Author Topic: Learn from history... or else!!  (Read 7811 times)

oldfart

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Learn from history... or else!!
« on: November 13, 2008, 10:59:38 PM »
Found on another site.

Friends,

Will you please take the time to read this, and if you think it worthwhile, pass it along to your email list, and ask them to read it? Even if they voted, with all good intentions, for Mr. Obama?

I am a student of history. Professionally. I have written 15 books in six languages, and have studied it all my life. I think there is something monumentally large afoot, and I do not believe it is just a banking crisis, or a mortgage crisis, or a credit crisis. Yes these exist, but they are merely single facets on a very large gemstone that is only now coming into a sharper focus.

Something of historic proportions is happening. I can sense it because I know how it feels, smells, what it looks like, and how people react to it. Yes, a perfect storm may be brewing, but there is something happening within our country that has been evolving for about ten - fifteen years. The pace has dramatically quickened in the past two.

We demand and then codify into law the requirement that our banks make massive loans to people we know they can never pay back? Why?

We learn just days ago that the Federal Reserve, which has little or no real oversight by anyone, has “loaned” two trillion dollars (that is $2,000,000,000,000) over the past few months, but will not tell us to whom or why or disclose the terms. That is our money. Yours and mine. And that is three times the 700B we all argued about so strenuously just this past September. Who has this money? Why do they have it? Why are the terms unavailable to us? Who asked for it? Who authorized it? I thought this was a government of “we the people,” who loaned our powers to our elected leaders. Apparently not.

We have spent two or more decades intentionally de-industrializing our economy. Why?

We have intentionally dumbed down our schools, ignored our history, and no longer teach our founding documents, why we are exceptional, and why we are worth preserving. Students by and large cannot write, think critically, read, or articulate. Parents are not revolting, teachers are not picketing, school boards continue to back mediocrity. Why?

We have now established the precedent of protesting every close election (now violently in California over a proposition that is so controversial that it wants marriage to remain between one man and one woman. Did you ever think such a thing possible just a decade ago?). We have corrupted our sacred political process by allowing unelected judges to write laws that radically change our way of life, and then mainstream Marxist groups like ACORN and others to turn our voting system into a banana republic. To what purpose?

Now our mortgage industry is collapsing, housing prices are in free fall, major industries are failing, our banking system is on the verge of collapse, social security is nearly bankrupt, as is medicare and our entire government, our education system is worse than a joke (I teach college and know precisely what I am talking about)–the list is staggering in its length, breadth, and depth. It is potentially 1929 x ten. And we are at war with an enemy we cannot name for fear of offending people of the same religion, who cannot wait to slit the throats of your children if they have the opportunity to do so.

And now we have elected a man no one knows anything about, who has never run so much as a Dairy Queen, let alone a town as big as Wasilla, Alaska. All of his associations and alliances are with real radicals in their chosen fields of employment, and everything we learn about him, drip by drip, is unsettling if not downright scary (Surely you have heard him speak about his idea to create and fund a mandatory civilian defense force stronger than our military for use inside our borders? No? Oh of course. The media would never play that for you over and over and then demand he answer it. Sarah Palin’s pregnant daughter and $150,000 wardrobe is more imporant.)

Mr. Obama’s winning platform can be boiled down to one word: change.

Why?

I have never been so afraid for my country and for my children as I am now.

This man campaigned on bringing people together, something he has never, ever done in his professional life. In my assessment, Obama will divide us along philosophical lines, push us apart, and then try to realign the pieces into a new and different power structure. Change is indeed coming. And when it comes, you will never see the same nation again.

And that is only the beginning.

And I thought I would never be able to experience what the ordinary, moral German felt in the mid-1930s. In those times, the savior was a former smooth-talking rabble-rouser from the streets, about whom the average German knew next to nothing. What they did know was that he was associated with groups that shouted, shoved, and pushed around people with whom they disagreed; he edged his way onto the political stage through great oratory and promises. Economic times were tough, people were losing jobs, and he was a great speaker. And he smiled and waved a lot. And people, even newspapers, were afraid to speak out for fear that his “brown shirts” would bully them into submission. And then, he was duly elected to office, a full-throttled economic crisis at hand [the Great Depression]. Slowly but surely he seized the controls of government power, department by department, person by person, bureaucracy by bureaucracy. The kids joined a Youth Movement in his name, where they were taught what to think. How did he get the people on his side? He did it promising jobs to the jobless, money to the moneyless, and goodies for the military-industrial complex. He did it by indoctrinating the children, advocating gun control, health care for all, better wages, better jobs, and promising to re-instill pride once again in the country, across Europe, and across the world.

He did it with a compliant media–did you know that? And he did this all in the name of justice and . . . change. And the people surely got what they voted for.

