Author Topic: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood  (Read 2500 times)

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« on: April 07, 2020, 02:45:51 PM »
This happened about 450 yards from my property.
Fortunately no damage that we've been able to find to our house, but my next door neighbor had two windows blown out and a sliding glass door knocked from its track.  The Longview fire marshal is supposed to be coming out to inspect his house.

The explosion was loud enough that it almost shook me out of bed.  My first instant thought was our house had been struck by lightning, but the weather was clear.  Then I thought a plane had crashed in our yard (we are under the base leg of one of the Hickory airport runways).  Looking out our windows quickly disproved that notion.
Neighbors were swarming outside, trying to figure out what had happened.

Quite the start to my day.

There were no serious injuries at the plant where this occurred, which is fortunate indeed as there were 44 persons employed there.

Here are a couple of other links to stories.

https://www.wcnc.com/article/news/local/oneh2-hickory-plant-explosion-investigation/275-cddcf5ff-e872-4536-bc97-1c0919e101fc

http://www.whky.com/archive/item/30053-several-agencies-respond-to-morning-explosion-at-long-view-plant

ETA:

My sister-in-law heard the explosion in Hudson, sixteen miles away as the crow flies.
One of our fellow church members who also lives in Hudson called to ask if we were okay.  They heard the explosion, as well.  Her husband thought someone had kicked in their basement door and went searching for the bad guy.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2020, 03:03:17 PM by RocketMan »
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,197
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2020, 03:01:54 PM »
So much for trying to sleep in.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 45,737
  • I'm an Extremist!
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2020, 03:03:12 PM »
Yikes!
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

grampster

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,435
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2020, 08:10:27 PM »
Well, your screen name fits the circumstance. :P =D
"Never wrestle with a pig.  You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."  G.B. Shaw

BobR

  • Just a pup compared to a few old dogs here!
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,245
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2020, 08:14:07 PM »








bob

just Warren

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,234
  • My DJ name is Heavy Cream.
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2020, 09:44:50 PM »
This stuff is too dangerous, we need to move onto hydro2ndgen.
Member in Good Standing of the Spontaneous Order of the Invisible Hand.

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 33,619
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2020, 09:46:28 PM »
Wow.  I was trying to figure out what sort of equipment they have onsite from the video.  All I see for sure is hydrogen tube trailers.  There is some sort of system there next to it, but I am not sure what it is.  I know they make very small steam methane reformers, but I am pretty sure they are bigger than that.  All I can figure is that something leaked.....a lot.  Some of those operations can be low budget and don't keep up with their flammable gas detection.  Could be leaks got worse than "normal" and no one noticed.    

The shap of the OneH2 logo looks familiar.  I am curious if they are owned by a larger company.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 33,619
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2020, 09:48:23 PM »
This stuff is too dangerous, we need to move onto hydro2ndgen.
Hydrogen fuel will save us from global warming. 

I know engineers who have worked on hydrogen fuel station designs.  Takes idiot proofing to a whole new level from what I hear. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

just Warren

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,234
  • My DJ name is Heavy Cream.
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2020, 09:53:11 PM »
I wonder how many people set themselves, others, or property on fire during the early days of curbside gas pumps.
Member in Good Standing of the Spontaneous Order of the Invisible Hand.

K Frame

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 44,007
  • I Am Inimical
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2020, 09:56:18 PM »
If I remember correctly, hydrogen has a HUGE explosive range...

The only one I can think of that will explode in richer concentrations is acetylene...
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

K Frame

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 44,007
  • I Am Inimical
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2020, 09:57:34 PM »
I wonder how many people set themselves, others, or property on fire during the early days of curbside gas pumps.

In the early days gasoline tended to have a lot of dissolved propane in it that would out gas, so I'm betting, more than a few.
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

RoadKingLarry

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 21,841
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2020, 10:02:47 PM »
Hydrogen fuel will save us from global warming. 

I know engineers who have worked on hydrogen fuel station designs.  Takes idiot proofing to a whole new level from what I hear. 

