The Deep State - fact or fiction?

[Ben]

  Certainly enough to do what we have seen.  Those activists would know who they could use to do the things they wanted.

Sure. At the local level, more than once I saw a particular employee, after we had an internal meeting, run to his office (next to mine, with the thin walls) and call his friend who was an attorney for the Environmental Defense Center, to debrief.

[fifth_column]

You have a very limited imagination.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/the-sexual-revolution-and-children-how-the-left-took-things-too-far-a-702679.html

Excerpt:

I'm sure I do.  This particular example is obviously a conscious attempt to spread the already ongoing sexual revolution.  I'd say the sexual revolution was itself organically derived.  

Again, transvestism, (holy *expletive deleted*it, I spelled that correctly on the first try) homosexuality, pedophilia, etc. have been recorded in many cultures and areas of the world for longer than our current modern society has existed.  When taking a long-term view it seems that where we are today is a natural progression.  I'm sure there are people and organizations attempting to manipulate society for their own ends, and sexual mores are certainly a powerful shaper of societal norms.  I just think that the drag queen story hour, as misguided and disgusting as it is to me, is a natural expression, not artificial.  Those drag queens and the library boards that approve the activities are not going home at night and cackling about how they're ruining society.  They may be useful idiots being used by some shadowy organization that is itself attempting to reshape society.  However, I was addressing the assertion made by Ron that "transgender acceptance and drag time story hour" is not organic.

[Ron]

Considering the way Facebook, Amazon, Twitter, Google and all it's tentacles...Youtube etc, Patreon, nearly every large news outlet whether local/national paper or on cable or broadcast TV, nearly every large corporation, nearly every professional team sports, every Ivy League school and nearly every other university are all on the same social justice page with the lunatic leftists and war mongering neocons...

...how can behind the scenes coordination even be doubted?

Seriously guys?

There are literally billions of dollars that are being moved around globally to reshape societies away from the traditional western world view.

Call "it" whatever you want.

Who is setting the agenda? The common people or the powerful and insanely rich people behind the scenes who are funding the fundamental transformation of the western world?

[dogmush]

I always am entertained by the implicit assumption that "western culture" was somehow a constant unchanging thing until the rich cabal decided to reshape it that all these conspiracy theories make.

[MillCreek]

I always am entertained by the implicit assumption that "western culture" was somehow a constant unchanging thing until the rich cabal decided to reshape it that all these conspiracy theories make.

The Rothschilds are paying you to say that, aren't they? 

[fifth_column]

I always am entertained by the implicit assumption that "western culture" was somehow a constant unchanging thing until the rich cabal decided to reshape it that all these conspiracy theories make.

I wouldn't be surprised if that cabal existed since the advent of agriculture, growing ever more powerful, greedy, and sadistic . . . . .

It's a lot easier to stomach than the thought that "all this" is pretty much just random.  That's a thought that can unravel many a well-reasoned belief.

[Ron]

I always am entertained by the implicit assumption that "western culture" was somehow a constant unchanging thing until the rich cabal decided to reshape it that all these conspiracy theories make.

The "rich cabal" have been there all along.

They built it and they will tear it down if they want. Or maybe they will just replace the worker bees with a less troublesome bunch.

[Ben]

I might be reading Ron's posts wrong, so apologies if so. It sounds like he's saying this is a SPECTRE level intricate conspiracy.

I never saw that. To me, it was more of, if you're going to label it something, "Saul Alinsky-ism". A lot of people hired who believe in the Saul Alinsky method of "means justify ends" regardless of any oath of office they took. As I said, R administrations generally cut government, so you don't see any "Ayn Rand" cabals. The dems grow gov, so you're bound to get lots of Alinsky-sympathetic people hired. It's not really coordinated so much as statistical, and that's what leads to a couple of FBI employees who are doing each other and sending text messages back and forth about how to do in the guy they don't like, regardless of the ethics code and constitution they swore to uphold.

If I use "deep state" around here, this is what I mean by it. Not SPECTRE or the Illuminati.

