Author Topic: Van Halen question  (Read 8361 times)

Monkeyleg

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Van Halen question
« on: January 14, 2017, 11:32:01 AM »
Every time Rolling Stone does a list of the top 100 guitarists of all time, Eddie Van Halen is in the top ten. I don't get it.

Can someone explain to me what makes Eddie Van Halen a great guitarist?

Kingcreek

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2017, 11:50:13 AM »
He was more loud.
What we have here is failure to communicate.

BobR

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2017, 12:58:52 PM »
Because when he came along he was getting sounds out of a guitar that had never been heard before, and finger tapping the fret board which allowed him to move much faster than using a pic.

Now days everyone is doing that stuff but he was the one who started and brought it along.

bob


BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2017, 01:17:16 PM »
Have no clue.

But then I don't get half those list and I dislike the idea that being technically adapt trumps overall musicality, which seems to be the theme in a lot of those lists.

Notice that Neil Young never makes those lists and I would consider him to be a great among performers with a guitar.

What's the good of being able to move your fingers all fast and hit the fiddly notes if what your playing sucks anyway?

Jimi Hendrix deserves to be on lists like that. I seriously question a lot of the others.
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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2017, 01:22:13 PM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaKgj9DqxhE

another one that never makes those lists.
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dm1333

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2017, 01:30:57 PM »

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2017, 01:34:50 PM »
Neil Young made the list but not Vince Gill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLbnWr1-Qsc&list=PLt3KXfnMzcin4WL2WxlAM8NdMoMTjQMn4



He was at 17. Les Paul was at 18 and Santana was at 20, while Eddie is in the top ten? This is where the dispute comes up.

and good god, Johnny Ramone is on that list (and at 28). I love the Ramones and I'm the big proponent of sound over skill and EVEN I think that's messed up.
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BobR

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2017, 01:37:59 PM »
I really enjoy classical and flamenco guitar.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4YngQ49dSw


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaP_egKUgWY

None of these makes lists, especially Rolling Stone.

:(

bob

eta: I just cruised the list..... Dick Dale made it at number 74.  The King of Surf Guitar!!!!  :)

dm1333

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2017, 01:47:00 PM »

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2017, 01:49:21 PM »
I can't click those links. I've gotten distracted.

"Rock rock rock away beach. rock rock rock away beach. we can catch a ride to rock away beach..."
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Monkeyleg

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2017, 01:54:22 PM »
I looked at some Van Halen videos, and I still don't understand.

Rolling Stone put Van Halen ahead of Stevie Ray Vaughan. To me that's unthinkable. As much as I love Keith Richards, he doesn't deserve to be #4. He's not that great a guitarist; his forte is coming up with great riffs.

They always have Eric Clapton at #2. He's overrated.

As Frank Zappa once said about rock reviewers (Rolling Stone was implied), it's people who can't write interviewing people who can't play for people who can't read.

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2017, 01:56:16 PM »
I looked at some Van Halen videos, and I still don't understand.

Rolling Stone put Van Halen ahead of Stevie Ray Vaughan. To me that's unthinkable. As much as I love Keith Richards, he doesn't deserve to be #4. He's not that great a guitarist; his forte is coming up with great riffs.

They always have Eric Clapton at #2. He's overrated.

As Frank Zappa once said about rock reviewers (Rolling Stone was implied), it's people who can't write interviewing people who can't play for people who can't read.

thank you. I loath Clapton and agree he's overrated, but I'm always keep my mouth shut because his fans are scary.
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Monkeyleg

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2017, 02:58:58 PM »
thank you. I loath Clapton and agree he's overrated, but I'm always keep my mouth shut because his fans are scary.

Clapton is extremely proficient, and he knows all the licks. What comes out, though, just doesn't seem to have soul. That's why I like SRV so much. It seemed like every ounce of his being was coming out through his fingers and never stopped. Nobody else plays as intensely for so long.

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2017, 03:02:39 PM »
Clapton is extremely proficient, and he knows all the licks. What comes out, though, just doesn't seem to have soul. That's why I like SRV so much. It seemed like every ounce of his being was coming out through his fingers and never stopped. Nobody else plays as intensely for so long.

I can agree. He always comes off to me as an pretentious egomaniac without the creative talent to be worth putting up with. Someone like Fripp or Anderson, fine, they can be that way. Clapton? Not so much.

