Author Topic: Swatting Arrest  (Read 21980 times)

Ben

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Swatting Arrest
« on: December 30, 2017, 09:45:16 AM »
I'm glad to finally see a "swatting" arrest. Especially in this case, where the result was death.

I'm not sure how I feel about the police response that lead to the innocent person's death (shot by a responding cop). I need to see more information before I judge the police response, given the false "swatting" report. I think it's clear though, that the "swatter" should be severely punished. I'm almost thinking a murder charge wouldn't be unreasonable here.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/30/kansas-swatting-suspect-arrested-in-los-angeles.html
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French G.

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2017, 10:07:36 AM »
Tons of news coverage on gamers and swatting, zero on cop shot a guy with no weapon. Much like labor unions, the officer survival movement was a good thing when it started. Very much beyond common sense now and intent is forgotten. If cops just cared about surviving there would be a massive overhaul in how they manage their most dangerous encounter, that is pulling over cars on an interstate. The whole culture is rotten.
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Ben

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2017, 10:18:43 AM »
Tons of news coverage on gamers and swatting, zero on cop shot a guy with no weapon.

Well, as I said, I want to see more information on the cops / innocent guy encounter. It may be an Arizona deal (where I blame the cops), or it may simply be tragic. I can understand the news coverage piling on the "swatting" side, as it was that malevolent behavior that led to the death. Whether the cop who pulled the trigger should be charged with anything remains to be seen. That the "swatter" should be charged with something very serious and have the book thrown at him* is, to me, a given.

*My understanding is that this is not a first offense for the guy. He apparently has done this before.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2017, 10:33:58 AM »
Trigger happy cops. Yes, the [police] culture is rotten. The most important thing today is no longer "To serve and Protect," it has become "At least I go home at the end of my shift."

Yes, the cops received a call and they had to respond. No weapon was displayed -- there was NO justification to shoot. The officer should be arrested and tried. and the clown who made the swatting call should be fried. I read in one article that he was on the Internet, defending himself with, "I didn't kill anybody. I'm not a cop." No, you're not, pal -- you're scum. A dispute over a $1 or $2 bet cost someone not even involved in the dispute his life. That's sickening.
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Fly320s

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2017, 10:34:04 AM »
cop shot a guy with no weapon.

Many people focus on the fact that there was no weapon, but that it irrelevant.  Neither cops nor individuals are required to wait until a weapon is presented before using lethal force.  In this case, as in others, it was reported that the individual reached toward his waist band even after the cops told him to keep his hands up.  That is a furtive movement.  It is well known by cops, and people who do their research, that many people carry guns in their waist bands.  
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2017, 10:40:15 AM »
Many people focus on the fact that there was no weapon, but that it irrelevant.  Neither cops nor individuals are required to wait until a weapon is presented before using lethal force.  In this case, as in others, it was reported that the individual reached toward his waist band even after the cops told him to keep his hands up.  That is a furtive movement.  It is well known by cops, and people who do their research, that many people carry guns in their waist bands.  

But there was no weapon. Cops are too trigger happy. I'm sure they were all deployed at a safe distance, behind cover. They could have waited until a weapon was visible before opening fire. Sorry to disagree, but I don't find the fact that there was no weapon to be irrelevant. An innocent man is dead. He had no way of knowing what the cops were outside his house for.
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Fly320s

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2017, 10:47:03 AM »
But there was no weapon.

As I said, and the courts have upheld, there is no requirement for a weapon to be present or in use before the police act.

How many times per day/week/month/year do cops in the US point their guns at people, but never fire a shot?
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French G.

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2017, 12:24:47 PM »
I do not doubt it is legal, but it is not right. No different than shooting the family pet, the last local one was on a cable run, shot dead anyway. The thug cop hater culture does not excuse and did not create the cop culture that hates all the little people.

Part of it is getting the government we deserve. Elected sheriffs are on a leash. Professional police departments insulated by immunity and lawyers are not. Then we pay police an amount that assures us that anyone fit to be a cop won't be. Maybe this is, maybe it isn't, but there are plenty of bad shoots to pick from. Hard time and city bankrupting lawsuits are the only fix.
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sumpnz

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2017, 12:38:27 PM »
The CA guy should go down for at least manslaughter.  I'd not complain if this became a capital murder case.  Teach the punks a lesson.

Any "swatting" call should result in attempted murder charges.

MechAg94

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2017, 12:57:42 PM »
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/crime/article192111974.html
This video on this link is not very good, but I don't see any movement toward the waste.  All I see is maybe moving the hands to shield his eyes from the spotlight.  
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MechAg94

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2017, 01:01:43 PM »
As I said, and the courts have upheld, there is no requirement for a weapon to be present or in use before the police act.

How many times per day/week/month/year do cops in the US point their guns at people, but never fire a shot?
yes, so why did they fire this time?  They were across the street behind cover with rifles.  A "furtive movement" is not a threat to them at all even if he did have a gun on him.

I agree the SWAT'er needs to be fried, but the cop who fired should be up on charges also.  This was not a justified shoot.  
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2017, 01:09:30 PM »
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/crime/article192111974.html
This video on this link is not very good, but I don't see any movement toward the waste.  All I see is maybe moving the hands to shield his eyes from the spotlight.  

Just watched the video. No "furtive" movement. Hands were nowhere near his waist. Bad shoot -- the cop should fry (along with the twerp who made the swatting call).
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sumpnz

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2017, 01:26:41 PM »
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/crime/article192111974.html
This video on this link is not very good, but I don't see any movement toward the waste.  All I see is maybe moving the hands to shield his eyes from the spotlight.  

Well, their they're there was movement towards the waste.  Just not the waist.  

BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2017, 01:26:59 PM »
I'm sorry, but you guys must have excellent vision, because I can't barely see squat in that video.

"In the audio of the 911 call, the caller claimed his father had been shot in the head and that he was holding his mother and a sibling at gunpoint. The caller added that he poured gasoline inside the home and "might just set it on fire.""

From the cops perspective, he's dealing with a man who's already murdered one victim and has poured gas around the house.
I'm not saying it was or was not a good shoot, but I'm not going to be quick to judge his actions on this particular case.

I do want to know why they went to the wrong house. Did the gamer that Swatted the guy get the wrong address or did the police go to the wrong house?
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MechAg94

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2017, 01:50:55 PM »
The gamer on the other side of the argument gave the SWAT'er a wrong address. 
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MechAg94

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #15 on: December 30, 2017, 01:57:33 PM »
Given what is possible today, I do not think cops have the right to show up on site assuming what was reported is true without seeing proof.  This is no better than the cases we have discussed of SWAT teams breaking down doors for the same reason. 

Even if he was waving his arms around, it doesn't justify a shoot.  The police were at some distance away behind cover, not a few feet away.  The burden of proof goes up to show cause just like it would for us if we shot someone at a distance. 
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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #16 on: December 30, 2017, 01:59:32 PM »
The gamer on the other side of the argument gave the SWAT'er a wrong address. 

Even more glad the guy is getting charged.

Regardless of the police issue, they really do need to start coming down HARD on the people pulling these stunts.
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2017, 02:02:02 PM »
In my opinion the SWATer needs to be dead.
Enough playing around with this kind of bullshit.
You cause the death of an innocent person through an intentional act, *expletive deleted*ck you, you get to die as well.
Game over bitch.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2017, 02:07:50 PM »


Regardless of the police issue, they really do need to start coming down HARD on the people pulling these stunts.

This.

Automatic aggravated assault charge even if the PD becomes aware it's a swatting incident before units are dispatched. If there is injury, attempted murder. If a death occurs, murder with an automatic life/no parole sentence at the very least. This is irresposibility on an intentionally malevolent scale. Reward it with an equally harsh punishment.

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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2017, 02:19:16 PM »
In my opinion the SWATer needs to be dead.
Enough playing around with this kind of bullshit.
You cause the death of an innocent person through an intentional act, *expletive deleted*ck you, you get to die as well.
Game over bitch.


Not to mention the legit calls going unanswered because the police are all tied up. Imagine being the person getting beaten, raped or whatnot while the SWAT team is cleaning up across town because of a "prank" call.
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HankB

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #20 on: December 30, 2017, 07:32:45 PM »
Criminal charges are in order for the guy who made the swatting call.

As they should be for the guy who actually pulled the trigger and actually killed the unarmed victim.
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zxcvbob

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #21 on: December 30, 2017, 08:17:11 PM »
Criminal charges are in order for the guy who made the swatting call.

As they should be for the guy who actually pulled the trigger and actually killed the unarmed victim.

Premeditated murder for the swatter.  (bonus points if they seek the death penalty, even if that's an overreach)  Less for the cop; I don't know how much less cuz I'm not familiar with the facts of the case.

I thought they should have done the same thing for the fake 911 call that got John Crawford III killed.
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Jocassee

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #22 on: December 30, 2017, 08:26:04 PM »
If cops just cared about surviving there would be a massive overhaul in how they manage their most dangerous encounter, that is pulling over cars on an interstate.

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #23 on: December 30, 2017, 10:42:41 PM »
The gamer on the other side of the argument gave the SWAT'er a wrong address. 
He needs to be charged with something as well.
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just Warren

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Re: Swatting Arrest
« Reply #24 on: December 30, 2017, 10:49:09 PM »
He needs to be charged with something as well.

What exactly? Just making up an address isn't a crime. He had no duty not to lie to the person demanding the address.

Unless it can be proved he knew he was giving out an address that would get someone targeted he hasn't ethically done anything wrong. Of course ethics and what's actually in the penal code can vary.

Sure he was an idiot for getting into this beef in the first place but it's a reach to say he committed a criminal act. 
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