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Author Topic: Give me light bulbs or give me death.  (Read 1474 times)
230RN
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« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2017, 07:55:00 AM »

For general lighting, I'll stick with LED's.  But out in my garage I prefer 100W incandescent.

BTW, at Sam's Club last week I bought a 6-pack of 9 watt (800 lumen) GE LED lights for less than $6.  That's a crazy-good price.

Yes, I noticed a dimming of flourescents in my unheated garage shop, too.

I was going to mention those verschtunkener gas cans too, but focused on those verschtunkener CFLs.

Terry
« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 03:10:46 PM by 230RN » Logged

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« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2017, 08:01:19 AM »

I've seen a couple of people saying that within the next 2 to 3 years the low end LEDs (5,000 to 10,000 hour life) are going to hit a price point that is very close name brand incandescents.

I really doubt that they'll ever go that low, but there's no denying that LED bulb prices have plummeted over the past 5 years and at the same time the color rending has improved dramatically.

When I first started hearing about LEDs I was really dubious, but once I started seeing them in action, and seeing how the prices were trending down, I got on board.
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« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2017, 08:05:02 AM »

"But out in my garage I prefer 100W incandescent."

For task lighting when I'm working on a gun or something where I need clear, clean light, I go with halogen.

I have several lights that take the double-end bulbs. One is a clamp on swing arm lamp of the kind that architects and engineers use. It's really nice, but the switch is crapping out.

I also have a halogen desk lamp that's on my desk at work for when I need to actually read paper documents.
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« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2017, 08:06:09 AM »

I'm slowly going LED. LOVE them over incandescents and especially those damnable CFL abominations! When I find them for ~$2 USD ea. I snatch them up.
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« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2017, 08:18:32 AM »

I found an LED by GE called the BriteStik...

https://www.amazon.com/GE-Bright-Equivalent-General-Purpose/dp/B016B47R6I/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1487348194&sr=8-5&keywords=ge+bright+stick

Man, do these things put out a lot of light.  None of the warm-up like the damnable CFLs.  Think I found a good replacement bulb.
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« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2017, 08:54:24 AM »

Yes, I noticed a dimming of flourescents in my garage shop, too.



As far as I know, cold environments tend to work better for LEDs, though they're not always the best choice for hot environments.
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zxcvbob
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« Reply #31 on: February 17, 2017, 09:05:55 AM »

I found an LED by GE called the BriteStik...

https://www.amazon.com/GE-Bright-Equivalent-General-Purpose/dp/B016B47R6I/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1487348194&sr=8-5&keywords=ge+bright+stick

Man, do these things put out a lot of light.  None of the warm-up like the damnable CFLs.  Think I found a good replacement bulb.

These are the ones I found a Sam's for $5.78 a package: https://www.amazon.com/GE-Bright-White-60-watt-replacement/dp/B01LZ8K9JK  The ads say "Energy Star", but there's no logo on the package and they are not dimmable.

When 800 lumens is not enough, I like these: https://www.amazon.com/Philips-13-Watt-75-Watt-SlimStyle-Dimmable/dp/B00ZRQSHUW or the Walmart brand non-dimmable "100W" LED's (1500 lumens)
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« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2017, 09:11:13 AM »


As far as I know, cold environments tend to work better for LEDs, though they're not always the best choice for hot environments.

LED's work fine in the cold.  

I haven't tried them yet when it's *really* cold (like -30), that's one reason I want incandescents in the garage.
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« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2017, 10:14:17 AM »

LED's work fine in the cold.  

I haven't tried them yet when it's *really* cold (like -30), that's one reason I want incandescents in the garage.

I haven't hit -30F yet, but I have seen -10F.  My outdoor LEDs worked in that temp.
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« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2017, 11:57:44 AM »

Trump just killed the Obama Coal/CO2 regs yesterday.  He had Rand Paul, McConnell, Manchin, a bunch of other congresscritters and slew of coal miners at the white house for the signing of the bill.

So electricity should be cheap again soon.
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« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2017, 12:45:29 PM »

LED's work fine in the cold.  

I haven't tried them yet when it's *really* cold (like -30), that's one reason I want incandescents in the garage.

I have, -40, and they worked fine.  A flood and a regular in an outdoor fixture.
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230RN
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« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2017, 03:18:01 PM »


As far as I know, cold environments tend to work better for LEDs, though they're not always the best choice for hot environments.

(I added "unheated garage" to my statement that you quoted.

Yes, they run longer in a cooler general environment, but starting up from the cold winter environment such as either in my unheated garage* or the one I have outdoors in cold weather, they take a long time to come up to anywhere near full brightness.

I suspect, but do not know, this has something to do with the lower vapor pressure of the mercury in cold weather.

Terry

* I no longer have that garage or shop.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 05:12:02 PM by 230RN » Logged

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« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2017, 05:40:43 PM »

I hated CFL's, but LED bulbs so far are very decent.  My only real concern is that cheap driver circuits will eat themselves prematurely.  Bad capacitors, etc.

I'm waiting for the advent of LED shop lights that can economically compete with commodity grade T12 fixtures.  Figure it will be 5 years or so.

Even if standard incandescent bulbs were returned to the shelves, I think I'd stick with LEDs.

I don't like the government limiting my options as a consumer by mandate, however I suspect that LED bulbs would not have become so inexpensive without the economies of scale imposed by consumers having little other choice.  I've seen this in other places, like NEMA premium efficiency motors.  Premium efficiency motors were available, but they were a premium product sold at premium pricing.  Once premium efficiency motors were mandated, demand for them went way up, and the unit cost went down substantially.  They were still more expensive then the old less efficient motors, but no where near the cost one had to pay for premium efficiency in the past.