(Look it up if you think I am exaggerating.)

Read your history books. Many people objected in 1933 and were shouted down, called names, laughed at, and made fun of. When Winston Churchill pointed out the obvious in the late 1930s while seated in the House of Lords in England (he was not yet Prime Minister), he was booed into his seat and called a crazy troublemaker. He was right, though.

Don’t forget that Germany was the most educated, cultured country in Europe. It was full of music, art, museums, hospitals, laboratories, and universities. And in less than six years–a shorter time span than just two terms of the U. S. presidency–it was rounding up its own citizens, killing others, abrogating its laws, turning children against parents, and neighbors against neighbors. All with the best of intentions, of course. The road to Hell is paved with them.

As a practical thinker, one not overly prone to emotional decisions, I have a choice: I can either believe what the objective pieces of evidence tell me (even if they make me cringe with disgust); I can believe what history is shouting to me from across the chasm of seven decades; or I can hope I am wrong by closing my eyes, having another latte, and ignoring what is transpiring around me.

Some people scoff at me, others laugh, or think I am foolish, naive, or both. Perhaps I am. But I have never been afraid to look people in the eye and tell them exactly what I believe–and why I believe it.

I pray I am wrong. I do not think I am.

Best regards

tps

Standing Wolf

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2008, 09:30:13 AM »
Quote
I can either believe what the objective pieces of evidence tell me (even if they make me cringe with disgust); I can believe what history is shouting to me from across the chasm of seven decades; or I can hope I am wrong by closing my eyes, having another latte, and ignoring what is transpiring around me.

I believe it may be worthwhile to look at the record of the past two centuries in simple terms: even governments with the best intentions, (our own once upon a time,) invariably make wretched messes of things.

That saidâ„¢, it's apparent the vast majority of people still have more faith in government than ourselves.
No tyrant should ever be allowed to die of natural causes.

Tallpine

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2008, 11:10:28 AM »
I feel like I am watching a train wreck in slow motion, and not able to do a thing to stop it.
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2008, 01:11:01 PM »
While some interesting parallels can be drawn, I don't give Obama nearly enough credit to pull something of that nature off.  He'd have to figure out how to get around congress and have the drive to actually start armed conflicts with other nations.

No, I think he's just an idealistic liberal; not particularly hell bent on preforming a military takeover of the world.  I think he'll try to implement his grand socialist ideals; and look confused and bewildered when none of it works.

oldfart

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2008, 01:23:05 PM »
Nick, I hope fervently that you are right but I don't think it is unreasonable to prepare for the possibility that you are not.

On a side note:  A letter to the editor of the local fishwrap compared Obama to JFK.  My wife smiled and said something to the effect, 'One can only hope.'  I chose not to ask whether she was referring to the life of JFK or the end of it.  She is a good Christian though.  :angel: :rolleyes:

Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2008, 01:25:17 PM »
Nick, I hope fervently that you are right but I don't think it is unreasonable to prepare for the possibility that you are not.

How exactly can one prepare for such an event?

What could a German citizen in 1933 do, beyond expatriate?

Racehorse

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2008, 01:28:53 PM »
The one thing that gives me hope is that the members of the U.S. military are still largely patriotic and would not just blindly obey any orders to attack or suppress the populace.

freakazoid

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2008, 01:32:35 PM »
Unless they where made to believe that the populace is the enemy.
"so I ended up getting the above because I didn't want to make a whole production of sticking something between my knees and cranking. To me, the cranking on mine is pretty effortless, at least on the coarse setting. Maybe if someone has arthritis or something, it would be more difficult for them." - Ben

"I see a rager at least once a week." - brimic

MicroBalrog

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2008, 01:36:01 PM »
How exactly can one prepare for such an event?

What could a German citizen in 1933 do, beyond expatriate?

Protest. Do you think they'd still do it if, say, half a million people were in the streets, loudly refusing to put up with it?

And if that fails, there is always another solution.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2008, 01:36:21 PM »
The one thing that gives me hope is that the members of the U.S. military are still largely patriotic and would not just blindly obey any orders to attack or suppress the populace.

I don't put much faith in this.

Hate is a powerful thing, and the meaning of words can and does change.  Labels are powerful things.

So you illegally keep semi-automatic rifles after they are banned by EO...  Guess what?  You are now a "domestic terrorist"! 

And who doesn't hate domestic terrorists?  :lol:

oldfart

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2008, 01:39:31 PM »
Nick, I'm hardly ignorant but I know that others have addressed your question before and any attempt I might make would be worse than foolish so let me offer a quote from one who lived to regret his inaction:

"At what exact point, then, should one resist? When one's belt is taken away. When one is ordered to face into a corner? When one crosses the threshold of one's home? . . . ."
 ....And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say goodbye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling in terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand. The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst; the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! .... If . . . if . . . We didn't love freedom enough. And even more - we had no awareness of the real situation. . . . We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward." -- Alexander  Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago

Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2008, 01:47:09 PM »
Point well stated.

