I hate politicians. Hate them. HATE.

[RadioFreeSeaLab]

How about mandatory drug testing for adult welfare recipients?  I have to piss in a cup at my job...the place where I toil and slave to pay for welfare folks, do they get tested on the receiving end of my hard work?

[SteveS]

Cut welfare and other leaching programs.. take the money saved and put into roads. Put the able bodied welfare recipients to work building these roads. No productive work, no pay, you go hungry. Taxes stay the same rate.

  You realize the majority of social program recipients are children, right?

I would suggest ending the war of terror and using the money at home or returning it to the American populace.

But then terror would win.

[RadioFreeSeaLab]

Riiiight.  Just like the Drug War has been so successful at beating back those evil pills and that damned green weed.  And the War on Poverty, that's working out well, too.

[Tecumseh]

I would be happy to give to charity to help those kids.  Then I might be assured that at least over 50% of my dollar is actually going to help them.  With welfare, it is much less.  The government is not a good charitable organization and never will be. 

I find it funny about your arguments.  I have heard them before.  You don't care if 99 people are cheating the system if you just help that one poor kid who needs it. 

I agree with you very much about the ineffectiveness of government.  The government is horrible at just about everything it decides to do.   Whether that be charity, keeping roads repaired, or administering social services.  However I am going to consider the hole thing.  I am tired of hearing those stereotypes about people on welfare and who benefits.  I just wanted to point out that there are consequences of eliminating the welfare state. 

And I do care about those who cheat the system, however I just wanted to add that if we eliminate social programs expect to see children suffering moreso than adults. 

[RadioFreeSeaLab]

And I do care about those who cheat the system, however I just wanted to add that if we eliminate social programs expect to see children suffering moreso than adults.

Actually, I would expect to see children and adults benefit greatly.  Private charity would come in, and the conditions for both children and adults would improve dramatically. 

[RevDisk]

While I do believe there needs to be welfare reform, corporate welfare kinda annoys me. 

Medicare Part D, which is regarded as some as a handout moreso to pharm companies than folks need prescription coverage, estimates 2006 costs are $37.4 billion.   Projecting the costs out to 2015 is around $724 billion.  S&L bailout was $150 billion.  $3.625 billion bailout of Long-Term Capital Management.  $1.5 billion in loan guarantees to Chrysler.  $15 billion airline bailout in 2001.  Farm subsidies have averaged $16 billion per year since 1996.

You know, that starts adding up to real money.  Other things annoy me too.  I won't even touch on the hundreds of billions in assistance programs to other countries.  Tens of billions spent on the failed War on Drugs.  etc, etc.  It adds up.  I'd prefer time caps on welfare. 

Special Supplemental Nutrition Program for Women, Infants and Children (WIC) and other food stamp programs generally don't annoy me too much.  I have a hard time getting upset at feeding folks.  JUST feeding them.  In a manner that does not put cash in their hands at any point.

[charby]

speaking of food stamps...

I have seen folks buy a five gallon jug of water, deposit on the jug is like $5, go out side and dump the water out then return and get $5 for the deposit. Heard of folks buying store brand soda, dumping it then getting the deposit money back as cash.

I've seen smoked salmon fillets bought ($20 Lb), lobster and other expensive foods bought with food stamps.

I know not all folks on food stamp do this, but there has to be some controls on what can be bought.

[jefnvk]

I've seen smoked salmon fillets bought ($20 Lb), lobster and other expensive foods bought with food stamps.

I know not all folks on food stamp do this, but there has to be some controls on what can be bought.

Places around here all have signs saying what is food stamp approved, isn't it that way everywhere?  Or does no one just pay attention to what is bought?

[charby]

I've seen smoked salmon fillets bought ($20 Lb), lobster and other expensive foods bought with food stamps.

I know not all folks on food stamp do this, but there has to be some controls on what can be bought.

Places around here all have signs saying what is food stamp approved, isn't it that way everywhere?  Or does no one just pay attention to what is bought?

I'm not sure, what I have seen lately is a food stamp card, kind of like a debit card. I figure that would be easy to track what people are buying.

[CAnnoneer]

There is a simple solution - people on welfare should not have the right to vote. Otherwise, they can vote themselves anything. Politicians will likely not cater to them either once that is done.

[grislyatoms]

I was behind a very well-heeled guy in the grocery store awhile back. Think French cuffs, nice shoes, well-tailored suit, etc.

He was attempting to buy a box of cake mix with food stamps. I thought that a bit incongruous, considering his appearance.

The cashier said "You may not buy cake mix with food stamps." At that, I thought it was a bit silly. But...

Mr. GQ said "I'll just go get some cash from my wife."

I paid for my stuff, just one or two items, and walked out right behind Mr. Dapper.

