It' the Conress, not the President, we need to control.

[Desertdog]

The POTUS actually has very little power if you think about it. 
He cannot introduce any spending bills,  he cannot introduce or pass any legislation, and he cannot accept any treaties without the approval of the Senate.  He can veto anything passed by the Conress, and they can override anything he vetos. 


The House of Represetives make starts controls the money, can introduce legislation, and can pass or reject the bills that have submitted.

The Senate can introduce legislation, can pass or reject the bills that have been introduce, approves or rejects treaties with foreign governments.

It has always been my contention that we need to control the Represenatives and the Senators more than the President.

[Scout26]

But, but, but, but, Bush got us into Iraq and is spending our great-great-great-grandkids money and is violating all our civil rights with his unconstitutional Patriot Act and refuses to give us all free health care for life.

Congress had nothing to do with those any of those things.

(Did I cover everything for you Riley.  )

[Paddy]

No, you missed a lot, actually.  You'll need to start with Reagan and the interest on the debt he left that will  continue as far as the eye can see.

Don't kid yourself.  POTUS may not Constitutionally have the powers you listed, but he (she) is arguably the most powerful person on the planet.  And a popular President is all that much more influential.  If POTUS wants a bill introduced, there are Congressmen who will make it happen.

That said, yes.  We need to pay way more attention to who we're electing to Congress.  As a group, they can create way more havoc than one President.

[MechAg94]

Actually, the Clintons refinanced all that interest with short term T-bills.

Reagan did the country a favor by cutting the tax rates and nearly doubled the govt revenue.  It was Congress in the 80's that spend money like it was growing on trees. 

[Paddy]

And when you 'refinance' debt it goes away, right?   

Reagan cut tax rates for the wealthy.  He increased tax rates for the working middle class.  That's where all the 'additional revenue' came from.

[MicroBalrog]

It's true in part.

But the truth is, in modern America -at least if I understand correctly from my limited education  the President has much more power than intended by the Constitution.

Consider: Under the Controlled Substances Act, the President could reclassify various substances by executive order. He could, for instance, render marijuana a Schedule II drug (still illegal, except for medical use). Under the Gun Control Act of 1968, the Executive (and thus the President) can reclassify weapons, by fiat, so that the NFA no longer applies to them.

The President holds the unlimited power of pardon. Lincoln pardoned literally thousands of people. A theoretical Good President could pardon all those thousands of people in prison for technical gun violation.

More importantly, and I quote Wikipedia (so it may or may not be true),

In addition, while the president cannot directly introduce legislation, he can play an important role in shaping it, especially if the president's political party has a majority in one or both houses of Congress. While members of the executive branch are prohibited from simultaneously holding seats in Congress, they often write legislation and allow a member of Congress to introduce it for them.

You see where I am going with this?

Further (and far more importantly than any of the above) the President is considered to be 'the face of the country'. The Presidential bully pulpit is often more important than the vote of a Congressman, simply because the President has an influence on the framing of the national debate, so to speak.

[Desertdog]

But, but, but, but, Bush got us into Iraq and is spending our great-great-great-grandkids money and is violating all our civil rights with his unconstitutional Patriot Act and refuses to give us all free health care for life.
Congress had nothing to do with those any of those things.

Congress passed bills giving the president war power (War Powers Act) and passed bills approving everything he spends.  He ask and they approve.

and refuses to give us all free health care for life.

Also known as Socialized Medicine.  NO THANKS.

[wooderson]

Have you ever heard the term 'imperial Presidency,' desertdog?

Your argument might have held water before FDR. But for the last seventy years - and particularly the last fifty - we've seen an unending increase in the concentration of power in the Executive Branch (regardless of which party happens to be in office).

[Manedwolf]

And if Congress doesn't want the President to do something, they can turn off the money.

They can override vetoes.

I'm not sure where you get this stuff.

[Desertdog]

I'm not sure where you get this stuff.

Try looking in the Constitution of the united States.

Example:
http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html#A1Sec2

Article. I. - The Legislative Branch
Section 1 - The Legislature

All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.


Section 7 - Revenue Bills, Legislative Process, Presidential Veto

All bills for raising Revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives; but the Senate may propose or concur with Amendments as on other Bills.

Every Bill which shall have passed the House of Representatives and the Senate, shall, before it become a Law, be presented to the President of the United States; If he approve he shall sign it, but if not he shall return it, with his Objections to that House in which it shall have originated, who shall enter the Objections at large on their Journal, and proceed to reconsider it. If after such Reconsideration two thirds of that House shall agree to pass the Bill, it shall be sent, together with the Objections, to the other House, by which it shall likewise be reconsidered, and if approved by two thirds of that House, it shall become a Law. But in all such Cases the Votes of both Houses shall be determined by Yeas and Nays, and the Names of the Persons voting for and against the Bill shall be entered on the Journal of each House respectively. If any Bill shall not be returned by the President within ten Days (Sundays excepted) after it shall have been presented to him, the Same shall be a Law, in like Manner as if he had signed it, unless the Congress by their Adjournment prevent its Return, in which Case it shall not be a Law.

