Author Topic: George Zimmerman Trial  (Read 219262 times)

makattak

  • Dark Lord of the Cis
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,022
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #475 on: July 18, 2013, 02:24:19 PM »
And I'm sick of the post trial moral equivalence game, it was just a tragedy, Martin had a right to be there, etc.

Zimmerman made tactical mistakes, not moral ones. He had a right to be in his neighborhood and history suggests that he gave a crap about it. Martin was a guest in that neighborhood. In countless cities and foreign countries I have conducted myself in accordance with local norms despite what I may want to do. If I don't belong I can feel it and I act accordingly. Let's call a thug a thug.

Brilliant and succinct. Precisely the point.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

lupinus

  • Southern Mod Trimutive Emeritus
  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,178
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #476 on: July 18, 2013, 03:29:19 PM »
That is all. *expletive deleted*ck you all, eat *expletive deleted*it, and die in a fire. I have considered writing here a long parting section dedicated to each poster, but I have decided, at length, against it. *expletive deleted*ck you all and Hail Satan.

brimic

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14,270
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #477 on: July 18, 2013, 04:05:53 PM »
Quote
In a way, I think we've lost something as a society by culling our ability to fight honorably to settle disputes.

Yes, God made man and Sam Colt made them equal.  I get it.  But not everything is a life and death altercation.

Learning to fight is important.  Learning to win a fight is important.  Learning to lose a fight is important.  Learning when to stop fighting is important.  And learning when to never stop fighting is important.

People need to know how to take a punch.  People need to know when they've won a fight and stop it graciously before the pounding results in more than a swollen face and cracked ribs, and results in something life threatening or altering.

'Honor fighting' is for clowns.
What we really need more than drivel you wrote above is for people to stuff their egos and machismo and walk away because of a very good possibility of a death if physical aggression begins.



"now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb" -Dark Helmet

"AK47's belong in the hands of soldiers mexican drug cartels"-
Barack Obama

Ryan in Maine

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 598
Re: The take-away
« Reply #478 on: July 18, 2013, 04:08:25 PM »
I'm just saying that in a world with honor, this would have just been a fight conversation between two men and left at that.

Fixed.  =D

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,327
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #479 on: July 18, 2013, 04:10:44 PM »
'Honor fighting' is for clowns.

Honor-fighting clowns. Now that I'd like to see.
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

BobR

  • Just a pup compared to a few old dogs here!
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,245
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #480 on: July 18, 2013, 05:24:32 PM »
Quote
Let's call a thug a thug.

What makes you call him a thug? Trial comments, or things that have come out since the shooting? Just curious, really, I am.

bob

Tallpine

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,172
  • Grumpy Old Grandpa
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #481 on: July 18, 2013, 05:27:55 PM »
Quote
I'm just saying that in a world with honor, this would have just been a fight between two men and left at that.


In a world with honor, this would have just been a polite conversation between two men and left at that.

I'm not black, but I'm very aware that there might be times when something innocent that I'm doing might appear suspicious.  Just stand up straight, speak friendly like and explain if necessary.

What makes you call him a thug? Trial comments, or things that have come out since the shooting? Just curious, really, I am.

bob

Walking up to somebody and beating on them with no provocation  :facepalm:

Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,327
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #482 on: July 18, 2013, 05:42:23 PM »
Hey, Florida. The next time the outrage industry tries to shame you into doing something, tell them to jump from a bridge. Cause you appeased it, and it still hates you.

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2013/07/18/Jesse-Jackson-Calls-To-Boycott-Florida-as-Apartheid-State
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

Tallpine

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,172
  • Grumpy Old Grandpa
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #483 on: July 18, 2013, 05:51:50 PM »
Wonder if we would have heard much about the trial of Trayvon Martin for beating a mexican guy to death?  =|  ;/


Oh, and speaking of thugs - I just found this:
http://ericpetersautos.com/2013/07/17/thoughts-about-saint-trayvon/
« Last Edit: July 18, 2013, 06:05:54 PM by Tallpine »
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

Phyphor

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,327
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #484 on: July 18, 2013, 06:09:24 PM »
Honor-fighting clowns. Now that I'd like to see.

Cream pies at 15 paces!

"You know what's messed-up about taxes?
You don't even pay taxes. They take tax.
You get your check, money gone.
That ain't a payment, that's a jack." - Chris Rock "Bigger and Blacker"
He slapped his rifle. "This is one of the best arguments for peace there is. Nobody wants to shoot if somebody is going to shoot back. " Callaghen, Callaghen, Louis La'mour

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,197
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #485 on: July 18, 2013, 07:20:48 PM »
Just got home from Scouts, helping boys prep for a Philmont trip.  Hawk, do you know if this type of "self defense defense" is common outside of Ohio?

Everything I know on the subject (which is very little) I cribbed from Frank Ettin, who is a moderator at M1911.ORG and The Firing Line. Frank is a California attorney who teaches the legal part of the course when Massad Ayoob is doing classes in California. Frank knows his stuff. Better to ask someone like him.

