Author Topic: Mandatory masks?  (Read 23082 times)

Ben

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #150 on: July 20, 2020, 08:00:12 AM »
Perhaps I was unclear?

I think it's likely that there will be some Americans, especially in densely populated cities, that just wear masks in public now.  I think that it (mask wearing) is just going to be something you see sometimes. Like Islamic head coverings or Uggs.  The actual individuals will change (perhaps Martha feels sick today, but it'll be Karen next week) but I think you will see masks as a not uncommon sight in America from now on.  Like it is in several other countries.

I think between the added fear of a pandemic that affected them, the country wide inability to make informed risk management decisions,  and the amount of virtue invested in making by a lot of people  it's part of the American culture now.


Actually, that might be one good thing coming out of all this. Though I don't work anymore, there were plenty of times when I did when it would have been nice if one of the, "The office can't run without me, I'm too important!" people who insisted on coming in sick wore a mask and socially distanced, or if it wouldn't have seemed weird for me to put one on when they didn't.

Maybe at least some part of the population will put on a mask when they're sick with a cold or the flu, but still out and about in public.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #151 on: July 20, 2020, 08:17:10 AM »
I wasn't talking about a few people wearing masks when they are sick. I seem to recall seeing that before the pandemic. I'm talking about what is happening now, where the majority of people in a given store are wearing masks, presumably with no symptoms.
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dogmush

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #152 on: July 20, 2020, 08:34:31 AM »
Just spitballing?

On a scale of Tokyo where pre pandemic masks were a common unremarkable sight and Mayberry where a mask meant you were robbing someone?  My SWAG is that in American cities you will see somewhere between one and 5 and 1 in 10 folks have a face covering from here on out.  There will be sub-cultures where it's more common, and some where it's less, but I really think masks are just a part of the American landscape now.

This is based on my gut feeling, my watching of social media mask (and no mask) justification and rants, and my observation that folks seem to like having something wrong (or special)* with them and their kids these days and mask wear is an easy "We're special" signal.


*Everything from depressino, to ADHD, to peanut allergies, to "The Spectrum"; It seems everyone has a diagnosis of some kind, or is going to go get one.

Ben

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #153 on: July 20, 2020, 08:37:59 AM »
I wasn't talking about a few people wearing masks when they are sick. I seem to recall seeing that before the pandemic. I'm talking about what is happening now, where the majority of people in a given store are wearing masks, presumably with no symptoms.

I understand that, but at least where I have lived, it was rare to see someone with a mask in a situation where it might actually have been a good and reasonable idea. I was saying above that when all this blows over, perhaps a remnant of the panic will be that more people will be comfortable wearing a mask when it makes sense without others thinking they are some kind of weirdos or something.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

Ron

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #154 on: July 20, 2020, 10:08:59 AM »
Masks in public during flu season will bother me a lot less than the disgusting customers who come to my place of business every season leaking out of their nose, coughing sniffling and sneezing spreading their infection.

It used to be a real problem in my retail location keeping coworkers from coming in when sick, bet that won't be as much of a problem going forward.
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TommyGunn

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #155 on: July 20, 2020, 11:08:40 AM »
Perhaps I was unclear?

I think it's likely that there will be some Americans, especially in densely populated cities, that just wear masks in public now.  I think that it (mask wearing) is just going to be something you see sometimes. Like Islamic head coverings or Uggs.  The actual individuals will change (perhaps Martha feels sick today, but it'll be Karen next week) but I think you will see masks as a not uncommon sight in America from now on.  Like it is in several other countries.

I think between the added fear of a pandemic that affected them, the country wide inability to make informed risk management decisions,  and the amount of virtue invested in making by a lot of people  it's part of the American culture now.

That people would continue using masks after THE ANDROMEDA STRAIN ( [tinfoil])  pandemic is over would disturb me.  It IS NOT a fashion statement.  It is at best a  barely reasonable effort to arrest a pandemic.  A pandemic caused by a tiny RNA particle in a lipid shell and a pandemic of fear and wrist-wringing.
Ok....masks have some utility.  A lot of places have proclamations to use them.   After the last covid19 patient dies,   the mask should be tossed into the dustbin of history.

PERIOD!!!
MOLON LABE   "Through ignorance of what is good and what is bad, the life of men is greatly perplexed." ~~ Cicero

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #156 on: July 20, 2020, 11:12:14 AM »
I think a big part of the whole coming to work even when you are sick comes from a corporate culture of either you don't get paid sick days so lose money or you get sick days but if you take them you get some kind of punishment for it.  I've been in both situations during my working life.

