people refused to comply he was barely protected from crossing that line.

Trump is no lily white hero.  He's a jerk that goes off half-cocked and doesn't think before he acts.  Sometimes he makes good decisions and sometimes his decisions suck.  I'll give him credit for the good things he accomplishes but I'm not about to get sucked into defending everything he says or does just because people I don't like constantly attack him.

I won’t disagree with your last paragraph. I don’t think some of what he supposedly requested like firing Mueller would actually be obstruction. It’s not like someone wouldn’t replace Mueller. Mueller arguably should have recused himself. He also should have been reigned in or fired for hiring Weismann and the gang of Hillary supporters and sycophants he hired for his staff. All legitimate reasons to fire him. I’m not sure how Mueller and Weismann even have law licenses anymore.

Hopefully Barr will actually get to the bottom of some of the shenanigans that proceeded this ‘investigation’.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: cordex on May 30, 2019, 10:39:48 AM
I won’t disagree with your last paragraph. I don’t think some of what he supposedly requested like firing Mueller would actually be obstruction. It’s not like someone wouldn’t replace Mueller. Mueller arguably should have recused himself. He also should have been reigned in or fired for hiring Weismann and the gang of Hillary supporters and sycophants he hired for his staff. All legitimate reasons to fire him. I’m not sure how Mueller and Weismann even have law licenses anymore.

Hopefully Barr will actually get to the bottom of some of the shenanigans that proceeded this ‘investigation’.
Sure, Trump had the theoretical authority to fire Mueller, but to fire him in an attempt to shut down the investigation or to influence it in his favor would have been obstruction.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 30, 2019, 10:57:09 AM
Sure, Trump had the theoretical authority to fire Mueller, but to fire him in an attempt to shut down the investigation or to influence it in his favor would have been obstruction.

Only if it was to shutdown the investigation or influence it. Not if it was a justified firing. Mueller did deserve to be fired. His last statements just prove it. He basically ended his investigation by saying I can’t prove he’s guilty, but he needs to prove he’s innocent.. That isn’t how our justice system works.

Plus Mueller’s theory on obstruction seems to come down to he thought about or wanted to fire me so that is obstruction. In Mueller’s world we have thought crimes now?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 30, 2019, 12:39:48 PM
Looks like Pelosi is dragging FB into this now

Quote

    .@SpeakerPelosi on Facebook: "I was giving them the benefit of the doubt on Russia…but clearly they wittingly were accomplices and enablers of false information to go out across Facebook." pic.twitter.com/8Ev7M1MYRK

    — CSPAN (@cspan) May 29, 2019

Nancy Pelosi: Facebook ‘Accomplices’ in Spreading Russian Fake News
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/05/29/nancy-pelosi-facebook-accomplices-in-spreading-russian-fake-news/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on May 30, 2019, 12:52:31 PM
It really isn't the prosecutor's job to exonerate someone. 
This is true, and yet people think Mueller DID exonerate him when the report explicitly stated otherwise.
Quote from: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/republican-justin-amash-stands-position-start-impeachment-proceedings-despite-criticism-n1011176
Cathy Garnaat, a Republican who supported Amash and the president said she was upset about Amash’s position but wanted to hear his reasoning. She said that she will definitely support Trump in 2020 but that Tuesday night was the first time she had heard that the Mueller report didn’t completely exonerate the president.

“I was surprised to hear there was anything negative in the Mueller report at all about President Trump. I hadn’t heard that before," she said. "I’ve mainly listened to conservative news and I hadn’t heard anything negative about that report and President Trump has been exonerated."
:O


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 30, 2019, 02:43:12 PM
This is true, and yet people think Mueller DID exonerate him when the report explicitly stated otherwise. :O

Well the report did exonerate him as much as any prosecutor would exonerate anyone on the question of collusion with Russia.

What they then did was put together a bunch of questionable theories on how he might have obstructed justice in the second section.

