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Author Topic: Roger Stone  (Read 5454 times)

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #25 on: February 20, 2020, 04:06:26 PM »
I'm sure this guy will immediately be discounted as Soros funded deep state operative, but he paints a pretty good picture of how the jury operated.
I wonder if anyone will come forward to dispute that.

Quote from: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/02/20/roger-stone-juror-seth-cousins-defends-forewoman-tameka-hart/4818170002/
The irony here is that Tomeka Hart, who we elected as our foreperson on a secret ballot," was "perhaps the strongest advocate in the room for a rigorous process, for the rights of the defendant and for making sure that we took it seriously and looked at each charge.

Without her in the room, we would have returned the same verdict, and we would have returned it more quickly and without looking as deeply into the evidence," he said. "I'm firmly convinced of that
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makattak

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #26 on: February 20, 2020, 04:26:12 PM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 20, 2020, 04:06:26 PM
I'm sure this guy will immediately be discounted as Soros funded deep state operative, but he paints a pretty good picture of how the jury operated.
I wonder if anyone will come forward to dispute that.


Should he work (or have worked) for Oracle, Mr. Cousins may also be conflicted:

https://docquery.fec.gov/cgi-bin/fecimg/?201811059133603172

Oh look. $1000 to Beto O'Rourke in 2018.

Also gave to Jill Stein and ACT BLUE.

Definitely not a partisan, nope.
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I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #27 on: February 20, 2020, 04:40:41 PM »
Quote from: makattak on February 20, 2020, 04:26:12 PM
Oh look. $1000 to Beto O'Rourke in 2018.
Also gave to Jill Stein and ACT BLUE.
Definitely not a partisan, nope.
Is that enough to convince you he's lying about their deliberations and the foreperson?
Should he have been disqualified from the jury as well?
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makattak

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #28 on: February 20, 2020, 07:26:28 PM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 20, 2020, 04:40:41 PM
Is that enough to convince you he's lying about their deliberations and the foreperson?
Should he have been disqualified from the jury as well?


I don't have firm evidence he lied during voir dire, unlike the forewoman.

But I do have evidence he may be conflicted.
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I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #29 on: February 20, 2020, 07:41:04 PM »
Quote from: makattak on February 20, 2020, 07:26:28 PM
I don't have firm evidence he lied during voir dire, unlike the forewoman.

Sure, I'll play along. Quote the question and her response that was a lie.
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Ron

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #30 on: February 20, 2020, 08:24:37 PM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 20, 2020, 07:41:04 PM
Sure, I'll play along. Quote the question and her response that was a lie.

So you support the slimy leftists stacking the jury with partisan plants in a courtroom run by a partisan hack.
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DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #31 on: February 20, 2020, 08:27:32 PM »
Quote from: Ron on February 20, 2020, 08:24:37 PM
So you support the slimy leftists stacking the jury with partisan plants in a courtroom run by a partisan hack.
:O
That's a quote from voir dire?
And I assume she answered affirmatively?!?
Wow, I had no idea.
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Ron

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #32 on: February 20, 2020, 08:31:09 PM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 20, 2020, 08:27:32 PM
:O
That's a quote from voir dire?
And I assume she answered affirmatively?!?
Wow, I had no idea.

Not revealing very partisan affiliations is lying by omission.

I'm not makkattack all I'm familiar with is mainstream reports. Those are bad enough.
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For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #33 on: February 20, 2020, 08:38:30 PM »
As I said in the other thread, it's possible she lied in the written portion but that isn't available yet.
In the oral portion that we do have available, I don't see any clear lies so if there is "firm evidence" of one I'd like to see it.
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Jim147

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #34 on: February 20, 2020, 08:39:33 PM »
Her social media is out there same as the judge.

I'm no Trump fan and can't stand stone bu I am so tired of this double standard crap this independent will not be voting for a single D in November.
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makattak

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #35 on: February 21, 2020, 08:09:49 AM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 20, 2020, 07:41:04 PM
Sure, I'll play along. Quote the question and her response that was a lie.

Here you go, Champ:

https://www.cernovich.com/roger-stone-jury/

She claims she doesn't pay close attention or have details about Roger Stone and the case or the "Russia Investigation", when she has multiple tweets about the case, Roger Stone, and the Mueller investigation.
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I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #36 on: February 21, 2020, 09:45:57 AM »
Ok Champ, The exact question/quote is:
Quote
THE COURT: What is it that you have read or heard about him?

PROSPECTIVE JUROR: So nothing that I can recall specifically. I do watch sometimes paying attention but sometimes in the background CNN. So I recall just hearing about him being part of the campaign and some belief or reporting around interaction with the Russian probe and interaction with him and people in the country, but I don't have a whole lot of details. I don't pay that close attention or watch C-SPAN.
And that's right after this exchange:
Quote
THE COURT: You've also indicated a fair amount of paying attention to news and social media including about political things?

PROSPECTIVE JUROR: Yes.
So a few tweets saying she was watching the news is your firm evidence?
Did you notice when those tweets were from? The one where she mentioned C-Span was 2011 and the Meet The Press one was from 2016.
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makattak

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #37 on: February 21, 2020, 10:22:38 AM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 21, 2020, 09:45:57 AM
Ok Champ, The exact question/quote is:And that's right after this exchange:So a few tweets saying she was watching the news is your firm evidence?
Did you notice when those tweets were from? The one where she mentioned C-Span was 2011 and the Meet The Press one was from 2016.