As to mandatory masks, I'm against the mandatory part but accept that in certain situations a mask is a pretty good idea though I tend not to wear one unless at a medical facility.

Of course the plus side of masks is that they do a pretty good job of defeating facial recognition.
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makattak

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #157 on: July 20, 2020, 11:15:51 AM »
I asked my mom to crochet me a mask so I can be in compliance.

It's made with multicolored yarn and looks absolutely ridiculous. It rather perfectly illustrates my opinion of the mask kabuki for a disease that's about as dangerous as a bad flu to healthy individuals.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

Ben

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #158 on: July 20, 2020, 11:21:39 AM »
That people would continue using masks after THE ANDROMEDA STRAIN ( [tinfoil])  pandemic is over would disturb me.  It IS NOT a fashion statement.  It is at best a  barely reasonable effort to arrest a pandemic.  A pandemic caused by a tiny RNA particle in a lipid shell and a pandemic of fear and wrist-wringing.
Ok....masks have some utility.  A lot of places have proclamations to use them.   After the last covid19 patient dies,   the mask should be tossed into the dustbin of history.

PERIOD!!!

So a proper and properly worn mask NEVER makes sense?  ???
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #159 on: July 20, 2020, 11:30:29 AM »
I asked my mom to crochet me a mask so I can be in compliance.

It's made with multicolored yarn and looks absolutely ridiculous. It rather perfectly illustrates my opinion of the mask kabuki for a disease that's about as dangerous as a bad flu to healthy individuals.

A man walks down the street in a hat mask like that, people know he's not afraid of anything
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

TommyGunn

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #160 on: July 20, 2020, 11:33:47 AM »
So a proper and properly worn mask NEVER makes sense?  ???

Just where in tarnation  did you read THAT in what I stated? ? ? ? :facepalm:

I said they *could* help in slowing a pandemic ....   *SIGH* ....
MOLON LABE   "Through ignorance of what is good and what is bad, the life of men is greatly perplexed." ~~ Cicero

Brad Johnson

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #161 on: July 20, 2020, 11:34:21 AM »
If the Dumb.Gov would leave mask requirements up to individual business owners, I'm good with that. It leaves the choice where it should be.

I'm drafting a letter right now (physical letter, not email), that suggests that very thing. Mask mandates limited to state facilities only, which is their prerogative, but otherwise leave businesses and persons to make their own choices. It's their right to choose who they serve and how they serve them. Enforcement limited to being asked to leave. If an individual refuses to leave after being asked to do so by the owner, there are other statutes which come into play (trespassing, criminal mischief, etc) so there is no need for an added layer of complexity. Municipal entities are limited in the same fashion... mask mandates limited to their offices/facilities, and enforcement limited to asked non-complying persons to leave.

Also, individuals cannot be fined or arrested for non-compliance unless other factors are at play, things like threats of harm, overtly aggressive behaviors, vandalism, etc, which already have statutory teeth. That will quash this BS heavy-handedness that's cropping up all over the place.

Brad
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dogmush

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #162 on: July 20, 2020, 11:45:48 AM »
I don't disagree that it should not be a .gov mandate (or if it is it needs to be legislated, not an executive fiat, but THAT'S a whole 'nother thread) but what heavy handedness on the part of the .gov are you seeing?

I see lots of mask mandates from state and local govs, and I've seen signs in the four states I've been in this month, but I have seen zero government enforcement of mask mandates either in person or on the ever-present social media, and I suspect You would see that pretty quick. 

Busybody Karen's mask shaming?  You betcha.  Heavy handed .gov enforcement of mask mandates?  Like ROUS's I don't think it exists.

Jim147

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #163 on: July 20, 2020, 12:05:34 PM »
My memory really sucks these days but i think it was New York City that was bring in extra forces to spot check businesses to see if they were enforcing the mask mandated. They could loose their busines license for non compliance.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #164 on: July 20, 2020, 12:21:46 PM »

I don't disagree that it should not be a .gov mandate (or if it is it needs to be legislated, not an executive fiat, but THAT'S a whole 'nother thread) but what heavy handedness on the part of the .gov are you seeing?


https://www.foxnews.com/us/kentucky-couple-house-arrest-ankle-monitors-coronavirus-quarantine-documents

https://www.everythinglubbock.com/news/ector-county-swat-team-raids-local-bar-for-protesting-to-reopen/

Those are just the first two that came to mind.