We didn't love freedom enough. And even more - we had no awareness of the real situation. . . . We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.

Sadly, this is the state which I believe we (the American people) are in.


Protest. Do you think they'd still do it if, say, half a million people were in the streets, loudly refusing to put up with it?

And if that fails, there is always another solution.

The problem is, a half-million people won't take a week off work to protest.  I don't believe a half-million people would take to the streets for much of anything.  We've got food, water, heat and electricity.  Provided that doesn't change, people won't openly protest.  I don't believe they value freedom that much.  People don't want choices, risks and consequences.

I may well be wrong, but this is my observation from daily life.  I suppose time will tell.

(Edited to fix double-negative - Doh!)
« Last Edit: November 14, 2008, 01:55:22 PM by Nick1911 »

K Frame

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2008, 02:02:24 PM »
One more assassination reference, thinly veiled or otherwise, will result in two things:

Closure of the thread.

PERMANANT BAN for the individual making the statement.


Such statements do not, by any stretch of the imagination, meet with the stated goals of Armed Polite Society.

Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

freakazoid

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2008, 03:02:34 PM »
Has someone made one? And why punish the thread for the post of one person?
"so I ended up getting the above because I didn't want to make a whole production of sticking something between my knees and cranking. To me, the cranking on mine is pretty effortless, at least on the coarse setting. Maybe if someone has arthritis or something, it would be more difficult for them." - Ben

"I see a rager at least once a week." - brimic

Bigjake

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #14 on: November 14, 2008, 03:08:56 PM »


Hate is a powerful thing, and the meaning of words can and does change.  Labels are powerful things.


We have a winner. 

The libs have managed to control the whole dialog, not just the labels.  Political Correctness anyone?  He who controls the terms controls the whole conversation.

Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2008, 03:13:41 PM »
Has someone made one?

Someone had - the post was deleted.

K Frame

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #16 on: November 14, 2008, 03:31:02 PM »
Has someone made one? And why punish the thread for the post of one person?

It's called cutting the rot back to the quick.

There are FAR too many lemmings on this board who will gladly jump on the chest beating, monkey hooting, poo flinging bandwagon.

Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

mtnbkr

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #17 on: November 14, 2008, 03:40:10 PM »
If you have any poo, fling it now.

Chris

HankB

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2008, 03:50:19 PM »
While some interesting parallels can be drawn, I don't give Obama nearly enough credit to pull something of that nature off. 
BHO had an awfully fast rise for a man with no real accomplishments. Who was behind him - and what do they expect now?
Trump won in 2016. Democrats haven't been so offended since Republicans came along and freed their slaves.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2008, 03:51:51 PM »
Quote
PERMANANT BAN for the individual making the statement.

Psst? Mike? Permanant is not a word. Permanent is.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2008, 03:52:33 PM »
BHO had an awfully fast rise for a man with no real accomplishments. Who was behind him - and what do they expect now?

1) The Democratic Party
2) Socialism

Nitrogen

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2008, 04:09:09 PM »
While some interesting parallels can be drawn, I don't give Obama nearly enough credit to pull something of that nature off.  He'd have to figure out how to get around congress and have the drive to actually start armed conflicts with other nations.

No, I think he's just an idealistic liberal; not particularly hell bent on preforming a military takeover of the world.  I think he'll try to implement his grand socialist ideals; and look confused and bewildered when none of it works.

He doesn't have to figure ANYTHING out.  Our previous president has already set precedents for bypassing congress, and increasing executive power beyond its limits.

Are you glad nobody stopped him yet?
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Nick1911

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2008, 04:13:01 PM »
He doesn't have to figure ANYTHING out.  Our previous president has already set precedents for bypassing congress, and increasing executive power beyond its limits.

Are you glad nobody stopped him yet?


Citation, please?

Monkeyleg

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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2008, 06:26:37 PM »
Quote
...monkey hooting...

Wait a minute. I don't "hoot." Growl, maybe, but not hoot.

As for the original post, we're far from the conditions that brought about Nazi Germany. Their Great Depression made ours look like a stock market downtick, and their grievances--perceived or otherwise--over the loss of the Sudetenland, national pride and other factors is something we haven't experienced.

Comparing Bush or Obama or any current public figure to Hitler or political parties to the Nazis only diminishes the truth about what happened. Words do matter, and using words like "Nazi" is something that should be done with caution.


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Re: Learn from history... or else!!
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2008, 06:30:53 PM »
Psst? Mike? Permanant is not a word. Permanent is.
It is written: Thou shalt not put the Irwin thy overlord to the test.