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Author Topic: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.  (Read 1155 times)

freakazoid

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Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« on: August 20, 2018, 12:59:47 AM »
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-background_steel

Apparently steel made before the testings of the first atomic bombs are called this as all steel made afterwards is contaminated slightly because the air used in production is contaminated with radionuclides. This is important for sensitive instruments like Geiger counters. Apparently a lot of this steel comes from sunken battleships.

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AJ Dual

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2018, 01:21:13 AM »
That is cool.  =)
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Scout26

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2018, 02:57:38 AM »
Some of the low-background steel that made up USS Indiana's hull was recycled to create the low background counting chamber at the in Vivo Radioassay and Research Facility (IVRRF) at Pacific Northwest National Laboratory.  Same with hulks of USS Illinois and Kentucky.  Well, that parts that weren't used to repair the other Iowa's
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230RN

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2018, 03:40:32 AM »
So maybe we can mine "Iron Bottom Bay" AKA "Iron Bottom Sound?"



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironbottom_Sound

(However: "For many Navy sailors, and those who served in the area during that time, the waters in this area are considered sacred, and strict silence is observed as ships cruise through.[citation needed])

« Last Edit: August 20, 2018, 04:12:07 AM by 230RN »
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K Frame

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2018, 09:11:59 AM »
One of the ways that art investigators can determine if a painting is authentic or a later forgery is if the linseed oil, canvas, and any organic pigments contain atomic-age radioactive isotopes.

Some years ago there was a furor over an unknown painting by, IIRC, Van Gogh being "discovered." It was stylistically spot on, even the brushwork was consistent with the period in which it was thought to have been painted, and the canvas and wood stretcher were of the period, as well.

It finally came to light as a forgery when the linseed oil was tested and was found to contain isotopes that didn't show up until atomic bombs started going off in the atmosphere in the 1940s.
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K Frame

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2018, 12:19:49 PM »
"So maybe we can mine "Iron Bottom Bay" AKA "Iron Bottom Sound?""

Sure, why not. The dead aren't using them anymore.  :facepalm:


But, then again, you'd better hurry, because illegal salvagers are already hard at work.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2017/nov/03/worlds-biggest-grave-robbery-asias-disappearing-ww2-shipwrecks
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230RN

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2018, 05:18:50 PM »
Quote from: Mike Irwin on August 20, 2018, 12:19:49 PM
"So maybe we can mine "Iron Bottom Bay" AKA "Iron Bottom Sound?""

Sure, why not. The dead aren't using them anymore.  :facepalm:


But, then again, you'd better hurry, because illegal salvagers are already hard at work.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2017/nov/03/worlds-biggest-grave-robbery-asias-disappearing-ww2-shipwrecks

Well, I'll be darned.  I didn't know that.  I read that link all the way through... that's terrible.

Just goes to show  you.  Even what started out as a joke on my part can turn out awful.  I apologize to all.

Terry, :(
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K Frame

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2018, 07:25:06 AM »
I caught wind of it last year. I'm not sure if it was mentioned here or not, but several warship wrecks have literally disappeared.
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makattak

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2018, 10:30:18 AM »
Quote from: Mike Irwin on August 21, 2018, 07:25:06 AM
I caught wind of it last year. I'm not sure if it was mentioned here or not, but several warship wrecks have literally disappeared.

My immediate thought was China.

Reading the article... my immediate thought was spot on.
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DittoHead

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2018, 11:50:47 AM »
Quote from: Mike Irwin on August 20, 2018, 09:11:59 AM
One of the ways that art investigators can determine if a painting is authentic or a later forgery is if the linseed oil, canvas, and any organic pigments contain atomic-age radioactive isotopes.

The spike and following decline in atmospheric carbon 14 has also proven very useful in dating human tissue
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/nuclear-bombs-made-it-possible-to-carbon-date-human-tissue-20074710/
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230RN

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2018, 11:11:40 AM »
It's amazing how low the limits of detection are, if they can detect those isotopes in recent steel, etc.

I remember running into an EPA regulation years ago where the legal definition of some level of contamination was "to the limits of detection."

I don't know if that still stands, but in my perverse little mind I was thinking, "Jeeze, someday one molecule of (that contaminant) in an acre-foot of water could be in violation."

Yeah, I know, mass spectrometry and all, but it still seems strange to me that such small amounts of radionuclides could affect background radiation measurements.  Well, steel is iron + carbon, so....

Too bad people are raiding the sunken ships just for that.  I'm surprised the demand is that great that they need to do it.

So keep your antique firearms under wraps, you never know...

Also interesting about DittoHead's comments above.

Terry
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2018, 12:41:14 PM »
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K Frame

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Re: Learned something interesting, low-background steel.
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2018, 07:46:33 AM »
Quote from: RoadKingLarry on August 22, 2018, 12:41:14 PM
Here's an interesting bit of history that ties in.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/a21382/how-kodak-accidentally-discovered-radioactive-fallout/

That's a neat article. I'd never heard anything about that before.

I do know that in the days after the bombings in Japan that Japanese doctors and hospitals near the bombing sites discovered that all of their X-Ray film had been rendered useless, and that's what gave the government confirmation that the Americans had, in fact, dropped atomic weapons.
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