Author Topic: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.  (Read 22524 times)

outerlimit

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #75 on: March 11, 2008, 09:24:27 PM »
Imagine all the high casualty attacks taking place daily as the illegals stream across.

LAK

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #76 on: March 11, 2008, 10:27:05 PM »
Manedwolf
Quote
So I guess we should have ignored Nazi Germany as they took over all of Europe and made it into an empire, until they made the V2 into an ICBM, until they built the transatlantic jet bombers they were working on specifically to reach the United States?

Yeah, that would have worked.   Because, historically, building walls and sitting there while massive armies lay siege has worked so well in every instance. Eventually, you run out of stuff because NO RESOURCES CAN COME IN.
Another poor analogy. Germany? That's another subject altogether - perhaps you'd like to tackle that one in another thread.

We do not actually need anything from any other country; and there is still nothing to stop us from receiving goods we can not make ourselves, and exporting those things others want to receive in reciprocal trade with stable, civilized countries who exercize similar controls on imports, exports and immigration. It is a grave risk, and we do not need, to have a free for all of goods, shipping companies and workers coming and bringing things into this country.

Terrorism is nothing new; if big bad Al Kidya was what your fat drunk corporate-gov is telling you, they could have easily brought this country to a somewhat chaotic standstill using a modest number of boots on the ground with some good old fashioned small arms, pyrotechnics, and what is by now old hat special forces training all over the world - and nothing more - in the same month of September 2001, or anytime immediately following.

That's IF big bad Al Kidya really "wanted to destroy the United States". Evidently not.

This is not about building walls - it is about having tangible, enforced borders. We used to have real immigration controls in this country. We really do not need any more immigrants, and we particularly only need to let anyone come here if they are a citizen of a stable civilized country. This would minimize risks and problems greatly. That and the immediate deportation of anyone found here that a) was not born here b) does not have a valid visa.

It really is not that difficult. The alternative is to watch your country disappear into the sprawling global village. Where there is a hodge podge of people with no distinctive culture, ideology or moral values (or insert your word of choice); a big free for all where "anything goes".

And in this mass of barely controlled chaos your big corporate-gov will have every excuse it needs to impose any controls on the lives of it's citizens; all in the name of the "war" on a noun that never ends.

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http://searchronpaul.com
http://ussliberty.org/oldindex.html
http://www.gtr5.com
http://ssunitedstates.org 

MicroBalrog

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #77 on: March 11, 2008, 10:41:21 PM »
How ironic-the one Israeli on this thread points out that all this foreign "aid" gets wasted on projects that have very little to do with real threats to the existence of either Israel or America, and that very few in the Israeli public see any benefit.

Micro, I support your vision of an Israel with honest government and civil rights, including the right to free speech and the right to be free from a largely undemocratic, uninterested military bureaucracy. 

It must be something awful to live right next door to the gangs of Hamas and tell people "those retards can't reliably operate bottle rockets", only to hear back about what a great threat to the existence of America and Israel they are, and that's why your bosses need x billion dollars and to purchase more stuff from America.

The security hype operates in America much the same way-people try to use it to silence criticism of the government and to justify inordinate amounts of spending on "security" projects that don't contribute much to anyone's welfare or security.

Of course we don't have anything so extreme as your emergency censorship laws.  Are there many in Israel who oppose it, and do you think there's any chance of it being changed this century?



I wanted to write a long, long post here, but you pre-empted me epically.

As to you question: No, and no.

Israel was not founded by people like Jefferson and Franklin and Hamilton.
It was founded by guys like Ben-Gurion, who was known for being a socialist and a fan of Lenin. Even after years of Likud reform, the nation is still farther down the road of big government than most other Western nations. Right now, they're seriously planning on censoring the Internet. NO I AM NOT JOKING.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

outerlimit

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #78 on: March 11, 2008, 11:26:48 PM »
Wow, I hadn't heard that. What are their plans, to filter content like China does?

MicroBalrog

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #79 on: March 12, 2008, 12:54:45 AM »
Wow, I hadn't heard that. What are their plans, to filter content like China does?

The bill that was submitted in the Knesset [got Hebrew? I can link you to the relevant news articles then] was to mandate the ISPs block content from what they term the 'offensive content list', but to allow people who want the content to ask for an exception - and thus creating, of course, a national registry of porn browsers and extremists.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

outerlimit

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #80 on: March 12, 2008, 01:05:44 AM »
Wow, I hadn't heard that. What are their plans, to filter content like China does?

The bill that was submitted in the Knesset [got Hebrew? I can link you to the relevant news articles then] was to mandate the ISPs block content from what they term the 'offensive content list', but to allow people who want the content to ask for an exception - and thus creating, of course, a national registry of porn browsers and extremists.


No, that's fine, I can't read Hebrew. Thank you for explaining that. It's too bad there's so many Lieberman's and Tipper Gore's in governments these days. There is a legislator in Kentucky that wants to put an end to anonymous internet posting. Like there isn't already enough identity theft out there, he thinks you should register all of your personal details with every website you are on. He wants to stop "internet bullying" rolleyes

http://www.wtvq.com/content/midatlantic/tvq/video.apx.-content-articles-TVQ-2008-03-05-0011.html

MicroBalrog

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #81 on: March 12, 2008, 01:06:35 AM »
This was brought up here as well, but it died a messy death.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

MicroBalrog

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #82 on: March 12, 2008, 01:07:40 AM »
Oh, here's the Jerusalem Post thing:

In English.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

K Frame

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #83 on: March 12, 2008, 06:08:25 AM »
I get a "sorry, page not found" error.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #84 on: March 12, 2008, 06:09:40 AM »
Knesset okays Internet censorship bill

A bill that would force Internet providers to block sites that contain pornography, gambling and extreme violence passed a first reading in the Knesset plenum on Wednesday.

