God D@mn America, says BHO's Minister

[Len S]

Hi people I usually hang out on THR and 1911 forum.  Today was Obamas speech on this issue.  Does anyone think it is a coincidence that it happened on the same day that the SCOTUS heard Heller?  Was he trying to bury Heller with his speech or bury his speech with Heller?  I think the later.


Len S

[Ex-MA Hole]

Welcome Len- you the same chap from northeastshooters.com, too?

[Len S]

Sorry NO.  I live outside of but within the stench field of Crook County just outside of the Sodom on the lake known as Chicago.

Len

[Manedwolf]

I wonder who, in today's speech, advised Obama to say that "the Constitution is stained with the original sin of slavery"?

Yeah, that's gonna go over well.

Rule 1 in American politics: Do not denigrate the Constitution.
Rule 2 in American politics: Do not denigrate the Constitution.

I would like to see a black president, or a Hispanic president, or an Asian president...if they were qualified. I don't care what race. I don't even see race. It's just people, all the same, no difference beneath skin and facial features. I care about ability and political platform.

In terms of blacks, I think the best thing would be a qualified black Republican, simply because "Black Democrats", referring to the political group, not the race, just cannot divorce or distance themselves from the politics of anti-white anger. They don't even see the successful blacks in the suburbs, the lawyers and doctors, the investment bankers with a new Range Rover full of kids. To them, it's eternally 1960, and The Man is keeping them down.

Clarence Thomas is black. Condoleeza Rice is black. Both high offices, both Republicans.

What do the Democrats produce? Jesse Jackson. And now Obama, who is picking up the same damned Malcolm X cadence in his speeches that Jackson, Sharpton and the rest use. What is he trying to do, set race relations back 40 years? 

They just can't do otherwise, the Dems. Won't ever learn.

[MechAg94]

I tend to agree with the point that they really won't continue to more forward unless they let go of the anger.  I used to think it would take a couple more generations for that to happen as more and more people of the post-1960's generations grew up, but I am not so sure these days. 

[longrifleman]

I think the best thing would be a qualified black Republican

I had hopes J.C. Watts from Oklahoma would eventually fill that role. Unfortunately, he showed his qualification for the job by quitting politics.

[longeyes]

What is he trying to do, set race relations back 40 years? 

Why yes, those were the good old days, you know, when anger (and drugs) ruled the earth.

[johnster999]

I saw part of Obama's speech. No doubt the man is eloquent but this does not offset the fact that he's been so close to Wright for so long. Sorry, but you just cannot divorce the good side of a man you say you've seen in private from the hateful side shown so overtly in public.

[Manedwolf]

I saw part of Obama's speech. No doubt the man is eloquent but this does not offset the fact that he's been so close to Wright for so long. Sorry, but you just cannot divorce the good side of a man you say you've seen in private from the hateful side shown so overtly in public.

Read the transcript. Once you get past the eloquent brainfog, you see that he is:

1. Being a victim
2. Blaming other people, not Wright
3. Blaming history

[johnster999]

Read the transcript. Once you get past the eloquent brainfog, you see that he is:

1. Being a victim
2. Blaming other people, not Wright
3. Blaming history

And let's not overlook basically saying that some folks just don't "get it".

[longeyes]

We get it.  And we're tired of it.

Unfortunately, what Obama is going to set in motion is a monstrous white backlash.  The more people define themselves as Anything But White, Victimized, and Entitled the more the Moby Dick of the Middle Class will awaken.

There used to be a name for Obama's brand of "eloquence:" empty sophistry.

[Manedwolf]

We get it.  And we're tired of it.

Unfortunately, what Obama is going to set in motion is a monstrous white backlash.  The more people define themselves as Anything But White, Victimized, and Entitled the more the Moby Dick of the Middle Class will awaken.

There used to be a name for Obama's brand of "eloquence:" empty sophistry.

That does a colossal disservice to blacks who have spent the last forty years quietly becoming educated and becoming successful in America, who are now members of the middle, upper middle and upper class just like anyone else of any color. I wonder if he cares.

Probably not.

The civil rights movement was successful. There are no separate water fountains, no segregation, and if anyone of any color cares to educate themselves and work hard, they can have the American dream. As I said...Supreme Court Judge. Secretary of State. The barriers were broken long ago, the war was over.

But for some, that wasn't what they wanted. They got too addicted to the culture of professional victimhood, the reverend-style speeches full of hate and promises of revenge and simmering resentment. To them, the enemy was, and is still the whites, the Jews, the Hispanics, anyone different. THEY are the racists now.

And they're only hurting blacks who instead took the opportunity to have part of the American dream.