As for Amash, as a supposed libertarian I question why he is so concerned about questionable theories on obstruction that I don’t find credible as a libertarian while seemingly ambivalent to real credible issues with the spying by our intelligence services under the previous administrations. I’d have more respect for his opinion if he was at least consistent. He appears to have ulterior motives. If he was a true libertarian he would consider anything after the illegal spying to be fruit of the poisonous tree and the entire investigation to be a violation of constitutional protections.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on May 30, 2019, 03:18:10 PM
As for Amash, as a supposed libertarian I question why he is so concerned about questionable theories on obstruction that I don’t find credible as a libertarian while seemingly ambivalent to real credible issues with the spying by our intelligence services under the previous administrations. I’d have more respect for his opinion if he was at least consistent. He appears to have ulterior motives. If he was a true libertarian he would consider anything after the illegal spying to be fruit of the poisonous tree and the entire investigation to be a violation of constitutional protections.
https://reason.com/2019/05/30/unlike-president-donald-trump-justin-amash-actually-fights-against-fisa-surveillance-abuse/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 30, 2019, 03:41:15 PM
https://reason.com/2019/05/30/unlike-president-donald-trump-justin-amash-actually-fights-against-fisa-surveillance-abuse/


Really Reason? That site has gone over the top against Trump. Most libertarians don’t take it seriously anymore.

That article ignores real changes to Section 702. This is typical of many Reason articles over the last couple years. They are so anti-Trump that they ignore reality in favor of propaganda. I can barely take most of their articles seriously especially this last year. Do I think changes should have gone further on section 702, yes. Trump can only sign or veto things put on his desk though. And once again a true libertarian wouldn’t care if Trump supported an expansion of spying or not, it would still be wrong if not constitutional. Yes schadenfreude is entertaining, I don’t let it drive my principles.

Besides this just again proves Amash is not serious. He is saying to someone questioning his stand now that even though he is fine with the abuses now he voted against them in the past ... B fing S. He has an agenda and doesn’t care about principles, it’s obvious.



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on May 30, 2019, 03:55:02 PM
Trump practices realpolitik.

Amash practices ideological purity.

One gets things done and the other loses gracefully.

If Amash and his Democrat allies prevail the ratchet towards a civil war clicks much to dangerously close to happening than I would ever want to see.

There aren’t any good options, yet I cannot imagine any scenario where following the lead of Nadler, Schumer and Pelosi pursuing the destruction of this presidency is the preferable option.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on May 30, 2019, 04:50:36 PM
This is true, and yet people think Mueller DID exonerate him when the report explicitly stated otherwise. :O

Oh, please. The notion that conservative media hasn't covered the negatives of the report is laughable, but people who don't pay attention will only get what is stressed; not the details. That's hardly a reason to exercise your shocked face.

It is factually true, and inarguable, that the report exonerated Trump. He was clearly exonerated from the main allegation, which was collusion with Russia. While it didn't exonerate him on obstruction, it led to such an exoneration by the AG, for whom the report was drafted. If you don't understand that, maybe you're the one who's not getting it.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on May 30, 2019, 06:17:30 PM
What crime did Trump commit?

Not just the word, the allegation, “obstruction” but what did he actually do that rises to being guilty of obstruction?

Mueller sure didn’t spell it out very clearly.

You can read the news for days on end and never actually find out what this supposed crime entails.

A lot of Trump said this that or the other. Nothing actionable that I’ve seen so far.








Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 30, 2019, 06:45:14 PM
That's it?  After all this that's it? :rofl:
Cue the sad trombone

Quote

    46 Democrats and 1 Republican.

    The full list of House members who favor starting an impeachment inquiry against President Trump: https://t.co/991pM1312u

    — MSNBC (@MSNBC) May 30, 2019
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2019/05/30/thats-it-number-of-house-reps-for-trump-impeachment-not-nearly-enough-to-make-resistance-dreams-come-true/



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on May 30, 2019, 09:00:34 PM
Now that's funny. Say what you will about Nancy. She keeps them line when she wants to.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on May 31, 2019, 04:04:25 AM
What crime did Trump commit?

Not just the word, the allegation, “obstruction” but what did he actually do that rises to being guilty of obstruction?

Mueller sure didn’t spell it out very clearly.

You can read the news for days on end and never actually find out what this supposed crime entails.

A lot of Trump said this that or the other. Nothing actionable that I’ve seen so far.

Did you read the Mueller report ??? That would be the place to look  


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on May 31, 2019, 04:08:29 AM
Did you read the Mueller report ??? That would be the place to look  

I’m not a lawyer, why don’t you spell it out simply for me?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on May 31, 2019, 04:32:46 AM
It's my understanding that Trump told some people to do things that would have almost certainly been obstruction if they had actually obeyed.  He's quick to lash about and does not consider his actions.  As far as obstruction existing in absence of a crime, yes, that is a thing.

