Author Topic: RCOB Time!  (Read 7102 times)

Zed

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RCOB Time!
« on: February 01, 2008, 04:42:12 PM »
Si vis pacem, para bellum. (If you would have peace, prepare for war.)

Perd Hapley

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2008, 04:56:49 PM »
RCOB?  Is that like Feed the Hogs? 
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Zed

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2008, 05:11:11 PM »
Not familiar with kim-du-toit.com  I see.

RCOB = Red Curtain Of Blood (What happens when you are so mad that everything looks Red to you)
Si vis pacem, para bellum. (If you would have peace, prepare for war.)

Dntsycnt

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2008, 05:12:01 PM »
Disgusting.

Paddy

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2008, 05:28:49 PM »
IF you're arrested, I suppose they can 'strip search' you.  The problem is, what was she arrested for?

Strings

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2008, 06:56:16 PM »
If I understand the article, Riley, she was arrested for arguing with the police over an honest mistake...

BobR

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2008, 07:27:05 PM »
Here in Spokane if you sue for getting strip searched the city will counter-sue you. Oh, BTW, they do field strip searches here.

http://www.spokesmanreview.com/breaking/story.asp?ID=13048

I think heads should roll.

bob


Paddy

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2008, 07:48:04 PM »
It's pretty clear this is an instance of excessive and unwarranted force, and the video is conclusive evidenc e.   The Sherriff's Dept really has no affirmative defense IMO, and should be charged with criminal misconduct. 

Mabs2

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2008, 05:03:38 AM »
I really hate trying to figure out what state these articles occurred in..."Canton" doesn't help me...Ohio maybe?

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2008, 06:04:13 AM »
It's pretty clear this is an instance of excessive and unwarranted force, and the video is conclusive evidenc e.   The Sherriff's Dept really has no affirmative defense IMO, and should be charged with criminal misconduct. 

Thats the beautiful thing about our system.  They won't be charged with such, as the government departments love to stick up for each other.  Instead they'll cough up some (taxpayer) funds to settle the lawsuit.  A few officers might get fired.  Nothing substanial will be done.
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AJ Dual

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2008, 06:47:02 AM »
Setting aside the greater civil rights and liability issues for a moment.

The problem as I see it is that I'm not sure anybody really knows how to train an LEO to deal with 20 meth-heads, belligerent alcoholics, or worse, the criminal low-life subset who doesn't need any chemicals to be violent, has warrants, a couple of phony ID's and a good story, and then "freak out" when the cuffs go on. And after days or weeks of that, THEN the officer has to correctly read the "IFF transponder" on a freaked-out housewife/"good person" who's just having a really bad day and made an honest mistake with her dead sister's ID.

And, after enough of it, you're made to feel that if you give too many people the benefit of the doubt, one day, the meth-head will stick a butcher knife in you, or the crack whore's "baby daddy" who's got warrants and parole violations a mile long, standing in the closet and "Ain't goin back, no way no how", unloads on you with the sawed-off 12ga right through the door.

And that's just the arresting/responding officer.

Then those staffing the intake center have none of the context that the innocent person was arrested in. And they have almost no contact with the law-abiding public within the context of their job.

None of this absolves the department or any individual of civil or criminal liability for what happened. When the speed limit changes from 55 to 25, and we don't see the sign, we don't get out of the ticket. When this happens to an innocent/good person, and they couldn't tell, I don't think that the officers or the LEA are off the hook either. "Ignorance of the law or the circumstances" cuts both ways, IMO.

However, I know it's a job I could not do, much less do better. I'd either be the "trusting rookie" who winds up dead or maimed at the hands of some junkie or career criminal, because I "missed the signs", or if I survived, I'd be a disillusioned veteran who may well have done as those officers did.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2008, 06:56:31 AM »
Just me, but my "Something Ain't Right" meter is pegged on this one.  By the way the story looks, what we do know is a reporter's versions of an attorney's press release.

I ain't passin' judgement on anything yet.  There's just too much we don't know.

Brad
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Bogie

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2008, 07:02:53 AM »
What I'm seeing is that there was a domestic call.

She hands the ossifer the wrong ID. He figures out it isn't her, becomes suspicious, and she gets angry back.
 