[longeyes]

Sure, it does, and I'm not saying all blacks support Rev. Wright.  I'm saying too many do, either overtly or covertly, as witness the defenders of the Reverend's statements according to polling data.  My real point is that Obama is and will be highly divisive.  He is going to be anything but a uniter.

As far as the reality of a white backlash, I'll guess we'll see in November.  Whites have been understanding for a long time, for reasons of guilt or magnanimity.  But no one likes to have that thrown in their faces.  There are a lot of things left to be said about this complicated issue, and a lot of people are going to get angry as the layers are stripped off.

[Manedwolf]

Sure, it does, and I'm not saying all blacks support Rev. Wright.  I'm saying too many do, either overtly or covertly, as witness the defenders of the Reverend's statements according to polling data.  My real point is that Obama is and will be highly divisive.  He is going to be anything but a uniter.

As far as the reality of a white backlash, I'll guess we'll see in November.  Whites have been understanding for a long time, for reasons of guilt or magnanimity.  But no one likes to have that thrown in their faces.  There are a lot of things left to be said about this complicated issue, and a lot of people are going to get angry as the layers are stripped off.

Oh, I meant what Obama is doing now is doing the disservice, not what you said.

He's firing shots in a war that was over long ago.

Also, most people I meet don't resent anything to do with race at all, or dislike any race. They dislike some CULTURES.

They dislike the thug culture of the inner city when it spills out into surrounding areas and gets people robbed and killed. The members of that culture can be white-trash skinheads, MS-13 Hispanics, or gangsta blacks. Often, they're all three.

Yet when anyone says anything bad about that culture, they are branded "racist" by the leftists.

To me, one of the most poignant examples just happened in LA. A truly good black kid, rising football star, close to family, kept off drugs...A car of gang members rolled up to him, asked "Where you from?", as in what gang was he a member of, and then shot him when he didn't answer.

That is a culture and members of that culture that killed him. Not a race.

[longeyes]

Agree.  The whole thing is unbearably sad, really, because it promises to fracture the fabric of nation with the kind of tribalism we decry elsewhere in the world.

[De Selby]

That is a culture and members of that culture that killed him. Not a race.

I guess it was just coincidence that the kid was black and the gang shooters weren't-because we all know that gang members generally aren't racist?

Seriously, I watched that speech and saw a president in the making.  I don't see how you could be more fair on the issue of race than he achieved in this one, nor do I see "victimization" or anything like Malcolm X in there.

My real problem with Obama is that, at root, he's basically got the same policies as Hillary or McCain or George Bush.  None of the candidates are that different-they all do not care about some issues (like gun control), do not really offer any significantly different economic prospects, and are all more or less on the same foreign policy wavelength. 

But the way this campaign is going on, the talk about what a bad job he's doing or what a dumb move this or that was is going to result in some serious foot-in-mouth disease.  That speech was one of the ones that the winning candidate gives.

[Manedwolf]

That is a culture and members of that culture that killed him. Not a race.

I guess it was just coincidence that the kid was black and the gang shooters weren't-because we all know that gang members generally aren't racist?

Seriously, I watched that speech and saw a president in the making.  I don't see how you could be more fair on the issue of race than he achieved in this one, nor do I see "victimization" or anything like Malcolm X in there.

My real problem with Obama is that, at root, he's basically got the same policies as Hillary or McCain or George Bush.  None of the candidates are that different-they all do not care about some issues (like gun control), do not really offer any significantly different economic prospects, and are all more or less on the same foreign policy wavelength. 

But the way this campaign is going on, the talk about what a bad job he's doing or what a dumb move this or that was is going to result in some serious foot-in-mouth disease.  That speech was one of the ones that the winning candidate gives.

Man, now you've gone from CAIR apologist to Obamaniac. 

Might not you be happier over on Daily Kos, where all the people will nod and agree with your every post? You'd be a hero over there.

[doczinn]

I don't see how you could be more fair on the issue of race than he achieved in this one

Really? Comparing that hatefulness spewed from the pulpit to his grandmother, because she stereotyped and was afraid of being mugged?

[longeyes]

Seriously, I watched that speech and saw a president in the making. 

Ah, yes, if only it were 1860 again...

[longeyes]

The civil rights movement was successful. There are no separate water fountains, no segregation, and if anyone of any color cares to educate themselves and work hard, they can have the American dream. As I said...Supreme Court Judge. Secretary of State. The barriers were broken long ago, the war was over.

Right, but the goal was never really just political equality, it was a Marxist transformation of America.  And that takes a perpetual stream of victims and endless poverty.  The movement of black Americans into the middle class had to be blunted, otherwise the social welfare machine would have no purpose.  Answer: import 25 million poor Mexicans, Central Americans, and others.