My understanding is that Ohio's position is pretty much unique.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,197
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #486 on: July 18, 2013, 07:32:03 PM »
Very interesting. I'm assuming Holder will back off as soon as this information crosses his desk.  :rofl:

I guess the info hasn't yet reached his desk. Holder has told the Sanford PD not to return Zimmerman's gun, because the DOJ wants all evidence held while they pursue their investigation.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2369592/Justice-Department-places-hold-Trayvon-Martin-trial-evidence-including-George-Zimmermans-gun--Florida-law-says-returned-him.html

That doesn't mean Zimmerman can't buy another gun. (Unless the DOJ has put a hold on him in the NICS system which would be a violation of his rights since he is now officially innocent* of the crime charged, and is not under indictment or charge for any other crime.)






* Yes, I am aware that people like to say "He isn't innocent, he's not guilty." However, the foundation of our legal system does not provide for any such status as "not guilty." We are legally presumed to be innocent until proven guilty beyond reasonable doubt. Zimmerman was NOT proved guilty beyond reasonable doubt, ergo he is innocent. As an innocent man, not convicted of any disqualifying offenses and not under indictment, he has a RIGHT to purchase a firearm in accordance with the laws of the federal and Florida governments.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2013, 11:46:02 PM by Hawkmoon »
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,197
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #487 on: July 18, 2013, 07:35:36 PM »
Wonder if we would have heard much about the trial of Trayvon Martin for beating a mexican guy to death?

Interesting point.

And I suspect you onto something. If Zimmerman had lost (and died) I'll bet he would have been Mexican or Hispanic, not "white."
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

Tallpine

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,172
  • Grumpy Old Grandpa
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #488 on: July 18, 2013, 10:03:48 PM »
George is welcome to move into my neighborhood.  He can take his shotgun out and profile coyotes anytime he wants  :P
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

Levant

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 561
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #489 on: July 19, 2013, 12:04:13 AM »
For those who think Zimmerman shouldn't have profiled Martin for wearing a hoodie, did you see the news today about Monday's robbery of a Dollar Store in Milwaukee?  The guy in the hoodie goes in, waves at the camera because he knows he won't be recognized, shoots the manager, kidnaps the female assistant manager, and they find her body  two miles away.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2369039/Breanna-Machus-Body-just-miles-missing-woman-20-abducted-deadly-dollar-store-heist.html

The surprising thing is what I discovered when I googled to find a link to the story for this post.  Apparently, among hoodie wearing thugs, robbing Dollar Stores is a favorite pastime.  Out of 10 results on the first page, in addition to the story about the Milwaukee robbery, there were these other 6 separate robbery articles.

http://www.jacksonsun.com/article/20130617/NEWS01/306170027/Jackson-police-seek-men-who-robbed-two-Dollar-General-Stores

http://wtvr.com/2012/03/30/police-women-in-hoodies-arrested-for-family-dollar-store-robbery/

http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/215269601.html

http://hillsandheights.org/2013/01/30/armed-robbery-at-jahnke-dollar-store/

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2013/05/armed_robbers_hold_up_family_d.html

http://www.9news.com/news/article/194916/188/Employee-shot-after-robbery-at-dollar-store-

Of those who rob, a very high percentage are wearing hoodies.  Many others wear hoodies because they're emulating thugs or they want to be thugs. 

When I see someone with a hoodie up over their head and it's not a blizzard then I watch for the worst.  It's not racial; it's behavioral.
NEOKShooter on GRM
Republicans: The other Democratic Party

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,197
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #490 on: July 19, 2013, 12:15:38 AM »
In other news, did anyone see the interview between Piers Morgan and Ms. Jeantel, the prosecution's "star" witness in the Zimmerman trial? In the interview, she stated that "cracka" (she insists it's spelled with an 'a' rather than 'er') doesn't mean "white people," it means "the police."

That's news to me, and I suspect it's probably news to just about everybody. IMHO, she lied ... trying to put a different spin in the story after the fact, because what the trial showed clearly is that it was Trayvon Martin who was both the aggressor AND the racist, not George Zimmerman. So Ms. Jeantel is now working at ex post facto damage control.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,327
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #491 on: July 19, 2013, 12:33:13 AM »
My tummy is too delicate to watch it, but I've heard a lot of the content. What really cracks me up is that she has Martin saying he thought Z was a cop or security guard ("cracka"). Which is funny, because part of Martin's defense used to be that he didn't know who Z was. Then she covers for that with this alleged concern about Z being a pederast on the hunt.