I'm hoping they'll hit the market before the 18 year old twin tube units I have in my shop crap out. They absolutely suck rocks when it's cold but work fine when the temps ae above 50 F or so.
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« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2017, 09:39:39 PM »

I'm hoping they'll hit the market before the 18 year old twin tube units I have in my shop crap out. They absolutely suck rocks when it's cold but work fine when the temps are above 50 F or so.

If you want fluorescents to work reliably in the cold, you pretty much have to use high output fixtures. You might be able to retrofit yours, but you would need new ballasts, new tubes, and new sockets. And the high output are usually a little shorter, so you may have to use a special adapter type of socket.


(I added "unheated garage" to my statement that you quoted.

Yes, they run longer in a cooler general environment, but starting up from the cold winter environment such as either in my unheated garage* or the one I have outdoors in cold weather, they take a long time to come up to anywhere near full brightness.

I suspect, but do not know, this has something to do with the lower vapor pressure of the mercury in cold weather.

Terry


You're getting your LEDs and CFLs mixed up. Fluorescent lamps struggle in cold temps (and in extreme heat), while LEDs require good heat management, but don't mind the cold. They're opposites in that way.
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230RN
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« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2017, 06:09:53 AM »

No, I was always talking about CFLs, having no experience with LEDs.  I may have interpreted what you were talking about as being CFLs.  I'm not sure whether you were unclear on that or I just plain misinterpreted what you said.

Bought two LEDs, so we'll see what happens there.  Next cold spell, maybe I'll pull the 100W eq. CFL on my back porch and use the 100W eq. LED out there and see what it does from a cold start just by eyeball comparison.

Terry
« Last Edit: February 18, 2017, 03:08:33 PM by 230RN » Logged

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« Reply #40 on: February 18, 2017, 08:27:12 AM »

I have two lights out front, a wall light and a post light.

I replaced the CFL in the post light with an LED.

The wall light, which is an SOB to get to, still has the CFL.

When it dips down into the 20s here it takes at least 10 minutes for the wall light to come up to full brightness.

The LED is instant on, full brightness.
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« Reply #41 on: February 18, 2017, 08:40:26 AM »

We really shouldn't give the watermelons too much flack about recommending CFLs. After all, they thought Global Warming!!!! would do away with all this cold weather.
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« Reply #42 on: February 18, 2017, 11:07:47 AM »

Well, I don't know much about the details, but we've gradually been replacing with LEDs for several years now, and I have yet to replace one of them. Most of them are in ceiling/wall fixtures with wiring and all that from the 70's.
The one on the porch is relatively new (only since last summer, when we replaced the whole fixture) but I haven't noticed temperatures affecting it and we've had a couple cold snaps this winter.

I said, way back when, the market would probably eventually kill the incandescent light bulb, as well as others, so I didn't see the point in the government getting involved. At this point, I'm not even sure it really matters.

Now, gas cans, OTOH... Please, for the love of all that's holy, PLEASE, make gas cans GREAT again.
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« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2017, 03:02:24 PM »


I'm curious about the plastic-looking coating on my new  LEDs down by the neck and socket areas.  Huh?

Terry

It's not a coating. LEDs don't work on direct AC line voltage so the lamps contain a small circuit that drops voltage and rectifies it to DC. That's what is in the little plastic housing at the bottom.

Brad
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230RN
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« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2017, 04:00:35 PM »

....
« Last Edit: February 19, 2017, 09:55:05 AM by 230RN » Logged

How can you logically maintain that restrictions on short barreled rifles, silencers, free trade between individuals, ammunition specifications, outright bans on ownership of anything resembling a firearm, background checks, et cetera, are not "infringements"?.
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« Reply #45 on: February 19, 2017, 02:12:00 PM »

Why is there no talk of repealing the light bulb regs?  Huh?

Because it was done in 2014?

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/10/politics/policy-riders-spending-bill/
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« Reply #46 on: February 19, 2017, 02:23:40 PM »

How did de-funding change the fact that bulb manufacturers had to meet efficiency standards? I wonder if that legislation also dealt with magnetic sign ballasts, or if that was separate.
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« Reply #47 on: February 19, 2017, 02:30:05 PM »


I think that just stopped them from outlawing any more incandescent lamps.  100W and 75W are still gone, except (ironically) for specialty lamps that don't put out much light.  I think I saw some 100W "rough service" lamps at the dollar store, in plain packaging that minimized the rough service part, that were less than 1000 lumens. 

I'm not sure about 60W general-purpose lamps, although LED's have that covered well enough maybe the demand is gone.
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« Reply #48 on: February 19, 2017, 02:53:03 PM »

Those energy standards covered a lot more than just incandescent lights.
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« Reply #49 on: February 19, 2017, 04:39:52 PM »

I think that just stopped them from outlawing any more incandescent lamps.  100W and 75W are still gone, except (ironically) for specialty lamps that don't put out much light.

That's because the thinner you make the filaments, the more efficient they are, but also more fragile.

The rough service bulbs at this point are, I think, limited more to furnace type environments, where 'rough service' is implied and an extra bit of heat isn't that big of a deal.

Otherwise, well, a well-potted LED is just as resistant to vibration(but CFLs aren't, which was the competitor when the regs were written) and cold(again, CFLs not good for).

The only area where incandescents are better than LEDs are hot environments.  Heck, even in refrigerated places LEDs are double good because the lowered energy use means that you don't need to cool the environment back down as much because of the heat from the lighting.
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