My best read is that Trump was justifiably upset about being endlessly investigated for something he didn't do.  Because of that frustration he talked about and allegedly even tried to terminate the investigation administratively.  Had he actually done that it would have been worthy of an obstruction charge but because people refused to comply he was barely protected from crossing that line.

Trump is no lily white hero.  He's a jerk that goes off half-cocked and doesn't think before he acts.  Sometimes he makes good decisions and sometimes his decisions suck.  I'll give him credit for the good things he accomplishes but I'm not about to get sucked into defending everything he says or does just because people I don't like constantly attack him.

The key is at what point did Mueller realize that there was no collusion.  At that point the investigation should have ended.  The other thing that I heard a lawyer friend of mine mention is that Mueller never should have written the second section.  "The Government only speaks in court." was what he said.  If there is not enough evidence to charge them with a crime, then Government should never come out and say "Person X almost did this."  Simply because it does not give the accused Due Process.  Which is what Mueller did here.  If he thought that Trump committed a crime, but was only protected by OLC guidance, he should have had that conversation with Barr and then made that clear in his report.  BUT, he told Barr that the OLC guidance did not apply as Mueller didn't think Trump's actions/statements/tweets rose to the level of obstruction.*



*- I will point out at the Mueller was able to interview, at length, any and all members of the administration, and put the screws to Flynn, Manafort, Gates, Cohen, Papandopolis, et al.  The investigation continued unhindered for 2 years.  And while I agree with Cordex's last paragraph, I do think that initial premise of the investigation was trainted.  Carter Page did not work for the government, nor did he have a clearance, nor access to classified material, nor was suspected of passing classified materials, therefore there NEVER should have been FISA warrant issued.   And the Steele dossier was never vetted, nor was the FISA court provided with the contrary information (Funded via Hillary/DNC via a cutout law firm) along with the various conflicts of interest.   Plus, no crime was ever specified for Mueller to investigate other then Russian interference in the election.  The actual amount of Russian "interference" is laughable in light of sound and fury in an attempt to tie Trump and the campaign to Russia.   


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: makattak on May 31, 2019, 04:41:46 AM
The key is at what point did Mueller realize that there was no collusion.  At that point the investigation should have ended.  The other thing that I heard a lawyer friend of mine mention is that Mueller never should have written the second section.  "The Government only speaks in court." was what he said.  If there is not enough evidence to charge them with a crime, then Government should never come out and say "Person X almost did this."  Simply because it does not give the accused Due Process.  Which is what Mueller did here.  If he thought that Trump committed a crime, but was only protected by OLC guidance, he should have had that conversation with Barr and then made that clear in his report.  BUT, he told Barr that the OLC guidance did not apply as Mueller didn't think Trump's actions/statements/tweets rose to the level of obstruction.*



*- I will point out at the Mueller was able to interview, at length, any and all members of the administration, and put the screws to Flynn, Manafort, Gates, Cohen, Papandopolis, et al.  The investigation continued unhindered for 2 years.  And while I agree with Cordex's last paragraph, I do think that initial premise of the investigation was trainted.  Carter Page did not work for the government, nor did he have a clearance, nor access to classified material, nor was suspected of passing classified materials, therefore there NEVER should have been FISA warrant issued.   And the Steele dossier was never vetted, nor was the FISA court provided with the contrary information (Funded via Hillary/DNC via a cutout law firm) along with the various conflicts of interest.   Plus, no crime was ever specified for Mueller to investigate other then Russian interference in the election.  The actual amount of Russian "interference" is laughable in light of sound and fury in an attempt to tie Trump and the campaign to Russia.   

I actually laugh out loud when a Democrat* says "THERE WERE SERIOUS ATTEMPTS TO INFLUENCE OUR ELECTIONS IN 2016 AND WE SHOULD ALL BE ANGRY ABOUT THAT!!!"

Yeah. Of course there were. And they were, at best, on par with the efforts in 2018, 2014, 2012, 2010, 2008, 2006, 2004, 2002, 2000, 1998, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1990, 1988, 1986...

Foreign governments, friend, foe, and other, ALL try to influence our election, legitimately and illegitimately. You're just pretending it mattered in 2016 because a SURE THING!™ lost and you don't want to admit your candidate was possibly the worst you could have chosen.