He walked over to an illegally parked (it was right in the middle of a crosswalk, if I remember correctly), brand-new Mustang convertible. I saw him lean inside, take something (presumably cash) and then walk back towards the store.

[RadioFreeSeaLab]

There is a simple solution - people on welfare should not have the right to vote. Otherwise, they can vote themselves anything. Politicians will likely not cater to them either once that is done.

I am behind that idea 100%

[drewtam]

Lets just through some facts into this discussion:
FY2007 Federal Budget
    * $586.1 billion - Social Security
    * $548.8 billion - Defense
    * $394.5 billion - Medicare
    * $367.0 billion - Unemployment and welfare
    * $276.4 billion - Medicaid and other health related
    * $243.7 billion - Interest on debt
    * $89.9 billion - Education and training
    * $76.9 billion - Transportation
    * $72.6 billion - Veterans' benefits
    * $43.5 billion - Administration of justice
    * $33.1 billion - Natural resources and environment
    * $32.5 billion - Foreign affairs
    * $27.0 billion - Agriculture
    * $26.8 billion - Community and regional development
    * $25.0 billion - Science and technology
    * $23.5 billion - Energy
    * $20.1 billion - General government

So the biggest dead weight is Social Security. Then Defense, which is at least, a legitimate function of federal government. Then medicare/medicaid and unemployment/welfare. Those items are 76% of the federal budget. I think many on this site will agree that SS, M/M, and Unemployment/Welfare are illegitimate federal programs. These items take up 57% of the fed's budget.

So all the other junk: National Endowment for the Arts (<1%), subsidies for farmers (1%), international aid (1%), EPA (1%), etc that conservatives waste their breath making hay about, hardly make a dent in the budget compared to these colossal programs. If conservatives and libertarians could whip these major programs our budget issues could be resolved within months.

[Tecumseh]

I would agree that defense is a legitimate job of government.  However I would not agree to the current war of terror.  Using our troops to further corporate interests and to attack countries that did not attack us seems to be bad policy and in the interest of special interests such as big oil.  Not to mention the contractors such as Halliburton, the lobbyists such as the multiple weapons manufacturers, and other interests.  They seem to be the ones that are profiting off of the current war. 

So I would rather spend the money that is going to defense on probgrams that are illegitimate but may help AMERICAN citizens rather than be used to further corporate interests and lead to the deaths of 600,000 innocent Iraqi's.  But that is just me. 

[Paddy]

So the biggest dead weight is Social Security.

So you measure expenditures without the offsetting income.  How intellectually dishonest is that?  How much money has been paid in to the Social Security/Medicare system since 1980?  How much has been ripped off and squandered by every President since Reagan? 

Either get honest or STFU and pay your SS/Medicare taxes. I'll be 62 in a few months (along with several million others) and we want our money.

[Boomhauer]

How much money has been paid in to stolen for the Social Security/Medicare system since 19801935?

I could provide for my own retirement MUCH more effectively than the Fed. gov., and I don't appreciate the .gov seizing the money I earn. So I will NOT STFU about the SS/Medicare taxes. Ya'll didn't pay into the system nearly the amount ya'll will be taking out, and that's THEFT.

[Manedwolf]

How much money has been paid in to stolen for the Social Security/Medicare system since 19801935?

I could provide for my own retirement MUCH more effectively than the Fed. gov., and I don't appreciate the .gov seizing the money I earn. So I will NOT STFU about the SS/Medicare taxes. Ya'll didn't pay into the system nearly the amount ya'll will be taking out, and that's THEFT.

I agree. I resent that I have to pay into a system for money I'll never see (it'll be bankrupt by then!), just to support the same baby boomers that brought about the age of leftist hell.

I want to invest MY OWN MONEY. Screw the baby boomers. They should have planned better, they're in MY wallet now instead.

Social Security should have been privatized and optional years ago. Every one of my generation would cut off payments into it IMMEDIATELY. And I want every cent I've paid into it, to invest on my own instead.

Once more people of Gen X and Y realize that they're never going to see a penny out of the chunk taken out of every paycheck, the backlash is going to be unstoppable. Social Security will be gone within a few years, hopefully, and good riddance.

If the baby boomers have a problem with the fact that the government spent their money, they can march on Washington. Instead, they're content to sit back and vacuum out OUR wallets.

[RadioFreeSeaLab]

* dasmi waits for Riley's response...

In 3
2
1...

[Paddy]

First, people my age have been paying taxes, including SS, for 40+ years.  Second, the SS rates were increased in '82, enough so that Boomers were the first generation to pre-pay our own retirement. IOW, we 've put trillions of dollars into the SS system.  We're not the thieves; we've already paid with our hard earned money.