As soon as you idiot proof something they go right out and make a bigger idiot.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2020, 01:31:43 AM »
So much for trying to sleep in.

Exactly what I was trying to do in enjoying my new retirement status.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2020, 01:40:43 AM »
I was captain of an emergency response team at a GaAs foundry in Colorado Springs many years ago.  We used hydrogen gas torches for all of our quartz work, making ampules and such for GaAs compounding and crystal growth.  The hydrogen was piped through a good part of the plant to reach the glass working room.  I had a fancy gas detector to find H2 leaks, but never had much of a problem with them as most of the pipe joints were welded IIRC.  Hydrogen is such a small molecule, it would not have taken much of a flaw in a pipe fitting to cause a big leak.
It still gave me the willies at times, knowing what kind of energies could be let loose if something went wrong.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

HankB

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16,564
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2020, 08:03:43 AM »
I worked for a company that used high pressure hydrogen to load optical fibers before using a laser to write Bragg gratings in the cores. We referred to the high pressure chambers as "Hydrogen Bombs."

The safety people didn't like the "bomb" nickname very much.

Then we tried deuterium loading . . .
Trump won in 2016. Democrats haven't been so offended since Republicans came along and freed their slaves.
Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it. - Mark Twain
Government is a broker in pillage, and every election is a sort of advance auction in stolen goods. - H.L. Mencken
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain

230RN

  • It's like swimming to shore in an ebb tide.
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 18,824
  • Pushing back. Help me out, here...
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2020, 09:09:34 AM »
If I remember correctly, hydrogen has a HUGE explosive range...

The only one I can think of that will explode in richer concentrations is acetylene...

I didn't find out about it right away, but Son1 used to generate H2 by water plus Drano in a coke bottle.  (Drano, NaOH, used to have aluminum chips in it to make agitating bubbles.)  He'd inflate a balloon by putting it on the neck of the bottle, then take it off and put a match to the balloon.  That made a big enough bang that I heard them on one of our outdoor breaks where I worked, about a half mile away.

Wie Vater, wie Sonne.  I hadda laugh about it when I found out.

Terry, using Scotch tape to seal my envelopes nowadays, 230RN

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 33,619
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2020, 10:13:29 AM »
At work, we make hydrogen, or at least we purify off gases from nearby chemical plants.  Hydrogen is pretty safe as long as you don't let it leak or let oxygen mix with in the process (safer than other stuff I have been around).  We have O2 analyzers on the incoming gas as well as the tail end.  Everyone is also required to wear gas monitors in the plant.  H2 always sets off the CO detector long before it triggers LEL (lower explosive limit) alarm.  We have enough methane and hydrogen on site that we are covered by OSHA Process Safety Management and a lot of regulations to comply with.  This site in NC is pretty small. 

IMO, the most dangerous thing is allowing H2 to leak and get trapped in an enclosed area where it can concentrate.  At least, that is the primary cause of the most serious safety events I have heard of.  I am kind of wondering if they had a pipe or tube let loose dumping a bunch of H2 all at once that ignited like a small fuel air bomb.  Those tube trailers in the video hold quite a bit of H2 at 3000 psi or so.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2020, 03:42:04 PM »
The explosion occurred inside the building, blowing out at least one wall and up through the roof from what I have been able to gather.
I wonder if there was a leak in the building, with the hydrogen rising and collecting in a ceiling space.  Source of ignition, then boom!
It was an incredibly loud bang, even at almost 500 yards distance.  It was easily louder than 155mm HE round detonations I heard in the service.
We could hear a loud hissing sound from escaping gas for some minutes after the explosion.  Don't know if that was compressed hydrogen coming from damaged pipes or tanks, or perhaps natural gas feed stock from a ruptured line.  We did not notice any mercaptan smell, and the wind was blowing the right direction to have brought it to us, so it probably wasn't natural gas.