*pick any of them, they are all doing it


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on May 31, 2019, 05:06:32 AM
I’m not a lawyer, why don’t you spell it out simply for me?
I'm not a lawyer either and while I may be simple, the law isn't. If you just want simple, listen to Trump. :)

If you don't think the news is doing a good job of explaining something, go to the source material.
Obviously that's not always possible but in this case there's a whole report dedicated to the exact thing you're asking about.

If you want a shortcut, go here (https://www.justsecurity.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Muelller-Report-Redacted-Vol-II-Released-04.18.2019-Word-Searchable.-Reduced-Size.pdf) and search for the text " Obstructive act." as that gives a nice explanation of the events that were investigated and how they may (or may not) qualify.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on May 31, 2019, 05:22:21 AM
If there was obstruction we would all know what it was and impeachment would be occurring already.

My analysis doesn’t require me to trust any sources.

I’m just observing how things are playing out.

If there was a case against Trump we would be getting hit over the head daily with the sordid details.

The report is out and it’s obviously not obvious how he supposedly obstructed the investigation.

The report is out, there was no evidence of Russian collusion, that was the finding.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on May 31, 2019, 06:16:21 AM
Pat Buchanan has some very good questions.


Quote
If, after two years, Mueller found "insufficient evidence" of collusion by Trump, what was the compelling evidence that justified launching the investigation of collusion during the Obama era?

Did that earlier "evidence" turn out to be false allegations and lies?

When did Mueller discover that George Papadopoulos and Carter Page were not agents of the GRU or KGB?

When did Mueller decide there was no collusion or conspiracy?

Was it not until this spring? Or has Mueller known for a good while there was no conspiracy?

Why are these questions important? Because the investigation itself, leaving as it did a cloud over the legitimacy of the president, was damaging not only to Trump but also to the nation. As long as half the country believed Trump was an agent or asset or blackmail victim of Putin, the nation could not come together.

Did Mueller feel no obligation to clear up that false impression as swiftly and fully as possible, if, indeed, he believes it is false?

When did Mueller discover the Steele dossier was the product of a dirt-diving operation, financed by the Clinton campaign and fabricated by a Trump-hating ex-chief of British intelligence with long ties both to former agents of Russia's FSB and James Comey's FBI?

Did Mueller ever suspect that the investigation he inherited was a takedown operation, instigated by enemies of Trump who were determined that he never become president or, if he did, that his tenure would be short?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 31, 2019, 07:47:57 AM
Now that's funny. Say what you will about Nancy. She keeps them line when she wants to.


When she wants to

Nancy Pelosi Assures Jimmy Kimmel: We’ll Be Ready to Impeach Donald Trump Before 2020
https://www.breitbart.com/entertainment/2019/05/31/nancy-pelosi-assures-jimmy-kimmel-well-be-ready-to-impeach-donald-trump-before-2020/

Quote
“How do you explain that to kids in the hood, when they are approached by law enforcement and they say ‘I didn’t realize that we’re supposed to know this or that,’ Well they’re supposed to know,” Pelosi said. “But these very wealthy people with high priced lawyers can get away with saying I didn’t know.”

Guess you can blame any rise in crime in the hood on Trump now because ^^^^  :facepalm:
I would bet good money 90% of the "kids" in the hood have no clue or care who the POTUS is.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Chester32141 on May 31, 2019, 08:50:10 AM
 =D

"While we recognize that the man did not actually steal any horses...he is obviously guilty of trying to resist being hanged for it" - David Horowitz

 :facepalm:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 31, 2019, 10:00:44 AM
I suppose just to clear everything up. Trump committed obstruction by saying mean things about Mueller and in general for being a meanypants poopyhead. I think that is what the Dems have on him. Obvious grounds for impeachment. I now agree with Amash and the Dems, he has to be impeached.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 31, 2019, 10:58:44 AM
I suppose just to clear everything up. Trump committed obstruction by saying mean things about Mueller and in general for being a meanypants poopyhead. I think that is what the Dems have on him. Obvious grounds for impeachment. I now agree with Amash and the Dems, he has to be impeached.

That ... or we amend the Constitution and make The Donald Emperor for Life.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MikeB on May 31, 2019, 02:17:58 PM
That ... or we amend the Constitution and make The Donald Emperor for Life.

Who do we pay to get this bill entered in Congress? I would never support it, but boy would the howling from the Dems and MSM be fun.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on May 31, 2019, 02:23:56 PM
That ... or we amend the Constitution and make The Donald Emperor for Life.