Every Order, Resolution, or Vote to which the Concurrence of the Senate and House of Representatives may be necessary (except on a question of Adjournment) shall be presented to the President of the United States; and before the Same shall take Effect, shall be approved by him, or being disapproved by him, shall be repassed by two thirds of the Senate and House of Representatives, according to the Rules and Limitations prescribed in the Case of a Bill.

Section 8 - Powers of Congress

Section 9 - Limits on Congress

[Manedwolf]

I'm not sure where you get this stuff.

Try looking in the Constitution of the united States.

Oh, I know, the "stuff" I was referring to was Wooderson's rhetoric about the president becoming overlord and all.

[The Rabbi]

Its hard to tell the crazy arguments without a scorecard.
For the record, Congress writes the budget, then sends it to the president for approval.  He can sign it or veto it.  The attempt to get a line item veto was great until it was struck down.
The President can propose what he wants, but ultimately Congress sends him something.
In Bush's case, he was always dealing with a hostile Congress.  Even when the GOP had control, the Dems maneuvred to thwart what he wanted.

[seeker_two]

It's all the government's fault.....all three branches.....

....it's like the country is being run by clones of fistful.....

[wooderson]

Oh, I know, the "stuff" I was referring to was Wooderson's rhetoric about the president becoming overlord and all.

Yes, that's precisely what the Imperial Presidency refers to. Overlord. Dictator. That kind of stuff.
 

[christopher]

uh, presidente has way too much power but some members of congress/senate have been there since the civil war. strom thurmond stayed in office for a hundred & fifty years. Ted mckennedy has held the same office for some fidy years.

but the real problem (welcome to the real) is that our politicians, elections & legislative process is now in the hands of lobbyist. Besides the congressmen turned lobbyist turned congressmen there are now 35,000 lobbyist in Washington.

but don't despair threadweaver some of the sheep have had it with "being pushed through the fence" , oops i sais too much.

[MicroBalrog]

strom thurmond stayed in office for a hundred & fifty years.

*stares*

[LAK]

Congress is the ultimate seat of power in this country and controls the purse. The president is basically an administrator and representative to foreign govs of the federal gov; although he does have ultimate authority over all federal agencies via directive and executive order.

-------------------------------

http://searchronpaul.com
http://ussliberty.org/oldindex.html
http://www.gtr5.com
http://ssunitedstates.org

[Waitone]

No, the reality is the electorate is the most important.  If the electorate wanted to control things it could by simply voting those out all bums standing for election.  Every two years the entire house and 1/3 of the senate stand for election.  We are in the mess we are in because we accept it.  Tired of it?  Vote your bum out.

[MechAg94]

[whiny teenager voice]..but he sends us all that money back to our district...[/whiny teenager voice]

I hear that same argument a lot from people who should know better.

[christopher]

Can you imagine working for a company that has a little
more than  500 employees and has the following statistics:
 
*29 have been accused of spousal abuse
 
*7 have been arrested for fraud
 
*19 have been accused of writing bad checks
 
*117 have directly or indirectly bankrupted at least 2  businesses
 
*3 have done time for assault
 
*71 cannot get a credit card due to bad credit
 
*14 have been arrested on drug related charges
 
*8 have been arrested for shoplifting
 
*21 are currently defendants in lawsuits
 
*84 have been arrested for drunk driving in the last year
       
Can you guess which organization this is?

Give up yet?

 
It's the 535 members of the United States Congress.
The same group of Idiots that crank out hundreds of new laws
each year designed to keep the rest of us in line.

[Matthew Carberry]

strom thurmond stayed in office for a hundred & fifty years.

*stares*

He's counting Zombie Thurmond

[christopher]

check his voting record -it goes back to civil-war days.

[Perd Hapley]

It's all the government's fault.....all three branches.....

....it's like the country is being run by clones of fistful.....

You wish.  "Clones of fistful" would refer to the Constitution every so often.   

[thebaldguy]

I think of our President and Congress like the coach and the team. When the team is winning the coach is the hero. When the team is losing, the coach is the zero.

In this case, both the coach and the team suck. Both need replacing. Both are responsible for the current mess we are in.

[christopher]

fire 'em all this november! learn how at:
lets keep McCain, Clinton & Obama out of the White House!