Tell me again why we should buy a Tesla

[dogmush]

So a system designed to keep you in your lane at highway speeds on a limited access highway is now a malfunctioning "collision avoidance system?

Tesla Model X's do have Automatic Emergency Braking system. However, one of the things that disables that system is sharp steering input so not sure how that would impact avoiding a traffic barrier.

[Ben]

Sorry for the tangent, but I'm curious - are these systems also designed to step in for adverse weather conditions, like driving (and more importantly stopping) in snow and ice?

[dogmush]

Other than ABS?  Don't think so.

I confess I'm not a Tesla expert, I'm just reading the manual online.

https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/model_x_owners_manual_north_america_en.pdf

It explains in detail what the systems are supposed to do, and where the drivers went wrong.

[MechAg94]

So a system designed to keep you in your lane at highway speeds on a limited access highway is now a malfunctioning "collision avoidance system?

Tesla Model X's do have Automatic Emergency Braking system. However, one of the things that disables that system is sharp steering input so not sure how that would impact avoiding a traffic barrier.

Well, you would think it would do something rather than just giving up telling the driver "you got this, right?".  Even continuing to follow the right or left lines (whichever it still senses) would avoid the barrier.  A minimum default might be to let off the gas and apply brakes if the driver doesn't take control.  That would get someone's attention if the other alerts did not. 

The system apparently did what it was designed to do.  I just think they could design in a fail safe or two without changing things a great deal.  However, this is still fairly new tech so things like this will come up that fall outside the computer's programming.  It doesn't mean the driver's isn't still responsible, just that Tesla can do it a little better going forward.

[dogmush]

Well, you would think it would do something rather than just giving up telling the driver "you got this, right?".  Even continuing to follow the right or left lines (whichever it still senses) would avoid the barrier. A minimum default might be to let off the gas and apply brakes if the driver doesn't take control.  That would get someone's attention if the other alerts did not. 

Go back and watch that recreation video again, especially from :27 to :35.  Your suggestion that I bolded is exactly what the car did.  It lost the right hand line because the lane widened out of it's spec and the right hand line was dashed and faint.  It locked on the left hand lane line and tried to keep the car in the lane.  When the highway split, what should have been a triangle with hashmarks up to the barrel was actually one nice bright line, and some faint hashmarks. The left lane line of the lane he was trying to be in doesn't exist.  So the car followed the one lane line it could see which, due to IL DOT negligence, ended up becoming the right hand line of the diverging lane. The car followed that line right into the barrier.  Perhaps if the lane lines had actually existed, the Tesla could have followed them.

If you freeze it at :29 you can pretty clearly see the car locked onto the left hand line, which is diverging from the highway, and will hit the barrier.  You can also see that the left hand line of the lane that he was trying to be in doesn't exist.  You can't track something that doesn't exist.

[lupinus]

Go back and watch that recreation video again, especially from :27 to :35.  Your suggestion that I bolded is exactly what the car did.  It lost the right hand line because the lane widened out of it's spec and the right hand line was dashed and faint.  It locked on the left hand lane line and tried to keep the car in the lane.  When the highway split, what should have been a triangle with hashmarks up to the barrel was actually one nice bright line, and some faint hashmarks. The left lane line of the lane he was trying to be in doesn't exist.  So the car followed the one lane line it could see which, due to IL DOT negligence, ended up becoming the right hand line of the diverging lane. The car followed that line right into the barrier.  Perhaps if the lane lines had actually existed, the Tesla could have followed them.

If you freeze it at :29 you can pretty clearly see the car locked onto the left hand line, which is diverging from the highway, and will hit the barrier.  You can also see that the left hand line of the lane that he was trying to be in doesn't exist.  You can't track something that doesn't exist.

Nor can you blame the car when the damned thing is giving you all this information and you should be paying attention.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

[MechAg94]

Nor can you blame the car when the damned thing is giving you all this information and you should be paying attention.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

The car and programming are perfect.  All autonomous cars of the future should use that exact program for control.  No improvement will ever be needed.  All issues are the fault of the driver.

Once you are assimilated, you will agree.

 

I wasn't doing a second by second analysis of the video.  I already said it looked like the car was doing what it was set up to do.  However, there are always things that can be done better (that includes the car, the driver, and other) even if I don't know what they are.  Tesla probably already has improvements planned based on this and other stuff, but I wouldn't expect them to talk about it.  

[KD5NRH]

There are a number of different types of impact attenuators. We don't know which type this was. In my corner of my state, they seem to have switched from wedges of sand-filled plastic barrels to some sort of telescoping contraption. Neither one leaves much after being hit at any significant speed.

The crap view of the one in the video looks to me like a water-filled one.  Then again, I'm basing that on Texas experience, and we tend to use water for the obvious advantages in places where it won't freeze.  (Easily transported and pumped into the containers, simply flows away after one is hit, etc.)  The chunks of plastic laying around in one of the wreck aftermath photos look like the same type I've seen used in those around here, too.

However, the post or Jersey barrier or whatever that the attenuator was supposed to protect people from is still there and a functioning collision-avoidance system should still, like, avoid the collision.

Yeah, that's pretty much the entire relevant part.

[MechAg94]

And that is the improvement part.  There apparently wasn't much "collision avoidance" built into the system.  That is fine as they don't promise that and seem to make it clear it doesn't do that.  However, it does include safety and alarm features short of that.  That is still on the driver.

[Hawkmoon]

So a system designed to keep you in your lane at highway speeds on a limited access highway is now a malfunctioning "collision avoidance system?

Two separate systems. Whether it's true autopilot or just semi-assisted driving, I'm sure a Tesla has some doohicky that's supposed to stop the vehicle before it wraps itself around a solid object that's basically dead ahead.

Tesla Model X's do have Automatic Emergency Braking system. However, one of the things that disables that system is sharp steering input so not sure how that would impact avoiding a traffic barrier.

That might be part of the issue.

[MechAg94]

https://kprcradio.iheart.com/featured/the-pursuit-of-happiness/content/2018-05-30-tesla-car-in-autopilot-mode-crashes-into-parked-police-car-in-california/

This is a video, but another case of a Tesla with its autopilot feature in use that crashed.  This time into a parked (unoccupied) police SUV. 

[Sindawe]

Once you are assimilated, you will agree.

To quote Barbie of Borg, "I will not comply". 

I've been some thought to getting another classic VW Type 1 just to get AWAY from all the gimmicky gadgets in modern automobiles.    Sure, they suck most heinously in an accident, but I was willing to accept that risk on a motorcycle.  I'd love to get a Schwimmwagen, even a Kübelwagen would be fantastic. But both are few, far between and unGodsly expensive.

[brimic]

Plus you may get stuck with a lemon from a company that is out of business.  Tesla is burning through cash, it doesn't look like they can raise any more from either bonds or stock issues due to downgrades from Moody's and the stock price tanking.  They only have enough cash on hand for a few more months and they are no where near the 5,000 Model 3's per week production number.

If you have Tesla stock or bonds; run, do not walk, to the exits...

They might be one of the most overvalued corporations I've seen in recent times. Their market capitalization is higher than Ford or GM, which makes no sense at all.