It was said in jest. Considering how long it takes for a constitutional amendment to pass (IF it passes), I doubt that Trump would survive long enough to see the end of the process.

But it's fun to think about the weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on May 31, 2019, 02:25:27 PM
It was said in jest. Considering how long it takes for a constitutional amendment to pass (IF it passes), I doubt that Trump would survive long enough to see the end of the process.

But it's fun to think about the weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth.

Not enough popcorn in the world for that show


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fungus formerly known as Amy on June 02, 2019, 03:13:44 PM
2 years, $35 million, and he left a mess behind:

https://twitchy.com/jacobb-38/2019/06/02/attn-robert-mueller-brit-hume-has-two-still-unanswered-questions-for-you-about-actual-russian-collusion/


I've grown to admire Brit Hume as a reporter.  He asks hard questions of both sides that get to the heart of the matter.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on June 03, 2019, 07:47:52 AM
https://m.theepochtimes.com/transcript-in-mueller-report-selectively-edited-to-cast-suspicion-on-trump_2947573.html/amp?__twitter_impression=true
Transcript in Mueller Report Was Selectively Edited to Cast Suspicion on Trump

Quote
The Mueller report quotes a transcript of a Nov. 22, 2017, voicemail message from the president’s attorney, John Dowd, to the attorney for former national security adviser Michael Flynn.

A full version of that transcript released on May 31 in the court proceeding in Flynn’s case shows that Mueller’s team selectively edited the transcript for the Mueller report.

The edited version in Mueller report conceals Dowd’s sympathetic tone at the outset of the message, cuts out language that would show that Dowd discussed two separate matters, and omits the fact that Dowd specifically cautioned Flynn’s attorney that he wasn’t requesting any confidential information.

In response to the edits, Dowd said, in a statement to an attorney who noted the discrepancy on Twitter: “It is unfair and despicable. It was a friendly privileged call between counsel – with NO conflict. I think Flynn got screwed.”


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on July 24, 2019, 05:14:17 AM
They are taking another crack at their failed narrative. Mueller will try and massage his message to Congress today.

The Daily Beast has a great succinct rundown on what these lying propagandists are trying to make people believe.

It is an incredible shameless piece of propaganda.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/mueller-testimony-former-special-counsel-testifies-before-congress





Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: TommyGunn on July 24, 2019, 07:05:01 AM
They are taking another crack at their failed narrative. Mueller will try and massage his message to Congress today.

The Daily Beast has a great succinct rundown on what these lying propagandists are trying to make people believe.

It is an incredible shameless piece of propaganda.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/mueller-testimony-former-special-counsel-testifies-before-congress

Fox News' Chris Wallace has just labeled this hearing as a "disaster" for the democrats and "Mueller's reputation."
A local radio talk show host has labeled this the "retirement home inquisition." >:D

Mueller does come off rather poorly from what I have seen.  I don't wonder at all why he didn't want to appear in front of kongress....I believe he just wanted to retire.  


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ben on July 24, 2019, 07:08:03 AM


Mueller does come off rather poorly from what I have seen.  I don't wonder at all why he didn't want to appear in front of kongress....I believe he just wanted to retire.  


I saw people are guessing he's having health issues. He's apparently struggling with answers versus shooting them off as he did previously. Whatever anyone thinks of him, I'm sure this whole process stressed and prematurely aged him. I agree that he probably just wants to disappear and be forgotten at this point.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 24, 2019, 07:11:38 AM
I agree that he probably just wants to disappear and be forgotten at this point.

Rumor has it that Hillary knows someone(s) who can arrange that.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 24, 2019, 07:15:38 AM
Sooo, another big fat nothing burger.
Fully expect the dems to continue to run with the narrative that since Muller didn't prove Trump innocent that proves he's guilty.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on July 24, 2019, 11:16:43 AM
Fox News' Chris Wallace has just labeled this hearing as a "disaster" for the democrats...


Attempts to destroy Trump continue to end in disaster, defeat, and humiliation for his enemies. It gives one hope for 2020. And for America.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on July 24, 2019, 06:44:23 PM
The wrap-up of the hearing was on the TV screen in Burger King where I stopped for lunch. I heard a voice but I wasn't watching, so I don't know who said it but I guess it was the Democrat chair of the proceeding. He was grandstanding about "unprecedented" Russian attempts to influence our election, and he said we have to "lock down" out election procedures.

