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Author Topic: New York Times misidentifies the Blessed Sacrament as a statue of Jesus  (Read 802 times)
Hawkmoon
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« on: April 20, 2019, 09:34:18 AM »

https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2019/04/20/nolte-new-york-times-believes-body-christ-statue/

As the article says:

Quote
And this is what happens when your newspaper is a closed, secular echo chamber, one so closed and secular, this article managed to make its way through the TimesĹ legendary ôlayers and layers of fact checkersö without coming across the desk of even one person who practices the Faith, or one person who knows enough about the elementary basics of a world religion that would allow them to catch an error literally everyone in my neighborhood would have immediately corrected.
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WLJ
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« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2019, 10:29:19 AM »

But does it have a shoulder thing that goes up?


Same thing many in MSM and politicians do with guns
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fistful
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« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2019, 11:46:52 AM »

I believe the statue is mentioned in Eleven Corinthians.
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Hawkmoon
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« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2019, 11:58:46 AM »

I believe the statue is mentioned in Eleven Corinthians.

Is that one of the apocryphal books that appear only in the King Harvey version of the Bible?
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« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2019, 01:49:39 PM »

Yawn. 

Important religious statue misidentified is not a cause for outrage.
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« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2019, 01:50:44 PM »

It WASN'T a statue...
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« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2019, 02:02:29 PM »

Yawn. 

Important religious statue misidentified is not a cause for outrage.


This.

Also, the article had it as a quote from a firefighter.  Either the firefighter got it wrong or something was lost in translation.  Either way, no big deal.
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« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2019, 02:09:42 PM »

This.

Also, the article had it as a quote from a firefighter.  Either the firefighter got it wrong or something was lost in translation.  Either way, no big deal.

NO CLEARLY IT'S A SECULAR PLOT TO DISCREDIT JEEBUS!!!!
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JD

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Hawkmoon
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« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2019, 03:03:33 PM »


Also, the article had it as a quote from a firefighter.  Either the firefighter got it wrong or something was lost in translation.  Either way, no big deal.

Not a quote from a firefighter. It was a quote from the priest -- who happens to be a fire department chaplain, but he was there as a priest, not as a firefighter.

Quote
Hereĺs what likely happenedů When the French-speaking priest spoke to the French-speaking Times reporter Ś in other words, this was not a language problem Ś  the priest said he was primarily concerned with saving the crown of the thorns and the Body of Christ, and the secular Times reporter, who obviously has no education whatsoever about even the basics of a religion practiced by a billion-plus people, a religion that helped to usher in Western Civilization, believed the ôBody of Christö could only be the literal body of Christ in the form of a statue.

Since it was said by a French-speaking priest to a French-speaking "journalist," there was nothing lost in translation. The loss was in comprehension.

It would be like a Rabbi talking about the Ark of the Covenant and a reporter writing about Noah's ark.
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« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2019, 03:43:55 PM »

NO CLEARLY IT'S A SECULAR PLOT TO DISCREDIT JEEBUS!!!!


I don't think anyone's saying that.

As WLJ pointed out, it's as if they were covering a gun-related issue. They lacked basic knowledge of the subject matter, and no one caught the screw-up.

It'd be pretty odd for a Christian to refer to a statue as "the Body of Christ." We believe Christ (along with His Body) is alive, and seated at the right hand of the Father.

It's been pretty widely reported that the priest rescued the bread (or wafers) that were to be used in communion. According to the Catholic interpretation of Scripture, that means they were literally the body of Christ. (And, yes, I know that seems odd, if the same Body is supposed to be on a throne, next to God the Father.) Or maybe he also rescued some sacramental wine (the blood). Not being Catholic, I don't know the logistics of how they do things.
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« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2019, 05:30:56 PM »

There was a photo of a priest holding a container of wafers. That's what they were referring to. The wine is considered to be the blood of Christ.
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« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2019, 09:26:32 AM »

The body and blood of Christ originate in Jesus' statements to his disciples at the Last Supper.

Matthew 26 has the most traditional version of the event.

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« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2019, 09:59:55 AM »

NO CLEARLY IT'S A SECULAR PLOT TO DISCREDIT JEEBUS!!!!


Honestly do get tired of the disrespect from the non-religious.  So very polite.
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« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2019, 10:35:33 AM »

Quote
It wasnĺt a statue of Christ, yĺall Ś it was the Blessed Sacrament, the Communion bread, the waferů And, of course, this would be a top priority for Fournier. In fact, a priority over even the crown of thorns.

