Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: K Frame on September 28, 2020, 07:38:34 AM
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Gotta love this headline from CNBC this morning...
"Hydrogen is at a ‘tipping point’ with $11 trillion market set to explode, says Bank of America"
If the market explodes, that will be one big boom...
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Ha. :laugh:
On a side note, I now know there is something called blue ammonia. Looks like that might be how the Middle East oil kings will transition into the "alternative energy" game.
https://www.ibtimes.com/what-blue-ammonia-saudi-arabia-makes-maiden-shipment-fuel-japan-3052872
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaduFEDaKsk
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaduFEDaKsk
I'll see you and raise you:
https://youtu.be/220VqYDXamI
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I'll see you and raise you:
https://youtu.be/220VqYDXamI
I call:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=299knTdX-Wo
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I thought ammonia was banned as a refrigerant because of its toxicity. (Or suffocating nature.)
So how are they "spinning" that one?
Me, if there was a leak and if I had a choice, I'd rather breathe 5% H2 or maybe even 5% Freon than 5% ammonia.
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Me, if there was a leak and if I had a choice, I'd rather breathe 5%H2 or maybe even 5% Freon than 5% ammonia.
Yup.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4D8FrKUYkK4
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I thought ammonia was banned as a refrigerant because of its toxicity. (Or suffocating nature.)
Nope, ammonia is pretty common in industrial refrigeration.
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Nope, ammonia has been used commercially pretty much non-stop. Cheap and effective. Also still used in absorption refrigerators, I believe.
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I call:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=299knTdX-Wo
Dammit. I can't top Ivanova.
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Dammit. I can't top Ivanova.
It would be wise to not even try. God sent her
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Yep still used in campers and off grid housing.
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It would be wise to not even try. God sent her
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8gHtX6d2wg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8gHtX6d2wg)
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Tangentially related, I have an old residential absorption A/C unit. 3 Ton, fired off natural gas. 1960's vintage. It's a neat piece, and I intend to get it running for demonstrating the technology to students in our HVAC program where I teach. We exclusively cover vapor compression refrigeration, it would be nice to at least show them absorption.
I'm a professor of HVAC, have a degree in HVAC, hold a refrigerant license and a master mechanical contractors license... but I haven't had any luck finding ammonia refrigerant (R717) for sale anywhere.
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Just a wild guess, but what do you think the cost-to-run comparison between that kind of unit and a similarly sized compression unit would be?
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This place claims to sell R717...
http://www.linde-gas.com/en/products_and_supply/refrigerants/natural_refrigerants/r717_ammonia/index.html
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This place claims to sell R717...
http://www.linde-gas.com/en/products_and_supply/refrigerants/natural_refrigerants/r717_ammonia/index.html
Yea, so do Praxaire and Airgas. Actually making it happen went nowhere though.
I suspect they're highly suspicious of an individual wanting a small quantity, because terrorism, drugs or whatever.
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Tangentially related, I have an old residential absorption A/C unit. 3 Ton, fired off natural gas. 1960's vintage. It's a neat piece, and I intend to get it running for demonstrating the technology to students in our HVAC program where I teach. We exclusively cover vapor compression refrigeration, it would be nice to at least show them absorption.
I'm a professor of HVAC, have a degree in HVAC, hold a refrigerant license and a master mechanical contractors license... but I haven't had any luck finding ammonia refrigerant (R717) for sale anywhere.
I understand there are truckloads of it shipped around in agricultural areas for fertilizer and I believe also for killing weeds or something.
I remember there being a problem with farm storage since the "hippies" used it to make some kind of drugs and would steal it.
Maybe you were perceived as one uh them "kitchen chemists," if yuh get my drift. Next time wear a coat and tie when you inquire. Or overhauls. One or t'other. Whichever. :rofl:
Terry
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That's weird as crap. You've got your license and credentials, you've told them what you want it for, and they still won't sell you any?
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Times have changed, Mike. There used to be a time when a 17 year old could walk into Eimer and Amend and buy each of the big three: Nitric, sulphuric, and hydrochloric.
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Yes, Grandpa Simpson, I realize that times have changed.
But the question is have times really changed THAT much that a LICENSED, REGISTERED professional with teaching credentials can't buy products related to his profession?
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This seems like a problem Amazon.com and a distillation setup could solve....
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Hey Nick, just thought of something...
How are you trying to order the stuff? Personally, using your credentials?
How about having your college/university order the material through their purchasing department? That might smooth things a bit.
As an alternative, maybe you could work a deal with someone in your area who services commercial refrigeration units?
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There is or was a large RV place in Olathe that serviced them might be worth a call.
The only guy a knew that worked on them passed away several years ago.
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Hey Nick, just thought of something...
How are you trying to order the stuff? Personally, using your credentials?
How about having your college/university order the material through their purchasing department? That might smooth things a bit.
As an alternative, maybe you could work a deal with someone in your area who services commercial refrigeration units?
That's a good idea, and I should investigate that avenue. The college would support the endeavor, and I could have it shipped to our warehouse. Thanks for the thought.
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I understand there are truckloads of it shipped around in agricultural areas for fertilizer and I believe also for killing weeds or something.
I remember there being a problem with farm storage since the "hippies" used it to make some kind of drugs and would steal it.
Anhydrous ammonia. Fertilizer (nitrogen fixation). When meth heads found a way to make their signature product with it, the out-in-the-open tank farms previously so common in every ag community suddenly became gated and guarded militarized zones.
Brad
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Anhydrous ammonia. Fertilizer (nitrogen fixation). When meth heads found a way to make their signature product with it, the out-in-the-open tank farms previously so common in every ag community suddenly became gated and guarded militarized zones.
Brad
Not in Iowa, tons of bulk and nurse tanks not being kept in locked enclousures. Now many of the nurse tanks have locks on them that take a lot of effort to open, also at one time there was an additive that made the NH3 useless to the meth cooks. Actually cracking down on distribution of pseudoephedrine has helped curb that form of meth cooking in the US.
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I understand there are truckloads of it shipped around in agricultural areas for fertilizer and I believe also for killing weeds or something.
Fertilizer yes, several different forms, gas stored under pressure as a liquid (anhydrous ammonia), liquid (28% and 32%) and dry.
AMS (Ammonia Sulfate) is used as a water conditioner with certain herbicides, it helps condition hard water. Softer water makes a lot of herbicides, like glyphosate work better. Side effect, too much AMS and you can burn the leaves of the plants you aren't trying to kill.