Great! I'm all for it. Let's start with requiring everyone to show proof of citizenship before they can register to vote. No more "motor voting" -- you get a driver's license at the motor vehicle department, you go to city hall to register to vote. I'd be fine if ALL voter registrations were cancelled and we all have to register again -- with proof of citizenship.

Early voting? Nope. Why call it "election day" if you're going to make it election week? Can't get to the voting location on election day? That's what absentee ballots are for. Absentee ballots get sent by mail, not delivered by campaign workers. And they get returned by mail.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 24, 2019, 07:18:16 PM
Many of the comments are good for a laugh

Quote
Susan Hennessey
‏Verified account @Susan_Hennessey

My guess is that we are going to see a groundswell of support for impeachment after this. Both sides got some favorable tv clips out of it, but the substance overall was just devastating to the president.
12:40 PM - 24 Jul 2019
https://twitter.com/Susan_Hennessey/status/1154114133962502144?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1154114133962502144&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitchy.com%2Fsarahd-313035%2F2019%2F07%2F24%2Fbased-on-what-cnn-legal-analyst-susan-hennessey-declares-mueller-hearings-just-devastating-to-the-president%2F



Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: brimic on July 25, 2019, 04:15:19 AM
People really need to start being held accountable for slander.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Mike Irwin on July 25, 2019, 04:20:23 AM
CNN commentator said that yesterday's shitshow did NOT do a thing for Democrats, and likely hurt them.

That's pretty interesting when CNN gets off the reservation.


And you know you've REALLY *expletive deleted*ed up when you lose Michael Moore, who blasted Dems...

"A frail old man, unable to remember things, stumbling, refusing to answer basic questions... all you puondits and moderates and lame Dems who told the public to put their faith in the esteemed Robert Mueller -- just STFU from now on."


That's just... delicious.  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on July 25, 2019, 05:07:17 AM
I heard a comment yesterday that Sheila Jackson Lee was not the dumbest part of the hearing.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 25, 2019, 05:36:49 AM
I heard a comment yesterday that Sheila Jackson Lee was not the dumbest part of the hearing.

Schiff is taking that as a challenge

Schiff: Here’s the ‘Essence’ of What Mueller Was Trying to Say
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/cortneyobrien/2019/07/25/schiff-spins-hearings-on-cnn-n2550598


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 25, 2019, 05:58:22 AM
(https://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/gv072519dAPR20190725074510.jpg)


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: fistful on July 25, 2019, 09:42:16 AM

And you know you've REALLY *expletive deleted*ed up when you lose Michael Moore, who blasted Dems...

"A frail old man, unable to remember things, stumbling, refusing to answer basic questions... all you puondits and moderates and lame Dems who told the public to put their faith in the esteemed Robert Mueller -- just STFU from now on."


That's just... delicious.  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

It gets better.

https://ricochet.com/655848/a-hollywood-story-in-three-acts/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: 230RN on July 25, 2019, 09:55:37 AM
Quote
Trump, Schiff said, has proven himself to be "unethical," "unpatriotic," "immoral," and "criminal."

I'll go for the reduced charge of President Trump "being a meanypants poopyhead," per Hawkmoon's analysis.

:rofl:


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: DittoHead on July 25, 2019, 10:51:58 AM
Mueller will try and massage his message to Congress today.

I think Mueller deserves a bit more credit than he's received for the most part. This was yet another opportunity to really drag the presidents name through the mud, and despite all of his supposed bias and hatred for Trump he did no such thing.

Quote from: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/07/25/robert-mueller-hearing-was-awesome-227478
It was clear from the start he knew Democrats wanted to use him as a prop to bring the findings of his report to life as part of a push for an impeachment inquiry. Mueller went out of his way to avoid regurgitating the contents of the report, wary of creating sound bites that could be used to suggest he supported impeachment. For instance, when Rep. Veronica Escobar (D-Texas) asked him whether his language referring to a constitutional process to “formally accuse a president of wrongdoing” was a reference to impeachment, he refused to admit the obvious.

Mueller did that all day long. He refused to answer leading questions whenever answering the question might draw him too close to the political fight, force him to say things that could spur controversy, or cause him to veer outside the four corners of the report. Mueller wanted to go no further than his report and he rarely did so, despite both sides egging him on. He swatted away Republican attempts to elicit answers about the origins of his probe as readily as he ignored Democratic attempts to get him to make their case against Trump.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: MechAg94 on July 25, 2019, 12:55:19 PM
I think Mueller deserves a bit more credit than he's received for the most part. This was yet another opportunity to really drag the presidents name through the mud, and despite all of his supposed bias and hatred for Trump he did no such thing.