I should clarify that the letter I'm writing also speaks to business closures and restrictions on the Gov's ability to close slected businesses for "public safety" reasons. If the business chooses to close, fine. That's the owner's choice. However, the State-level EO-based business closures under the threat of loss of licensure or operating permit are absolutely not permitted and any bureaucrat, up to and including the governor, who tries to exercise that option should be prosecuted under RICO.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
-HankB

Big Hairy Bee

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #165 on: July 20, 2020, 12:34:11 PM »
Just where in tarnation  did you read THAT in what I stated? ? ? ? :facepalm:

I said they *could* help in slowing a pandemic ....   *SIGH* ....

It's a Firefly reference:

https://youtu.be/WN49TDIY-Sk

makattak

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #166 on: July 20, 2020, 12:35:43 PM »
A man walks down the street in a hat mask like that, people know he's not afraid of anything

OH, I have the Jayne hat too. I should wear them both together.
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

230RN

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #167 on: July 20, 2020, 01:39:16 PM »
...

Of course the plus side of masks is that they do a pretty good job of defeating facial recognition.

Shhhh.... don't let Mayor de Blasio or Colorado Governor Polis hear that or they'll want all masks to be serialized.  Shhhh...

dogmush

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #168 on: July 20, 2020, 01:45:36 PM »
https://www.foxnews.com/us/kentucky-couple-house-arrest-ankle-monitors-coronavirus-quarantine-documents

https://www.everythinglubbock.com/news/ector-county-swat-team-raids-local-bar-for-protesting-to-reopen/

Those are just the first two that came to mind.

I should clarify that the letter I'm writing also speaks to business closures and restrictions on the Gov's ability to close slected businesses for "public safety" reasons. If the business chooses to close, fine. That's the owner's choice. However, the State-level EO-based business closures under the threat of loss of licensure or operating permit are absolutely not permitted and any bureaucrat, up to and including the governor, who tries to exercise that option should be prosecuted under RICO.

Brad

Sure.  I knew about those. Although the house arrest couple I don't know anything more than the headline.  I haven't really done any research on those.

I was confining my comments to masks mandates only.  Of all the things that LE and .gov seems to be overreaching on and acting like thugs, enforcing questionably legal mask mandates seem to be the only thing they aren't being thuggish about.

Brad Johnson

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #169 on: July 20, 2020, 02:56:27 PM »
I was confining my comments to masks mandates only.  Of all the things that LE and .gov seems to be overreaching on and acting like thugs, enforcing questionably legal mask mandates seem to be the only thing they aren't being thuggish about.

Anything they have the ability to overuse, they will. To presume otherwise is folly. If not the police and politicians weaponizing it, then hysterical citizens and zealous special interest groups.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
-HankB

Jim147

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Sometimes we carry more weight then we owe.
And sometimes goes on and on and on.

BAH-WEEP-GRAAAGHNAH WHEEP NI-NI BONG

dogmush

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #171 on: July 20, 2020, 04:35:46 PM »
Unless Gov. Northam is personally revoking licenses there isn't any enforcement in that article, much less heavy handed enforcement.

Mask mandates are a touchy subject for many, so I have been paying a little bit of attention.  I have seen videos of LEO's giving trespassing warnings at the request of store management for mask non-compliance, and NVPD officers walking around issuing "warnings".  But that's about it, and NYPD will arrest you for selling loose cigarettes, so that seems pretty mild.

THere are enough areas of significant government overstep, both from executives and local "health boards" as well as overzelous law enforcement (the paddle boarder, Brads link to the bar in TX, spouses being forced apart, etc) having to do with this pandemic that I'm not going to borrow trouble.  SO FAR I have seen no overzealous or heavy-handed enforcement of mask mandates.  Governor's bloviating?  Definitely.  but very little enforcement.  YMMV.

230RN

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #172 on: July 20, 2020, 07:14:29 PM »
...


Post withdrawn for lack of corroborating evidence.

I'm really disappointed in how much data-scrubbing the MSM commits.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2020, 10:09:48 AM by 230RN »

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MillCreek

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Re: Mandatory masks?
« Reply #174 on: July 20, 2020, 08:26:34 PM »
https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/20/politics/donald-trump-mask-tweet/index.html

Meanwhile, the President himself says that wearing a mask is patriotic.
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Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.