Communication breaks down rapidly.
 
Cuffed, in the car.

At the jail, she's told that she _will_ change out of her clothes, put on the jumpsuit, and go in the tank. She refuses. Probably repeatedly. I'd like to see the "before" section of that video... I'll bet the behavior was becoming more and more irrational by the minute, and she probably still hasn't figured out that she's been arrested. That doesn't happen to people like her. Tantrum time ensues.
 
So they changed her clothes for her.
 
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CmereYou

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2008, 08:54:59 AM »
What I'm seeing is that there was a domestic call.

She hands the ossifer the wrong ID. He figures out it isn't her, becomes suspicious, and she gets angry back.
 
Communication breaks down rapidly.
 
Cuffed, in the car.

At the jail, she's told that she _will_ change out of her clothes, put on the jumpsuit, and go in the tank. She refuses. Probably repeatedly. I'd like to see the "before" section of that video... I'll bet the behavior was becoming more and more irrational by the minute, and she probably still hasn't figured out that she's been arrested. That doesn't happen to people like her. Tantrum time ensues.
 
So they changed her clothes for her.
 


If I worked for the Sheriff, you'd already be on the payroll as our PR consultant. 


Just ripping someones clothes off and throwing them in a cell while male officers ogle their private parts and giggle about it on the way out of the room does not constitute changing their clothes for them.  laugh
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Brad Johnson

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2008, 09:08:41 AM »
Quote from: CmereYou
...throwing them in a cell while male officers ogle their private parts...


Might want to do some fact-checking.  Those are about the most female-looking "male" officers I've ever seen...




There's a lot to the story that hasn't been told.  As for Bogie's assessment, I see it as the most likely scenario.  If a person is being irrational and appears to present a danger to themselves, removal of clothing is SOP to minimize the chance of the person using their own clothing for any number of potentially deadly things.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
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Tecumseh

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #15 on: February 02, 2008, 09:13:10 AM »
What I'm seeing is that there was a domestic call.

She hands the ossifer the wrong ID. He figures out it isn't her, becomes suspicious, and she gets angry back.
 
Communication breaks down rapidly.
 
Cuffed, in the car.

At the jail, she's told that she _will_ change out of her clothes, put on the jumpsuit, and go in the tank. She refuses. Probably repeatedly. I'd like to see the "before" section of that video... I'll bet the behavior was becoming more and more irrational by the minute, and she probably still hasn't figured out that she's been arrested. That doesn't happen to people like her. Tantrum time ensues.
 
So they changed her clothes for her.
 

 I actually agree with this 100%.

I am sorry but people don't seem to understand she hands the officer an ID which does not belong to her.  Then she tells the officer "I keep someone elses ID in my wallet as a memento". rolleyes  She then gets asked if she has ever been suicidal and she says she has.  (She even tried to be a smartass about it!)  The officers fear that she may become suicidal now that she is in jail for a stupid mistake on her part and they do what is standard operating procedure.  They take all her clothing so she cannot hurt herself.  

I am sorry that Little Miss Suburbia did not realize that you don't play smartass with the cops.  Nor do you hand them fake IDs and get belligerent with them.  I do wholeheartedly think, with the information given in the first posting, that the reason males were present is that there were not enough female officers to restrain her.  

Why are people upset about this?  This happens everyday in large cities.  This time it was a rich well to do affluent person that went to jail.  I am sorry but the facts are that she screwed up and she is not willing to pay for her crimes.

Sergeant Bob

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2008, 09:15:34 AM »
Quote from: CmereYou
...throwing them in a cell while male officers ogle their private parts...


Might want to do some fact-checking.  Those are about the most female-looking "male" officers I've ever seen...




There's a lot to the story that hasn't been told.  As for Bogie's assessment, I see it as the most likely scenario.

Brad

Yeah, the big one with the shaved head is particularly feminine. I'll bet leaving people in a cell for several hours naked is SOP too.
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CmereYou

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2008, 09:16:37 AM »
Quote from: CmereYou
...throwing them in a cell while male officers ogle their private parts...


Might want to do some fact-checking.  Those are about the most female-looking "male" officers I've ever seen...