IMO, that was probably the best course of action.  I think for him, trying to favor either side was a losing proposition.  I am having a hard time putting into words why.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Ron on July 25, 2019, 02:36:11 PM
Mueller is not a good guy. Maybe at one time he was but that was long ago.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 26, 2019, 12:07:14 PM
Crashing and burning ain't stopping Nadler

Tripling Down: Jerry Nadler Lies About Mueller’s Testimony, Vows to Pursue Impeachment Through August Recess
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2019/07/26/jerry-nadler-lies-about-muellers-testimony-vows-to-continue-witch-hunt-through-august-recess-n2550689


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: just Warren on July 26, 2019, 12:26:49 PM
CNN commentator said that yesterday's shitshow did NOT do a thing for Democrats, and likely hurt them.

That's pretty interesting when CNN gets off the reservation.


And you know you've REALLY *expletive deleted*ed up when you lose Michael Moore, who blasted Dems...

"A frail old man, unable to remember things, stumbling, refusing to answer basic questions... all you puondits and moderates and lame Dems who told the public to put their faith in the esteemed Robert Mueller -- just STFU from now on."


That's just... delicious.  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


This could be an opening for the Dems.

"We didn't know he was a doddering, senile old man! No wonder the investigation failed, we need to get some younger, more vigorous person to lead the investigation! We demand a do over!"


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 26, 2019, 12:33:12 PM

This could be an opening for the Dems.

"We didn't know he was a doddering, senile old man! No wonder the investigation failed, we need to get some younger, more vigorous person to lead the investigation! We demand a do over!"

Put AOC on it. I mean she's got elevator buttons almost figured out, this should be easy after that ordeal.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Hawkmoon on July 26, 2019, 01:14:41 PM

This could be an opening for the Dems.

"We didn't know he was a doddering, senile old man! No wonder the investigation failed, we need to get some younger, more vigorous person to lead the investigation! We demand a do over!"

To which the Republicans can reply, "He may be a doddering, senile old man, but he's your doddering, senile old man. You only get Mulligans in golf."


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Fly320s on July 27, 2019, 01:30:00 AM
To which the Republicans can reply, "He may be a doddering, senile old man, but he's your doddering, senile old man. You only get Muellerigans in golf."

Fixed.   =D


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 27, 2019, 08:32:12 AM
Can't let the fact the airliner crashed and burned stop the flight, it's was just a minor bump that's all.

Four More Democrats Call for Impeachment, Nadler Launches ‘Impeachment Investigation’
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/07/26/four-more-democrats-call-for-impeachment-nadler-launches-impeachment-investigation/


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: WLJ on July 27, 2019, 08:52:11 AM
The fact that they're still trying to push impeachment tells me they don't see much of a chance of defeating Trump in 2020 and possibly maintaining control of the house. It's now or never.
Either that they've just gone over the deep end since even if they impeach Trump there's pretty much zero chance of the Senate actually convicting him.
Desperate or crazy or both?


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: dogmush on July 27, 2019, 09:18:39 AM
The fact that they're still trying to push impeachment tells me they don't see much of a chance of defeating Trump in 2020 and possibly maintaining control of the house. It's now or never.
Either that they've just gone over the deep end since even if they impeach Trump there's pretty much zero chance of the Senate actually convicting him.
Desperate or crazy or both?

Crazy.  "They" i.e. the Democratic leadership isn't pushing impeachment.  They are actually trying to get these crazies to shut up, because they think if the Democrats can just look sane they can pull a lot of disgruntled middle of the road folks.

The couple folks actively calling for impeachment are just so far down their rabbit holes they can't see strategy, or are too new to care.


Title: Re: Mueller is done
Post by: Mike Irwin on July 29, 2019, 03:31:52 AM
The fact that they're still trying to push impeachment tells me they don't see much of a chance of defeating Trump in 2020 and possibly maintaining control of the house. It's now or never.
Either that they've just gone over the deep end since even if they impeach Trump there's pretty much zero chance of the Senate actually convicting him.
Desperate or crazy or both?

Absolute desperation to get him at all costs. They don't care what happens as long as they punish him for having the temerity to beat Empress H the First.


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