Found out that the hardware store at the bottom of the hill, at .63 miles from the blast site, had one of their front display windows blown in.  I went there to have a lawn mower tire repaired and they were cleaning up the glass and installing a plywood patch over the window.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

230RN

  • It's like swimming to shore in an ebb tide.
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 18,824
  • Pushing back. Help me out, here...
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2020, 06:30:16 PM »
I gotta chuckle at that reporter's name:  Steve Ohnesorge.  Steve "Without care, worry."

I'm still not clear on whether this was a pressure vessel rupture or a real combustion explosion.

From the energy involved, it could be either a real big pressure vessel, or a real big H2 - O2 mix.

Neither of which leaves much explosive residue to analyze.

Or is that still up in the air?

Terry, 230RN

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2020, 08:28:42 PM »
I gotta chuckle at that reporter's name:  Steve Ohnesorge.  Steve "Without care, worry."

I'm still not clear on whether this was a pressure vessel rupture or a real combustion explosion.

From the energy involved, it could be either a real big pressure vessel, or a real big H2 - O2 mix.

Neither of which leaves much explosive residue to analyze.

Or is that still up in the air?

Terry, 230RN

I'm not sure what it was, Terry, H2 pressure vessel bursting or gas combustion of some sort.  It was one helluva boom is all I can tell you.
The shock wave was strong enough to cause damage at least 2/3rds of a mile away, something I confirmed personally.
I've been darn close to lightning strikes before ('frinstance, took a strike to an antenna on my house one July 4th when I lived in COS) where I thought the instantaneous thunder was loud, but this explosion was much louder, even at a quarter mile away.
Standing in the bedroom after the boom, there were a few seconds when I thought a plane had crashed in my yard. (I have a 2/3rd acre lot close to the airport.)
When I was one of Uncle Sam's Misguided Children, I got to hear arty and other ordinance explosions on the range now and again.  There was one time in Hawaii when I was volunteered as a radio operator for an EOD team.  We blew up a big pile of dud ordinance on the range one day, and it made a heck of a boom.  As I recall, it wasn't quite as loud as what happened at the hydrogen plant, and we were a similar distance away when it went bang.  It did make a real nice mushroom cloud and tossed a bit of shrapnel our way, making things a bit sporty for a few seconds.

If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

230RN

  • It's like swimming to shore in an ebb tide.
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 18,824
  • Pushing back. Help me out, here...
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2020, 08:37:13 PM »
Thanks, I thought I was just missing something in the thread.  So we wait and see.

Judging from Son1's experiments with H2 filled balloons, it can make some pretty good sharp-edged shock waves.  (I heard them about 1/4 mile away.)
« Last Edit: April 08, 2020, 08:52:08 PM by 230RN »

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2020, 02:14:41 AM »
My neighbor immediately behind my house and a couple hundred feet closer to the hydrogen fuel plant told me something interesting.  He was working outside when the event occurred. He reported hearing a popping sound just seconds before the earth shattering kaboom.  Makes me wonder if there wasn't a quick release of a substantial amount of hydrogen that found an ignition source a few seconds later.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

K Frame

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 44,007
  • I Am Inimical
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2020, 09:14:02 AM »
My neighbor immediately behind my house and a couple hundred feet closer to the hydrogen fuel plant told me something interesting.  He was working outside when the event occurred. He reported hearing a popping sound just seconds before the earth shattering kaboom.  Makes me wonder if there wasn't a quick release of a substantial amount of hydrogen that found an ignition source a few seconds later.


That's interesting... Basically an unintentional FAE bomb...
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,578
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2020, 09:24:00 AM »

That's interesting... Basically an unintentional FAE bomb...

That's a good possibility.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 33,619
Re: Hydrogen make big boom in my neighborhood
« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2020, 09:24:21 AM »
If a pipe or tube around one of those high pressure tube trailers let go, that could dump a lot of hydrogen into the air in a very short time.  If it was partially trapped in the building, that could focus the concussion toward that one lady's house.   I was trying to figure out if this was a slow leak in the building that ignited when people arrived in the morning and turned on lights or if it was a rupture or heavy leak.  I don't know.  I am leaning toward sudden leak as I think the building would suffer more damage if it was all inside.  

“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge