The new non-NFA short-barrel shotguns

[Kingcreek]

I get the cool factor, but I will still argue against any real practical use.
In typical interior rooms and halls, give me a .45 handgun and leave one hand free for a flashlight, opening doors, signaling, etc.
Outside areas out to 40-50 yards or so, I'm happy with a full stock shotgun or a carbine. 
That thing is nothing but a Hollywood-inspired abomination. I predict they will sell a bunch of them anyway.
Why hasn't somebody put a bayonet lug on one yet?

[mtnbkr]

Guns don't have to be practical or the best solution to a problem.  Sometimes they can be cool looking and fun to shoot. 

I wouldn't buy one as a  personal defense gun, but given a few hundred dollars of "play money", I'd be all over it just for the giggle factor.

Chris

[Fly320s]

Some of the reasons I like PGO's for home defense... Soft lead shot, even 0000 buck, has a bit less over-penetration potential relative to a jacketed projectile. The firearm's length makes it far more maneuverable in a home defense scenario versus a shoulder-stocked shotty.

Caveat:  Use what you're comfortable with.

About that "a bit less over-penetration,"  a .38" 80g lead ball at 1,200 FPS will penetrate the same as a FMJ 9mm 124g at 1,000 FPS according to the Box O' Truth guys.  Here is the rifle and shotgun test: https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-14-rifles-shotguns-and-walls/

If you dig around, you'll find similar results for all of the FMJ pistol rounds he tests.  The only load that doesn't penetrate more than one wall is birdshot.

I couldn't find any tests of 0000 buckshot into ballistic gellatin, but I did find plenty of 000 buck tests.  The 000 buck often penetrates more than 16 inches of gel.  Most hollow-point pistol rounds most often stop in 16 inches of gel.  No, that doesn't prove pistols are better or that shotguns will shoot through houses, but it should make you think about the fact that your shotgun ammo will most likely go through six walls, just like your .357 will.

Again, use what you're comfortable with and what works.  Just don't make that decision on the false idea that 0000 buck from a 3 inch shell will have less overpenetration that a typical pistol round.

[Fly320s]

You lack imagination, sir. One demerit.

Brad

What if we make it mag-fed?   

http://www.mossberg.com/category/series/590m-mag-fed/

[zxcvbob]

So what are the classified as?  They are too cheap to be AOW's.  (I think the transfer fee is only $5, but still a $200 tax to manufacture it.)

I like the Remington; do they make it in a 20 gauge?

[Brad Johnson]

What if we make it mag-fed?   

http://www.mossberg.com/category/series/590m-mag-fed/

It's a start.

Brad

[Fly320s]

So what are the classified as?  They are too cheap to be AOW's.  (I think the transfer fee is only $5, but still a $200 tax to manufacture it.)

I like the Remington; do they make it in a 20 gauge?

They are classified as "firearms"  just like a pistol or rifle or shotgun.  They are not regulated by the NFA.

Here is a good run down on the how and why: https://www.ffl123.com/no-nonsense-non-nfa-14-inch-scatterguns/

[Ben]

For $30, just out of curiosity, I might order one of those Shockwave stocks to try on one of my 18" barrel shotguns, just to see the difference between the Birdshead and the "standard" pistol grip.

Just for fun. As others have said, use whatever works for you. I'm just in the camp that for serious work, if it has a long barrel, I want the shoulder thing that goes up. Not that my mind couldn't be changed though. :)

[Brad Johnson]

Caveat:  Use what you're comfortable with.

About that "a bit less over-penetration,"  a .38" 80g lead ball at 1,200 FPS will penetrate the same as a FMJ 9mm 124g at 1,000 FPS according to the Box O' Truth guys.  Here is the rifle and shotgun test: https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-14-rifles-shotguns-and-walls/

First, a correction... I had had the wrong ammo in mind when I was typing the previous reply. I said 0000 and that's in error. It's 000.  Remington 3", to be precise. Checked the ammo closet last night just to be sure. Previous post edited to reflect the correct info.

Interesting on the Box O Truth link. I'd like to see a direct comparison of .357 to 000 buck (standard soft lead shot) as that's what I have. I use Hydra Shok in the .357 and it's advertised at 1240 FPS. It'd be a good apples-to-apples comparison with the 1225 FPS (advertised) 3" Remmy 000 loads.

I'd like to see what happens if they placed walls on a slight oblique, and with standard studding. In a home invasion scenario rarely will there be just a piece of perfectly perpendicular sheet rock between you and whatever you don't want to hit. My guess is the penetration for shot will show a noticeable reduction when encountering studs, although this will likely be offset by the fact that there are multiple projectiles per load vs. the single projectile for a handgun.

Brad

[MechAg94]

If I bought one I'd also have to get the post-apocalyptic over-the-back scabbard to go with.

I was thinking of putting a lanyard hole through the stock (or attaching a loop) and setting it up under an overcoat like Reese from Terminator. 

[MillCreek]

For $30, just out of curiosity, I might order one of those Shockwave stocks to try on one of my 18" barrel shotguns, just to see the difference between the Birdshead and the "standard" pistol grip.

Just for fun. As others have said, use whatever works for you. I'm just in the camp that for serious work, if it has a long barrel, I want the shoulder thing that goes up. Not that my mind couldn't be changed though. :)

I have looked on the Shockwave site, and so far they are not making a grip for the Ithaca 37.  I should ask them to do so.

[T.O.M.]

A thought...if you can legally put a "brace" on a handgun without created an SBR under NFA laws, could you put a brace on one of these without creating NFA problems?

[dogmush]

A thought...if you can legally put a "brace" on a handgun without created an SBR under NFA laws, could you put a brace on one of these without creating NFA problems?

Folks are way ahead of you.

https://www.tactical-life.com/gear/accessories/sb-tactical-tac-14-shockwave-braces/

https://suarezinternational.com/mossberg-shockwave-pdw-kit/

[BlueStarLizzard]

When it came to the Shockwave, I decided that discretion was the better part of valor.

I handed it back to Dad after standing there for about two minutes trying to figure out how the hell I was going to shoot it without loosing it.
So it's now the second gun I can't/won't shoot, the other being the Cruiser, because it's just an accident waiting to happen. I'm game for recoil, I'm cool with a little pain and I'll work through those things, but I'm not messing with something I literally cannot keep a grip on and is going to go flying through the air.

That said, Dad also has trouble with it and he's great with the Cruiser. He's been able to work at it and improve, but there was a learning curve on it.

[French G.]

If I have money for a stamp I want to get one of those three barrel Chiappa abominations and chop it to 6" and make a hip holster for it. Because pirates or something.

[just Warren]

"or something."


Didn't some NYPD types carry a shorty SxS 20 ga.? What's wrong with that?

[Viking]

I want one in semi auto.

Fostech 12.