I've never heard her definition of "cracka" before, but I can imagine it being used that way. A lot of people think that "cracker" refers to those who cracked the whip on slaves, and they might think of police or security guards in that way.
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

freakazoid

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,243
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #492 on: July 19, 2013, 12:38:52 AM »
Don't you people realize? The jury is old skool people, she is part of the new skool.
"so I ended up getting the above because I didn't want to make a whole production of sticking something between my knees and cranking. To me, the cranking on mine is pretty effortless, at least on the coarse setting. Maybe if someone has arthritis or something, it would be more difficult for them." - Ben

"I see a rager at least once a week." - brimic

Monkeyleg

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14,589
  • Tattaglia is a pimp.
    • http://www.gunshopfinder.com
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #493 on: July 19, 2013, 12:52:06 AM »
She ain't part o no skool. She kant evinn reed.

Matthew Carberry

  • Formerly carebear
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,281
  • Fiat justitia, pereat mundus
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #494 on: July 19, 2013, 03:37:42 AM »
* Yes, I am aware that people like to say "He isn't innocent, he's not guilty." However, the foundation of our legal system does not provide for any such status as "not guilty." We are legally presumed to be innocent until proven guilty beyond reasonable doubt. Zimmerman was NOT proved guilty beyond reasonable doubt, ergo he is innocent. As an innocent man, not convicted of any disqualifying offenses and not under indictment, he has a RIGHT to purchase a firearm in accordance with the laws of the federal and Florida governments.

Two different things people conflate. He remains an innocent man found not guilty of a particular criminal charge.

Even if convicted he would remain innocent of every other charge he wasn't convicted on. For all its faults, our system is pretty merciful by intent.
"Not all unwise laws are unconstitutional laws, even where constitutional rights are potentially involved." - Eugene Volokh

"As for affecting your movement, your Rascal should be able to achieve the the same speeds no matter what holster rig you are wearing."

Matthew Carberry

  • Formerly carebear
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,281
  • Fiat justitia, pereat mundus
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #495 on: July 19, 2013, 03:46:08 AM »
Uh-oh: http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

The critical race theory response took about 5 minutes to hit the 'net.

Blacks get off more because they kill more blacks.

See, racist non-black juries are willing to forego their normal impulse to convict black killers as long as the victim is black. Then the black killer gets honorary non-black status for doing the job.

I'm summarizing, but that is the absurd logic stripped bare of its critical theory trappings.
"Not all unwise laws are unconstitutional laws, even where constitutional rights are potentially involved." - Eugene Volokh

"As for affecting your movement, your Rascal should be able to achieve the the same speeds no matter what holster rig you are wearing."

Matthew Carberry

  • Formerly carebear
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,281
  • Fiat justitia, pereat mundus
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #496 on: July 19, 2013, 03:53:55 AM »
We actually have a system in place for "honor fighting" in Western society, have for well over a century. Both men meet in a ring, with witnesses and dispassionate referees to intervene if necessary and obey the Marquis de Queensbury rules on pain of dishonor and/or criminal charges.

That isn't a street fight, it's a sporting contest. Ironically, I believe Trayvon's phone contained a video and discussion of him fighting one.

What he did in the dark had nothing to do with honor.
"Not all unwise laws are unconstitutional laws, even where constitutional rights are potentially involved." - Eugene Volokh

"As for affecting your movement, your Rascal should be able to achieve the the same speeds no matter what holster rig you are wearing."

French G.

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 10,183
  • ohhh sparkles!
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #497 on: July 19, 2013, 05:09:23 AM »
What makes you call him a thug? Trial comments, or things that have come out since the shooting? Just curious, really, I am.

bob

Let's see, being expelled from school for infractions that should have got him a free squad car ride, facebook endorsement of drug use and irresponsible weapons ownership, and oh yeah, assault and battery on a creepy cracker. It was February, he was 200 miles from where he should have been attending school. Sounds like a young manreally on his way up in the world.
AKA Navy Joe   

I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

Fitz

  • Face-melter
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,254
  • Floyd Rose is my homeboy
    • My Book
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #498 on: July 19, 2013, 06:31:41 AM »
Honor fights

What a joke
Fitz

---------------
I have reached a conclusion regarding every member of this forum.
I no longer respect any of you. I hope the following offends you as much as this thread has offended me:
You are all awful people. I mean this *expletive deleted*ing seriously.

-MicroBalrog

griz

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3,030
Re: George Zimmerman Trial
« Reply #499 on: July 19, 2013, 07:47:56 AM »
In other news, did anyone see the interview between Piers Morgan and Ms. Jeantel, the prosecution's "star" witness in the Zimmerman trial? In the interview, she stated that "cracka" (she insists it's spelled with an 'a' rather than 'er') doesn't mean "white people," it means "the police."

I see no reason to ever watch Mr. Morgan, but that is interesting.  In Ms Jeantel's sworn testimony she said that the term Cracker (they didn't cover the spelling) did mean white person.  Here is the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sJZw5-nDWg

In this instance, and others, she apparently has a rather fluid interpretation of facts, truth, and what words actually mean.
Sent from a stone age computer via an ordinary keyboard.