I like Cream. Cream was good. Bruce and Baker kept Clapton in check and provided the soul. It was all downhill after than.
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HeroHog

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2017, 03:22:00 PM »
Robin Trower, Vince Converse, Joe Bonamassa should all be on any list of great guitarists.  :mad:

 :old:
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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2017, 03:28:02 PM »
77. Willie Nelson (AYFKM?)
75. Joni Mitchell (someone's doing acid...)
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Tuco

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2017, 04:01:11 PM »
No one can really explain it.  It's like Hendrix or Clapton.  Both are limited to pentatonic/major scale riffs, and are consistently rated "greater than" Zappa or Clarence White or Carlton or Baxter. 
Jimmy Page was great, and so was Townsend.  Neither were most excellent as technical aspect.
Really think about it.  Would any of the top Greats make a wage as a session guitarist?  No. It's the band they were with, the times, the image.

It's the definition of "Greatest" that needs to be addressed.  It's intentionally vague.
Not fastest, not melodic, Not anything other than Great.
The Flintstones was great.  Hitler was great.  I made a great dump this morning.

Second, consider the source.
Rolling stone stopped being relevant over 30 years ago.
My guess is it's a readers poll or, even worse, a poll of RS staff and content providers.

The most glaring evidence of the list's irrelevance is it's rating of Neil Young above Willie Nelson.

Willie Nelson is a very good guitarist.  He's able to write melodies over complex chord changes, and his lead guitar technique is accurate and tight, yet never forced.  He has a lot of Django coming out of Trigger.  And he's arguably "Great" because of his historical relevance and endurance.  He's an icon, as is Neil Young, the difference being Willie can play circles around him and  Young would fall over dizzy.  Willie would then grab Hank William's Martin and run, righting one of the greatest guitar travesties of the last 40 years.
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2017, 04:11:37 PM »
Interesting list.
Coming fro Rolling Stoned it's predictably tilted to R&R.
An fitting addendum would be to list the great talents that tragically shortened their own lives with booze, drugs and hard living.
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2017, 04:17:56 PM »
77. Willie Nelson (AYFKM?)
75. Joni Mitchell (someone's doing acid...)


Even as a fan of Willie I gotta agree with you. I could list any number of country guitar players that are/were far better. Roy Clark, Buck Owens, Jerry Reed, Ricky Skaggs, Lester Flatt...
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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Monkeyleg

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2017, 05:06:25 PM »
Interesting list.
Coming fro Rolling Stoned it's predictably tilted to R&R.
An fitting addendum would be to list the great talents that tragically shortened their own lives with booze, drugs and hard living.

It's tilted, but Clapton is known primarily for Blues. BB King made #6 last year, although they probably felt like they had to include him.

Every "top 100" list is going to be biased toward the writer's tastes, but some things seem obvious.

I saw a YouTube video with the 25 greatest riffs of all time. One was "Smoke On the Water". A two year-old with no experience with guitar could learn that in ten minutes.

roo_ster

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2017, 05:10:03 PM »
I really enjoy classical and flamenco guitar.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4YngQ49dSw


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaP_egKUgWY

None of these makes lists, especially Rolling Stone.

:(

bob

eta: I just cruised the list..... Dick Dale made it at number 74.  The King of Surf Guitar!!!!  :)


Love classical guitar.  

Some classical guitar of a different flavor:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olW6-jhSgMg

And when did Eddie van Halen get so damned old?  

Regards,

roo_ster

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T.O.M.

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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2017, 09:22:44 PM »
As to Eddie, I was a teen in the Days of MTV.  Van Halen was at high popularity.  Jump, Panama, etc.  The Van Halen became Van Hagar.  I like a lot of both (sacrilege, I know).  I think Eddie is talented, and great, but I'd not make him #1.
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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2017, 11:52:45 PM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaKgj9DqxhE

another one that never makes those lists.

Bless your perceptive ears!

Also, Gilmour is a tad low at only 14.
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Re: Van Halen question
« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2017, 12:13:51 AM »

Jimmy Page was great, and so was Townsend.  Neither were most excellent as technical aspect.
Really think about it.  Would any of the top Greats make a wage as a session guitarist?  No. It's the band they were with, the times, the image.


Actually, Page was doing pretty well as a session guitarist before joining The Yardbirds.

Agreed on considering the source.  Such lists are entirely subjective and mostly a waste of time.
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