There's a lot to the story that hasn't been told.  As for Bogie's assessment, I see it as the most likely scenario.  If a person is being irrational and appears to present a danger to themselves, removal of clothing is SOP to minimize the chance of the person using their own clothing for any number of potentially deadly things.

Brad

Brad, are you really using the only screen capture of the video that doesn't show the male officers as an attempt to argue that no male officers were holding her down and also glancing at her crack and also giggling on the way out?

Because, after a few minutes spent reading your recent posts, you do seem to be an intellectually honest person.  undecided
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Brad Johnson

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2008, 09:25:16 AM »
Cmere, you have a PM.  I urge you to read it. 

Remember the question you posted on the thread that was immediately deleted?  You are running a strong risk of it being answered for you in quite certain and very permanent terms.  I will leave it for the mods to elaborate, if necessary.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
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Bogie

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2008, 09:30:07 AM »
I'm guessing that they probably piled as many folks that they could spare into that cell. Because when someone is being violent, uncontrollable, etc., etc., all the rules that one expects to live by when one plays nice-nice go out the window, and a new set of rules comes into play. Everyone grabs a piece, and hangs on... If she'd hung herself with her jeans after refusing to change, and then realizing that -she-, of all people, had actually been -arrested,- it would have been a completely different story.
 
Most criminals know the drill. Many folks who are NOT criminals know the drill.
 
Be nice and polite to the guys who run the jail, and they will be at least minimally civil with you. If you're not nice...
 
Hey, they didn't taser her.
 
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Tecumseh

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2008, 09:32:37 AM »
I'm guessing that they probably piled as many folks that they could spare into that cell. Because when someone is being violent, uncontrollable, etc., etc., all the rules that one expects to live by when one plays nice-nice go out the window, and a new set of rules comes into play. Everyone grabs a piece, and hangs on... If she'd hung herself with her jeans after refusing to change, and then realizing that -she-, of all people, had actually been -arrested,- it would have been a completely different story.
 
Most criminals know the drill. Many folks who are NOT criminals know the drill.
 
Be nice and polite to the guys who run the jail, and they will be at least minimally civil with you. If you're not nice...
 
Hey, they didn't taser her.
 

  My thoughts as well.  I am sorry but if she had the common sense to not resist or carry someone elses ID she would not be there.  When I was younger I could raise hell with the best of them but I knew the drill.  Once your in cuffs and at the station, you are better off playing ball so that you don't get your ass kicked. 

grislyatoms

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2008, 09:35:44 AM »
Cmere, you have a PM.  I urge you to read it. 

Remember the question you posted on the thread that was immediately deleted?  You are running a strong risk of it being answered for you in quite uncertain and very permanent terms.  I will leave it for the mods to elaborate, if necessary.

Brad

Quite uncertain? I could see "no uncertain" or "quite certain", but "quite uncertain" doesn't seem to fit.  grin
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Bogie

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #22 on: February 02, 2008, 09:40:20 AM »
Guys, guys...
 
Look at the bright side - Looks like several of the deputies are now trained enough to go on the professional bull riding circuit...
 
Yee haw.... Hang on there Cindy! She looks like she's gonna jacknife!
 
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Brad Johnson

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #23 on: February 02, 2008, 09:49:33 AM »
Cmere, you have a PM.  I urge you to read it. 

Remember the question you posted on the thread that was immediately deleted?  You are running a strong risk of it being answered for you in quite uncertain and very permanent terms.  I will leave it for the mods to elaborate, if necessary.

Brad

Quite uncertain? I could see "no uncertain" or "quite certain", but "quite uncertain" doesn't seem to fit.  grin

Picky.. picky..  Okay, so I fixed it.   grin

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
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grislyatoms

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Re: RCOB Time!
« Reply #24 on: February 02, 2008, 10:00:37 AM »
Cmere, you have a PM.  I urge you to read it. 

Remember the question you posted on the thread that was immediately deleted?  You are running a strong risk of it being answered for you in quite uncertain and very permanent terms.  I will leave it for the mods to elaborate, if necessary.

Brad

Quite uncertain? I could see "no uncertain" or "quite certain", but "quite uncertain" doesn't seem to fit.  grin

Picky.. picky..  Okay, so I fixed it.   grin

Brad

Cool. Do I get my journeyman curmudgeon's badge now?  grin
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