I'm struggling to comprehend why a priest would try to save some really dry crackers, which are mass produced, often with secular origins.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/vvaeyb/the-surprisingly-cutthroat-business-of-communion-crackers

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/andrewbrown/2010/mar/09/religion-communion-wafers-french-nuns

Especially in comparison to something like the Crown of Thorns (I'm skeptical it really is the real crown from the crucifixion, but whatever).  I suspect most holy totems/relics the Catholics have at their various cathedrals are purely fantastical/theatrical in nature and lack legitimate origination to their claim.
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« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2019, 11:04:31 AM »

I always thought the Transmutation occurred when the Priest raised the Host (one of the wafers) and repeated Jesus' words:  "This is my Body."  Before that moment, I thought, they were just specially-made crackers.

Same thing with the wine in the Chalice:  "This is my blood."  Until that Transmutation by the Priest, it was just vino.

But maybe that was just in the Diocese of Brooklyn.

Honest question.

But frankly, I would not expect the usual reporter, editor, or "fact" checker to be so intimately familiar with the level of detail required to know that the subject was not a statue of Christ. Opinion?  Molehill.

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« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2019, 02:35:47 PM »

I'm struggling to comprehend why a priest would try to save some really dry crackers, which are mass produced, often with secular origins.


Because in Roman Catholic theology, once the wafers have been consecrated by a priest, they ARE "the body of Christ." It's called "transubstantiation." They are no longer dry crackers.

If you remember the account of the Last Supper in Matthew, the Roman Catholic theology is based on the "This is my body, take this and eat it" part. Most (all Huh?) Protestant denominations focus on the 'Do this in remembrance of me" part and regard the communion wafers (or cubes of bread, in some) as a memorial of/to Jesus rather than somehow magically being transformed into his actual, physical body.
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Hawkmoon
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« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2019, 02:44:27 PM »


But frankly, I would not expect the usual reporter, editor, or "fact" checker to be so intimately familiar with the level of detail required to know that the subject was not a statue of Christ. Opinion?  Molehill.


Maybe not the average reporter, but in an organization like the New York Times, that still claims to have layers of fact checkers, I very much would expect that someone, somewhere in the chain, would know enough about Roman Catholic theology to know this. You don't have to be Roman Catholic to know it. I'm not RC, and I've known it since my early or mid teens. This is why the RC church doesn't allow non-Catholics to take Communion -- because they don't expect the non-Catholics to believe that the gift they would be receiving is the actual body of Christ and, therefore, would not appreciate it.

I'm also not Jewish, but I know that the Ark of the Covenant isn't a reference to Noah's Ark.

If you're going to write about something, you have a responsibility to do enough research to not convey glaringly erroneous "information" in your articles.
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« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2019, 03:03:00 PM »

Molehill😴😴😴
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JD

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« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2019, 05:07:14 PM »

Molehill😴😴😴

New motto for APS:  "Molehills-R-Us"
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Jamisjockey
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« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2019, 03:37:25 AM »

Rabble rabble rabble OUTRAGE!
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JD

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« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2019, 04:58:22 AM »

Because in Roman Catholic theology, once the wafers have been consecrated by a priest, they ARE "the body of Christ." It's called "transubstantiation." They are no longer dry crackers.

If you remember the account of the Last Supper in Matthew, the Roman Catholic theology is based on the "This is my body, take this and eat it" part. Most (all Huh?) Protestant denominations focus on the 'Do this in remembrance of me" part and regard the communion wafers (or cubes of bread, in some) as a memorial of/to Jesus rather than somehow magically being transformed into his actual, physical body.

Lutherans have a slightly different theory, but they also believe in what they call the "real presence" (physical presence) of Christ in the bread and wine.
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« Reply #21 on: April 22, 2019, 06:30:05 AM »

Lutherans have a slightly different theory, but they also believe in what they call the "real presence" (physical presence) of Christ in the bread and wine.

To the point that running into a burning 800 year old cathedral to save these cracker-tokens is a metaphysically wise and rational thing to do?
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« Reply #22 on: April 22, 2019, 06:41:08 AM »

Honestly do get tired of the disrespect from the non-religious.  So very polite.


One of the first comments I saw at the bottom. 
Quote
That there are people who are ignorant of the God of the Bible does not offend me nor does it alarm me. What alarms me is the growing hatred that overlays that ignorance.
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« Reply #23 on: April 22, 2019, 06:42:25 AM »

To the point that running into a burning 800 year old cathedral to save these cracker-tokens is a metaphysically wise and rational thing to do?
I am thinking that as well, but maybe that was his job or something so it was the first thing he thought of.  There was likely nothing he could carry out that couldn't be replaced.
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« Reply #24 on: April 22, 2019, 06:43:25 AM »

It WASN'T a statue...

So you're saying it was misidentified?
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