[roo_ster]

Obama the Magician   [Victor Davis Hanson]

I think the speech has wowed Obamas base, yet after its mesmerizing delivery wears off, it will perhaps raise more questions with most others.

The Obama narratives suggest a disturbing lack of responsibility, or of any notion of free will. Michelle, for example, apparently had no free will in taking out big loans to go to Harvard Law School, only pique that they must be paid back.

Barack had likewise no free will in allying himself as friend, parishioner, and confidant with an abject racist who is now evolved into a former pastor, and a scholar and an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy and controversial (apparently not particularly controversial is now inoperative).

Indeed, the last thing Obama wants, in fact, is an honest, painful discussion about race in America, especially how centuries of racism, but also as well as present demagogic leadership, white guilt, and ineffective and counterproductive government programs, have all factored into present endemic problems of illegitimacy, extraordinary high crime rates, and often racist narratives from the likes of Wright and Farrakhan to rap music  and yet have not precluded the amazing success and parity with the rest of America on the part of well over half of the African-American community.

Two corollaries always follow the Obama victimology: moral equivalence and the subtle suggestion that any who question his thesis of despair are themselves suspect.

So we hear of poor Baracks grandmothers private fears in the same breath as Wrights public hatred. Geraldine Ferraro is understood in the same context as Reverend Wright. The Reagan Coalition and talk radio are identical to Reverend Wright  albeit without similar contexts for their own purported racism. Your own pastor, priest, or rabbi are analogous to Rev. Wright.

And then, of course, your own motives are suspect if you question any of this sophistry. For Michelle it is always they who raised new obstacles against this deprived Ivy League couple and their quest for the Presidency; for Barack it is those who play snippets, or the system of corporate culture that has made Wright the object of anger to similarly victimized poor white pawns.

The message? Wrights motives for espousing hatred are complex and misunderstood; your motives for worrying about Obama and his Pastor are simple and suspect.

When Obama the magician was all done this morning, Obama was no longer under examination for terrible judgment in subsidizing a racist by his association and purse, nor was even the racist Wright under doubt; instead almost everyone else, from the system to his grandmother, to talk radio, to corporate culture, to your rabbi or priest suddenly was.

The result? This will apparently play well with a Democratic African-American audience and white elite liberals, who are already giddy and comparing the speech to Martin Luther Kings best. In this way of thinking, after all, that for the last seven years the most powerful diplomats in the world have been two African-Americans counts little (Wright, for example, slurred Sec. Rice), but that anyone would dare ask a presidential candidate to dissociate himself from a racist counts a lot.

Yet in the general election, millions will still remember how Obamas pastor and confidant Reverend Wright cursed their culture and their country, and they will still remain confused about his relationship with and influence upon their would-be next Presidentand in the end they will be very much angered by all that indeed.

[roo_ster]

Red Diaper Kid   [John Derbyshire]

Having slept on the matter, I am now going to come out of the closet and declare clearly and firmly that I don't like Barack Obama one little bit.

What kind of person would traduce his grandmother (who is still alive) to score a political point? Yesterday's speech, read through in the clear light of dawn, is worse than I thought: an ugly mish-mash of ancient socialist clich?s and Gen-X spoiled-brat self-congratulation, all enveloped in clouds of flatulent Oprahnian rhetoric. Ugh!

Obama's just a red-diaper baby with a nice smile. I actually like Jeremiah Wright better than I like Obama. At least you know where you are with Wright. Obama, I wouldn't trust to mail a letter.

[Sergeant Bob]

Red Diaper Kid   [John Derbyshire]

Having slept on the matter, I am now going to come out of the closet and declare clearly and firmly that I don't like Barack Obama one little bit.

What kind of person would traduce his grandmother (who is still alive) to score a political point? Yesterday's speech, read through in the clear light of dawn, is worse than I thought: an ugly mish-mash of ancient socialist clich?s and Gen-X spoiled-brat self-congratulation, all enveloped in clouds of flatulent Oprahnian rhetoric. Ugh!

Obama's just a red-diaper baby with a nice smile. I actually like Jeremiah Wright better than I like Obama. At least you know where you are with Wright. Obama, I wouldn't trust to mail a letter.

Isn't that "red diaper baby" a euphemism attributable to Michael Savage? I bet he'll be having a ball with that one on his radio show.

[longeyes]

Obama has created a new art form: Political Rap.

Yes, the rhythm is different and it has a Harvard inflection but at bottom it's not that different.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

caramba!  the planets must be strangely aligned. was reading longeyes posts and nodding my head.and i can't remember last time i heard sophistry used so well