You're going to play the lawyerly route:

"Well she SAID she doesn't have a lot of details... so that could be true, despite multiple comments about the case prior to (AND DURING!) the case."

No. That was a LIE. That it might be able to be twisted so that it might technically be true, but was purposely misleading. That makes it a LIE and a knowing one, at that.
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I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #38 on: February 21, 2020, 10:45:06 AM »
Quote from: makattak on February 21, 2020, 10:22:38 AM
You're going to play the lawyerly route
Well she was questioned by a (supposed) lawyer.  :P

They asked her if she payed attention to political news, she said "yes" - plain and simple. I don't find that terribly misleading.
When asked about Stone, she said she knew he was associated with the campaign and without anyone else mentioning it, knew there was a connection to the Russian probe. That's a pretty poor way to conceal her knowledge.

She retweeted (didn't write) one thing about Stone's arrest and it was using it as a comparison to a bunch of other high profile use of force incidents. That's not proof that she knows a whole lot of details about Stone and his case.
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makattak

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #39 on: February 21, 2020, 11:11:39 AM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 21, 2020, 10:45:06 AM
She retweeted (didn't write) one thing about Stone's arrest and it was using it as a comparison to a bunch of other high profile use of force incidents. That's not proof that she knows a whole lot of details about Stone and his case.

No, but it is evidence of that.

Further, it shows she was very invested in this investigation and the trial. She LIED, and if there is any justice, this will be grounds for a mistrial on appeal.
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I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #40 on: February 21, 2020, 11:28:49 AM »
Quote from: makattak on February 21, 2020, 11:11:39 AM
No, but it is evidence of that.

Further, it shows she was very invested in this investigation and the trial. She LIED, and if there is any justice, this will be grounds for a mistrial on appeal.
I think that's reading a whole lot into one retweet, especially for someone with 13,000 tweets. No one seems to take the president's tweets that seriously.  :lol:

If you want to claim she was too biased to put it aside and should have been eliminated before the trial began, I'm not going to argue that.
If you want to claim she lied on the written portion, I can't really argue that - we haven't seen it yet.
But if that's your firm evidence that she lied, I'm going to just accept that we have vastly different definitions of what that means and move on.
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Ron

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #41 on: February 21, 2020, 11:30:29 AM »
Dittohead would have us believe the forewoman and judge were impartial deciders of fact and law.

He would have you ignore the extremist partisan nature of both.

He wants to trick you into ignoring what is right in your face and into believing his weasle words instead.

Dittohead would make a great commentator on Fake News CNN, with special guest shooting student 😄
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For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #42 on: February 21, 2020, 11:51:38 AM »
You seem to be reading a lot of things that I'm not writing. Maybe I'm being too lawyerly and it's hard for people to follow along.
I wish more people would use the quote function here, it would be harder to put words in my mouth that way.
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MechAg94

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #43 on: February 21, 2020, 11:55:08 AM »
Isn't the oath still in part "the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth"?  

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Ron

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #44 on: February 21, 2020, 11:55:37 AM »
Quote from: DittoHead on February 21, 2020, 11:51:38 AM
You seem to be reading a lot of things that I'm not writing. Maybe I'm being too lawyerly and it's hard for people to follow along.
I wish more people would use the quote function here, it would be harder to put words in my mouth that way.

Is lawyerly clearer, or is lawyerly misdirection and obfuscation?

That's a rhetorical question.
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For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #45 on: February 21, 2020, 11:59:27 AM »
Quote from: MechAg94 on February 21, 2020, 11:55:08 AM
Isn't the oath still in part "the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth"?  
For a juror?
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MechAg94

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #46 on: February 21, 2020, 12:12:47 PM »
Quote from: cordex on February 21, 2020, 11:59:27 AM
For a juror?
It has been a while for me, but I thought they did sort of group thing before we answer questions from the lawyers.   I can't remember what it was.  Either way, that is sort of a standard.  If you are arguing shades of truth, it seems to me it is no longer the whole truth and nothing but that.
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Ron

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #47 on: February 21, 2020, 12:20:09 PM »
Quote from: cordex on February 21, 2020, 11:59:27 AM
For a juror?

Do you believe the venue, the judge and jury selection was conducive to a fair trial?

Would you want to defend yourself in a gun related case under similar circumstances? Even if you were 100% innocent?

We need to stop giving these people the benefit of the doubt.
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For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.

DittoHead

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #48 on: February 21, 2020, 12:43:56 PM »
Quote from: MechAg94 on February 21, 2020, 11:55:08 AM
Isn't the oath still in part "the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth"?  
Yes, I do believe that is part of the oath that Roger Stone swore when he testified before congress.
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Ron

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Re: Roger Stone
« Reply #49 on: February 21, 2020, 12:56:17 PM »
Quote from: MechAg94 on February 13, 2020, 10:02:39 AM
I haven't heard anyone pretend he was innocent.  Where did you see that?  

What I have seen is either 1) he screwed up but the charges/penalty recommendation was excessive, and 2) he is a Trump guy, he must be guilty, so give him the max penalty.  

Considering all the stuff that hasn't been prosecuted over the last 10 years, what Stone did doesn't amount to much.  I can't imagine any other reason federal prosecutors are wasting time with it aside from punishing people around Trump.  I do recall the action to arrest Stone was one of those Mueller shows with dozens of agents in tactical gear showing up to arrest an old guy who seemed to love the attention.  

QFT

Context is everything.

They will gladly use the system to crush us because they hate us.

How much more proof do people on our side need?

Stop giving your enemy the benefit if the doubt.
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For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.
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