[Perd Hapley]

I don't think Ron is even talking about a conspiracy. Conspiracies are, by definition, secret. Ron is talking about things done openly. The CFR and Davos are not secret societies. Neither are the schools, or the publishing houses.

[Ron]

Accusing people of believing conspiracy theories is how people deflect from looking at the obvious.

Like fistful says, this stuff isn't a secret.

They actually shove it in our faces.

Look at the elites of the Republican Party supporting first Hillary and now Biden.

Look at nearly every large corporation pushing the leftist agenda even when it has nothing to do with their products or services.

Who needs a conspiracy? It's in our faces.

[MechAg94]

Accusing people of believing conspiracy theories is how people deflect from looking at the obvious.

Like fistful says, this stuff isn't a secret.

They actually shove it in our faces.

Look at the elites of the Republican Party supporting first Hillary and now Biden.

Look at nearly every large corporation pushing the leftist agenda even when it has nothing to do with their products or services.

Who needs a conspiracy? It's in our faces.

Look at the attempted coup trying to get Trump impeached on made-up charges.  All the investigation files and notes are there to show it was a setup, it just took a while to get them released and made public.  For some reason none of them thought anything would come back on them. 

[RoadKingLarry]

Look at the attempted coup trying to get Trump impeached on made-up charges.  All the investigation files and notes are there to show it was a setup, it just took a while to get them released and made public.  For some reason none of them thought anything would come back on them. 

So far they've been right
 

[Perd Hapley]

So far they've been right
 

For some reason...

[Ron]

More thoughts on this subject.

Deep State is a placeholder term like Dark Matter.

It is not defined by what it actually is but by its obvious influence on everything.

It is defined by what it is aligned with and promotes as well as what it opposes and works against.

I think of it as the evil, bureaucratic, tyrannical zeitgeist that has possessed the wealthiest and most powerful global self described "masters of the universe".

If we had total knowledge then we could map out a flow chart of how everything interacts and how powerful interests influence the course history. Like everything else in reality there is no doubt a hierarchy. But we don't have that kind of total knowledge and seeking it, to me anyway, is a pointless rabbit hole to disappear down. I don't doubt there is coordination, goals and plans, we even read about in the news. They tell us what they are going to do to us every day.

As a foe or enemy "it" is hard to pin down, "it" is Legion. It is enough for me to see "it" and oppose "it" by shaking my fist at you guys on the internet    

[freakazoid]

You have a very limited imagination.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/the-sexual-revolution-and-children-how-the-left-took-things-too-far-a-702679.html

Excerpt:

It's a Brave New World.

[Ben]

You have a very limited imagination.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/zeitgeist/the-sexual-revolution-and-children-how-the-left-took-things-too-far-a-702679.html

Excerpt:

Then there is this on Netflix:

https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2020/08/20/netflix-under-fire-over-cuties-a-film-about-11-year-old-girls-and-twerking/

I harp about this on Netflix and Amazon all the time. Not just mainstreaming, but shoving down throats. For instance, whereas a gay character(s) can be an addition that blends with a show because they're just one of the characters, Netflix will go out of their way to do stuff like gay character sex scenes that have zero to do with the plot, pop out of nowhere, and get graphic. In the meantime, the straight characters are all portrayed as platonic friends. You'll see the gay characters kissing all the time, but zero physical affection from the straight characters, even married straight characters.

Schitt's Creek is a good example of that. I thought the first couple of seasons were hilarious, and the gay (I guess technically "pansexual") character was the funniest character on the show. Then (coincidentally after Trump) all you ever saw was him and his gay lover kissing and kissing and kissing. Way longer than any scene would call for. Just overt ramming of the gay agenda, versus assimilating the gay characters without drawing attention to their sexuality.

[kgbsquirrel]

More thoughts on this subject.

Deep State is a placeholder term like Dark Matter.

It is not defined by what it actually is but by its obvious influence on everything.

It is defined by what it is aligned with and promotes as well as what it opposes and works against.

I think of it as the evil, bureaucratic, tyrannical zeitgeist that has possessed the wealthiest and most powerful global self described "masters of the universe".

