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Author Topic: Suiciding at the VA  (Read 496 times)
MillCreek
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« on: February 10, 2019, 03:48:15 PM »

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/national/wp/2019/02/07/feature/the-parking-lot-suicides/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.4626e79c23eb

Some grim numbers on the number of veteran suicides period, and the people who do it at the actual VA facility.  From where I sit as a healthcare administrator, there are not enough mental health clinicians to go around, and I bet it is even more difficult finding them to work at the VA.
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MillCreek
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Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.
Ron
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« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2019, 03:56:44 PM »

Is there any hard or even anecdotal evidence that things are getting any better with Trump in office?

Iĺve read a couple of articles that say yes but then I donĺt just accept anything I read anymore at face value.

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Fly320s
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« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2019, 04:26:57 PM »

Is there any hard or even anecdotal evidence that things are getting any better with Trump in office?

Iĺve read a couple of articles that say yes but then I donĺt just accept anything I read anymore at face value.



I find it interesting that you would bring Trump into this discussion.  I don't think he, or any president, is responsible for how the VA is run. 
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French G.
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« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2019, 04:28:41 PM »

Directly responsible. You have a choice of appointing someone over the agency with a mandate to clean house, or just paying off another favor.
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AKA Navy Joe   

I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.
Ron
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« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2019, 04:34:18 PM »

I find it interesting that you would bring Trump into this discussion.  I don't think he, or any president, is responsible for how the VA is run. 

Iĺd have to search but Iĺm pretty sure candidate Trump campaigned on straightening out the VA.

I may be misremembering though.

And what French said ^
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The wish not to believe can influence as strongly as the wish to believe.

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Fly320s
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« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2019, 04:47:27 PM »

The VA has many, many years of practice at being poorly run.  Trump has been in office for two years.  What kind of improvements did you expect by now?
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Ron
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« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2019, 04:59:15 PM »

The VA has many, many years of practice at being poorly run.  Trump has been in office for two years.  What kind of improvements did you expect by now?

If you reread my initial post you will see I have no expectations.

It was a simple question about a subject I know little about.

Itĺs what we do on forum boards, welcome to the APS Wink
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BobR
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« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2019, 07:23:58 PM »

The VA has many, many years of practice at being poorly run.  Trump has been in office for two years.  What kind of improvements did you expect by now?

Along with the current Secretary being the 3rd person to run it in two years it is hard to get any changes pushed through. We need someone with staying power who can effect changes, so far that has been lacking under Trump.

bob
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Hawkmoon
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« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2019, 07:46:42 PM »

The VA doesn't have a clue how to address the suicide problem. I get most of my medical care through the VA hospital a couple of towns over from me. When I go in for my semi-annual checkup with my primary care physician, the routine intake questions always include things like, "Are you feeling sad today, even a little bit?" And I think almost every veteran knows by now that if you even hint at feeling sad or depressed, the VA may or may not try to help you but they WILL report you to NICS and you'll be prohibited from possessing firearms.

I was recently approached about being a subject in an 8-week research study on pain management, which I agreed to participate in. It's a two-group study -- one group works with live "coaches," the other gets a booklet and a robot phone call every evening. I'm in the robot call group. Two of the questions are "On a scale of one to five, how much did you feel sad today?" and "On a scale of one to five, how much did you feel angry today?" (I always press "1" [Not at all]for those questions.) Then, at the end of the call, instead of just telling me I can end the call by hanging up, they include the obligatory advice that if I feel suicidal I should call the national suicide hotline number (which they helpfully repeat).

By the end of the eight weeks they'll likely drive me to suicide.

The more important thing is that no veteran I know wants to lose his Second Amendment rights, so we know how to answer those questions. I don't care if my life is a country-western singer's wet dream of a dumpster fire -- my wife done run off with mah bestest friend, my pickup truck crashed and mah dawg just died -- when the intake nurse asks me if I'm feeling happy today the answer is "You betcha! Life couldn't be better."
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BlueStarLizzard
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« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2019, 08:20:49 PM »

The VA doesn't have a clue how to address the suicide problem. I get most of my medical care through the VA hospital a couple of towns over from me. When I go in for my semi-annual checkup with my primary care physician, the routine intake questions always include things like, "Are you feeling sad today, even a little bit?" And I think almost every veteran knows by now that if you even hint at feeling sad or depressed, the VA may or may not try to help you but they WILL report you to NICS and you'll be prohibited from possessing firearms.

I was recently approached about being a subject in an 8-week research study on pain management, which I agreed to participate in. It's a two-group study -- one group works with live "coaches," the other gets a booklet and a robot phone call every evening. I'm in the robot call group. Two of the questions are "On a scale of one to five, how much did you feel sad today?" and "On a scale of one to five, how much did you feel angry today?" (I always press "1" [Not at all]for those questions.) Then, at the end of the call, instead of just telling me I can end the call by hanging up, they include the obligatory advice that if I feel suicidal I should call the national suicide hotline number (which they helpfully repeat).

By the end of the eight weeks they'll likely drive me to suicide.

The more important thing is that no veteran I know wants to lose his Second Amendment rights, so we know how to answer those questions. I don't care if my life is a country-western singer's wet dream of a dumpster fire -- my wife done run off with mah bestest friend, my pickup truck crashed and mah dawg just died -- when the intake nurse asks me if I'm feeling happy today the answer is "You betcha! Life couldn't be better."

This isn't just a problem in the VA, although it presents in that system more than in the general population.

Nor is it just a problem with the Second Amendment.

Every time legislation is pushed to restrict or restrain on grounds of mental health and/or addiction, you have more and more people declining offers of treatment, who would otherwise want it or even ask for it, because they fear legal ramifications.
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« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2019, 02:17:40 AM »

This isn't just a problem in the VA, although it presents in that system more than in the general population.

Nor is it just a problem with the Second Amendment.

Every time legislation is pushed to restrict or restrain on grounds of mental health and/or addiction, you have more and more people declining offers of treatment, who would otherwise want it or even ask for it, because they fear legal ramifications.

True.

On another forum (probably the old, pre-schism The High Road), at least ten years ago and probably closer to twenty, somebody offered the suggestion that if you ever need any sort of mental health treatment (psychology or psychiatry), find a shrink in a different city from where you live, use an assumed name, and pay only in cash.

That suggestion was remarkably prescient.
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Fly320s
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« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2019, 04:06:12 AM »

True.

On another forum (probably the old, pre-schism The High Road), at least ten years ago and probably closer to twenty, somebody offered the suggestion that if you ever need any sort of mental health treatment (psychology or psychiatry), find a shrink in a different city from where you live, use an assumed name, and pay only in cash.

That suggestion was remarkably prescient.

That is my plan should I ever need to do it.

It isn't just about 2A rights; there are other areas of your life that can be affected.  Maybe your job requires a security clearance or other sensitive restrictions. 
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MillCreek
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« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2019, 06:57:09 AM »

^^^I have dealt with many patients who have done this very thing.  Either for behavioral health issues or the clap.
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MillCreek
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Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.
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