The thieves are every President since Reagan, who was the first to discover (after Greenspan told him) that he could take the SS Trust money, put it in the general fund, and spend it. Which he did.  He pissed it away on Star Wars and still left debt as far as the eye could see. Then 'thousand points of light new world order Bush Sr. came along and did the same.  Then Clinton used our SS money to 'balance the budget'. Bush Jr. is now doing the same thing in the name of the WOT. 

So you Gen X & Y's can just consider our money an interest free loan to you, so that Reagan/Bush/Clinton/Bush could deliver a safe commie, nuke and terrorist free world to you.

It's ok.  We don't need your thanks.  Knowing we've done the right thing for you young people is enough.

[drewtam]

Get off your high horse Riley. Your argument is weaker than water. Lets see, who voted for every president from Reagan till now.. hmmm lets see, the name starts with "R" and ends with "Mc". It was YOUR retarded generation that voted for those buffoons in Congress who spent the money, not mine. I want my money back. If invested my self, it could make millions by time I retire. I will never see a dime, because your generation spent it all on medicare, medicaid, welfare, and military. Didn't loan a thing. Your generation screwed us, so I couldn't care how awesome you think you are.

[crawdaddyjim]

Tell you what McGeezer, You made your deal with Roosy the red, go get your money from him......

And being from the greatest generation once removed and the people who brought us "The great society"  you should take another one for the team and call it even.

[Manedwolf]

Let's see, the baby boomers took the foundations laid by the Greatest Generation and brought us...

GCA 1968.
"Free love".
Hippies.
"No nukes".
Drug culture.
The welfare state.
A societal sense of entitlement.
Big Government.
The changing of Republicans from Goldwater Republicans to...whatever the hell they've become.

Yeah. Thanks. Thanks a lot. You took the ship of state, ran it up on a reef and had a party on the tilted deck, and now you want a free lifeboat.

No thanks. Gen X and Y is going to be busy belowdecks for decades, bailing and patching to fix the DAMAGE you did.
And we have to work for our own lifevests, too, thanks.

[Perd Hapley]

The Greatest Generation and Baby Boomers are both to blame for the current mess.  So are my generation (X).  So are all the generations in between, and a few that came before the GG. 


Riley, I didn't know that Reagan and W took SS money, and pumped it into defense spending.  Thank God they diverted it to a legitimate, constitutional function of government. 

[Tecumseh]

Get off your high horse Riley. Your argument is weaker than water. Lets see, who voted for every president from Reagan till now.. hmmm lets see, the name starts with "R" and ends with "Mc". It was YOUR retarded generation that voted for those buffoons in Congress who spent the money, not mine. I want my money back. If invested my self, it could make millions by time I retire. I will never see a dime, because your generation spent it all on medicare, medicaid, welfare, and military. Didn't loan a thing. Your generation screwed us, so I couldn't care how awesome you think you are.

Maybe it is my CHristian upbringing speaking, but attackin other people on the forums with personal attacks is not right. 

Either way, RileyMc is correct.  Reagan did piss a lot of his money away on stupid programs.  Not to mention the Bush Sr. and Clinton.  Now we have a chance to stop Bush Jr. from doing it but the GOP is resisting.  The War of Terror is a bad idea and it is not doing anything productive for the country.  What is the point of spending Billions on Iraq when we could spend it here to help Americans?  Why does the GOP insist that waging this war of terror on an innocent nation is defending the USA? 

[Paddy]

Sheesh.  And they call my generation crybabies.  You X's and Y's win the title. 

First, you can thank the GG that you aren't goosestepping and speaking German and Japanese.  That war was a real threat (the last real threat to the U.S., btw) and had we lost it, you would have really known the meaning of screwed.  The GG grew up during the depression, fought and won a World War (FDR got us through it, and Truman finished it), came back, built homes, raised families and created the most prosperous middle class in the history of the world.

As a result, my generation didn't experience fear or want.  The GG gave us everything, largely, I think, because they grew up with so little.  Neither did X's and Y's experience fear or want; only prosperity, like us.
I assume all of you live indoors, eat regularly, drive good cars, and have money to spend on cheapazz Chinese crap, right?

Don't bitch to me about SS,  'cause I can't fix it for you.  You're adults, go out and change the law(s) so that you can invest your own money, rather than giving it to the government to continue to squander.

So you think that all of us Boomers, after working for 40+ years and paying trillions of dollars into the system, should just relinquish our claim on the promised benefits?  At this point in our lives, when we're 60+ years old?   Rather than insult you, (which I'd really like to do), I'll just say that's unreasonable of you.  How dare you come along at this point in our lives and demand what is ours.

We've kept our part of the bargain with the government.  It's now their turn to give us what they've promised.  If you have a problem with that, take it up with them.  A deal is a deal, and that's the way life is.  Grow up.