If we had total knowledge then we could map out a flow chart of how everything interacts and how powerful interests influence the course history. Like everything else in reality there is no doubt a hierarchy. But we don't have that kind of total knowledge and seeking it, to me anyway, is a pointless rabbit hole to disappear down. I don't doubt there is coordination, goals and plans, we even read about in the news. They tell us what they are going to do to us every day.

As a foe or enemy "it" is hard to pin down, "it" is Legion. It is enough for me to see "it" and oppose "it" by shaking my fist at you guys on the internet    

That is an excellent description.


Here's a bit regarding citizen influence on national policy.

https://youtu.be/5tu32CCA_Ig

[freakazoid]

I might be reading Ron's posts wrong, so apologies if so. It sounds like he's saying this is a SPECTRE level intricate conspiracy.

I never saw that. To me, it was more of, if you're going to label it something, "Saul Alinsky-ism". A lot of people hired who believe in the Saul Alinsky method of "means justify ends" regardless of any oath of office they took. As I said, R administrations generally cut government, so you don't see any "Ayn Rand" cabals. The dems grow gov, so you're bound to get lots of Alinsky-sympathetic people hired. It's not really coordinated so much as statistical, and that's what leads to a couple of FBI employees who are doing each other and sending text messages back and forth about how to do in the guy they don't like, regardless of the ethics code and constitution they swore to uphold.

If I use "deep state" around here, this is what I mean by it. Not SPECTRE or the Illuminati.

Why can't it be both? There are the more regular people affecting things locally and there are people with a lot of money that can use that money to influence things to.

[AZRedhawk44]

When I hear "Deep State" I tend to think of the inertia of top level executive branch actions.  Mostly abroad, but that inertia has impact on domestic policy as well.

That inertia has binding effects upon subsequent administrations.

CIA activities executed under one administration will bind the following administration from taking a different tact with a foreign government or issue.  Tariffs laid down by one administration to protect particular domestic industries require a lot of effort to reverse if the administration that inherits them disagrees with them.  Import policies and quotas from favored nations of one administration might be onerous to the next.  And all of those policies/quotas/tariffs/renditions/assassinations/drug smuggling operations have considerable staff making those actions happen, and even private special interests that are well connected, benefiting from their connection with the action.  They will defend their livelihood with debate at first, threats secondly, and obfuscation and flat footed resistance in the end.

Very rarely is it top level DHS executive collusion against a candidate they disagree with that wins the Oval Office.  But I don't doubt it happened with Trump, and probably has happened in the past as well.  JFK comes to mind.  And Nixon.  Most likely similar things happened during the Carter/Reagan transition, too, but Reagan was able to hammer through it.

[MechAg94]

So far they've been right
 

I thought I heard that one guy who lied on a FISA court warrant has plead guilty.  I forget who, but it was a low level guy.  We will see if it goes any further. 

[dogmush]

Then there is this on Netflix:

https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2020/08/20/netflix-under-fire-over-cuties-a-film-about-11-year-old-girls-and-twerking/

And this on Twitter today:




When the 4chan moderators ban your content on morality grounds, it's really time to take a look at yourself.

[Ben]

Why can't it be both? There are the more regular people affecting things locally and there are people with a lot of money that can use that money to influence things to.

I guess it can, but I would look at the "money influence" more as the crap Soros pulls, versus a bunch of operatives planted in the in the fed.gov by a mastermind and walking around with burner phones and activation codes.

[Jim147]

You are leaving out the pull big industry has on our policy.

I've said it many times. Oil, pharmaceuticals, aviation and others have far more pull on our elected and appointed officials than the NRA could ever hope for.

[WLJ]

You are leaving out the pull big industry has on our policy.

I've said it many times. Oil, pharmaceuticals, aviation and others have far more pull on our elected and appointed officials than the NRA could ever hope for.

Unions

[Ron]

I guess it can, but I would look at the "money influence" more as the crap Soros pulls, versus a bunch of operatives planted in the in the fed.gov by a mastermind and walking around with burner phones and activation codes.

I must have missed the post where anyone suggested that was what was going on.