The bill is the latest in a line of attempts by Shas to make use of its upgraded influence within the coalition since the departure of Israel Beiteinu.

Shas is also pushing a bill that would expand rabbinic courts' jurisdiction in divorce and monetary matters. In addition, Shas has demanded a boost in child allowances, which would benefit haredi families.

The Internet porn bill - authored by MK Amnon Cohen (Shas), strongly supported by Communications Minister Ariel Attias (Shas) and spiritually endorsed by party mentor Rabbi Ovadia Yosef - would require Internet users to specifically request full access to pornography. Those requesting such access would have to prove they were adults.

"Instead of parents having to actively block their children from viewing hard-core pornography and violence, pornography enthusiasts will have to be active and make a single phone call," said Cohen, the bill's initiator.

It is unclear whether those requesting full access would be blacklisted.

In the absence of such a request, the default option would block thousands of Web sites. A committee made up of members of the Education, Justice and Communications ministries would decide which sites to block.

Although Knesset legal advisers have said that it is unlikely Cohen's bill could be defended in the High Court of Justice, due to Attias' refusal to provide a list of the "harmful" sites to be blocked, the coalition has thrown its support behind the bill.

Attias rebuffed critics who compared the bill to censorship policies in Muslim countries such as Pakistan and Saudi Arabia.

"The law will transform us into a type of Iran by giving the minister the authority to decide that the Shas Council of Torah Sages will determine the sites to be rejected and blocked - without any supervision or monitoring of its considerations by the Knesset," MK Gilad Erdan (Likud) said.

"We live in a democracy," said Attias in an interview with Army Radio. "Anybody who wants full Internet access can get it. We are just trying to protect our children from the sex and violence available on the Internet."

Attias, citing a recent survey, said 60 percent of minors admitted they had been exposed to porn on the Internet. Some 40% admitted they had given personal information to strangers over the Internet, and 47% said their computers were located inside their bedrooms, where parents had limited ability to monitor their surfing habits.

"These data are disturbing, and we decided to do something about it," said Attias.

The bill has to go back to the Knesset Economic Affairs Committee, then back to the plenum for final approval, a process that could take months.

Assuming the coalition stays together, the bill is expected to pass, since it enjoys support from more conservative opposition parties such as Israel Beiteinu and Likud. These parties support the bill because it is perceived as protecting wholesome family values.

MK Ran Cohen (Meretz) said he was "totally opposed" to the bill.

"It is another example of Shas's primitive approach to scientific developments. There are rabbis who are still living 2,000 years ago," he said.

MK Dov Henin (Hadash) claimed that Shas's bill was an unjustified transfer of responsibility from parents to central government.

"If parents don't want their children to view certain Internet sites, they should intervene and stop them," Henin said.

He added that the bill gave the misleading impression that the Internet would be made safe, when in reality the most dangerous Internet features were chatrooms, which would remain uncensored.

Dr. Yitzhak Kadman, head of the National Council for the Child, said he opposed the bill.

"I warned minister Attias that the present wording of the bill would cause a scare among liberal-minded Israelis who do not want the state to tell them what to do," Kadman said.

"I propose that Internet suppliers be obligated to provide parents with a variety of Internet filters free of charge. And if the parents choose to block content, they can do so in accordance with their sensibilities," he said. "But I oppose a centrally controlled censorship of the Internet."
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #85 on: March 12, 2008, 06:10:15 AM »
they found out is was linked to ron paul and killed it as part of the media conspiracy

De Selby

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #86 on: March 12, 2008, 04:59:23 PM »
Micro, good point about the founders of your country.  They basically declared "state of emergency!", and then assumed vast government powers....and that 'state of emergency' has never once been lifted in the history of the country.  Censors already review and approve all content relating to the military, which is the source of a large part of the government corruption, from my understanding.

Well, good luck to you starting a movement for free speech and free people.  I am certain that helping Israel to become truly independent, as opposed to dependent on massive corporate welfare, will help you all along in that path.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

christopher

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #87 on: March 12, 2008, 09:12:36 PM »
The problem is expecting the government to do everything for you. There is no personal responsibilty, most people couldn't tell you where their water comes from or where it goes, the amount they use or the damage they do.
And alot of kids have pet rocks for parents. Once you've dumbed down society they rely more & more on a government out of control

MicroBalrog

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #88 on: March 12, 2008, 09:43:36 PM »
Note on the article above:

Quote
Assuming the coalition stays together, the bill is expected to pass, since it enjoys support from more conservative opposition parties such as Israel Beiteinu and Likud

That's the JPost basically lying. The leadership of IB, and many Likud members [such as Gilad Erdan, the leader of the Knesset Likud, who is qujoted in the article, are opposed to  the bill.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

outerlimit

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Re: The FINAL word on what anyone should think of Ron Paul.
« Reply #89 on: March 12, 2008, 10:39:12 PM »
Note on the article above:

Quote
Assuming the coalition stays together, the bill is expected to pass, since it enjoys support from more conservative opposition parties such as Israel Beiteinu and Likud

That's the JPost basically lying. The leadership of IB, and many Likud members [such as Gilad Erdan, the leader of the Knesset Likud, who is qujoted in the article, are opposed to  the bill.

The media would never lie.