Author Topic: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...  (Read 953 times)

K Frame

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Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« on: September 10, 2020, 12:15:59 PM »
I installed three new smoke detectors, First Alert 10-year sealed battery models, in late 2017 and early 2018.

Two weeks ago one started chirping as if the battery was going low.

I'd reset it and it would start again. First Alert has some tips on how to clear this, as apparently the most common cause is contamination (such as an insect) in the sensing chamber.

I ran through all of their protocols, and nothing worked.

I went away for a long Labor Day weekend and when I got back the damned thing is deader than a door nail. As in, it won't even respond to testing.

So, I got a bum unit, apparently, that had `1/5th the advertised life.

I've not had a chance yet to get in touch with First Alert about this, but needless to say, I'm not happy.

The other two are live (tested both) and hopefully they will stay that way.

But this just reinforces the old advice to test the units regularly. Had I gone away for a couple of weeks it might have died and I'd have been none the wiser as I'll admit that I don't test nearly as frequently as I should.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2020, 12:20:06 PM »
I'm guessing it's some type of sealed lithium cell? They are usually reliable but are still a mass-produced product. Occasional failures occur. Hopefully First Alert will do you right and stand behind their product.

Brad
« Last Edit: September 10, 2020, 12:35:19 PM by Brad Johnson »
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BobR

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2020, 01:19:43 PM »
I didn't even know something like that existed. I guess that is one way to ensure the smoke detectors get changed out every 10 years. It also makes me wonder what the battery life really is and how much shelf time is accounted for. So many questions.

bob

WLJ

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2020, 01:33:48 PM »
I didn't even know something like that existed. I guess that is one way to ensure the smoke detectors get changed out every 10 years. It also makes me wonder what the battery life really is and how much shelf time is accounted for. So many questions.

bob

Think many cites/states require them now mainly because firefighters were reporting finding smoke detectors with no batteries installed. This way at least they had batteries for the first ten years or so and hopefully the chirping/warnings would cause people to replace them. Trouble is replacing the whole unit is way more expensive than buying a fresh pack of AAs so people often rip them out and leave them out instead.
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K Frame

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2020, 01:34:26 PM »
"I'm guessing it's some type of sealed lithium cell?"

Beats me. All I know for sure is that it's supposed to have a 10-year battery.
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K Frame

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2020, 01:35:38 PM »
"Trouble is replacing the is way more expensive than buying a fresh pack of AAs"

I've never seen a smoke detector run off of anything other than a 9 volt battery.
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WLJ

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2020, 01:36:27 PM »
"Trouble is replacing the is way more expensive than buying a fresh pack of AAs"

I've never seen a smoke detector run off of anything other than a 9 volt battery.

Or 9v battery
All of mine are AA
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K Frame

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2020, 04:20:17 PM »
Interesting. Just found this on First Alert's page...

https://www.firstalert.com/the-battery-in-your-smoke-alarm-matters/

As I said, I don't recall ever seeing a smoke detector indicating AA batteries, but there were many times in the past that I wondered why the 9 volt radio battery was "standard."

Every time it was time to change the batteries on the old units I'd have to make a trip to the store for 9vs. Of course I would always have AAs around... lots of AAs...
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230RN

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2020, 07:36:42 PM »
^
I store AAAs a lot because of small flashlights and remore controls.  I go through them with fair regularity, although I also keep some AAs and 9UVs around.

9UVs are fun because you can snap even "dead" ones together to make some really high (even lethal) voltages.

I don't know why anyone would keep 244 dead ones around, but this guy did:

https://youtu.be/8hwLHdBTQ7s

Even "dead" ones usually seem to have about 7V no-load terminal readings.

Lethal.  No kiddin',  If you don't know how to handle high voltages, don't play with more than, say, 10 or a dozen of them.  You have ben warned.

I have no idea what's cooking with the OP's smoke detector batteries, but I remember similar problems with the first NiCad batteries when they came out. Some were OK, some would self-discharge in a day or so, some would short out all by themselves.  I remember a CB handi-talkie I had which used ten or twelve (with two dummy batteries) AAs and going half nuts keeping ahead of which NiCad in the whole pack of 12 dropped dead and replacing it.

Terry, 230RN
« Last Edit: September 11, 2020, 05:27:03 AM by 230RN »

Pb

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2020, 08:07:22 PM »
Try another brand.

castle key

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2020, 08:28:16 PM »
But this just reinforces the old advice to test the units regularly. Had I gone away for a couple of weeks it might have died and I'd have been none the wiser as I'll admit that I don't test nearly as frequently as I should.

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Jim147

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2020, 09:10:35 PM »
Have you tried unplugging it and plugging it back in?

All the ones in my house are 120v with a 9v backup.

My Co/smoke is double a here in the cabin.
Sometimes we carry more weight then we owe.
And sometimes goes on and on and on.

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HankB

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2020, 10:07:45 PM »
With my current house - bought new - I didn't realize the "hard wired" detectors had batteries too, and was rather startled since the "dead battery" warning was all the linked alarms going off at once . . . at about 2 am. The original 9v batteries lasted about 2 1/2 years. BUT . . . the "10 year life" detectors began failing at about 9 years, so I replaced them all.

That was about 15 years ago. So any discussion of what to look for today in a smoke detector is welcome.

I change the 9v batteries annually and blow out the detectors with canned air. When I check the old batteries, they still show over 9v so I see no reason to deviate from the original "change batteries annually" recommendation to today's "change every 6 months" recommendation.
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Silver Bullet

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2020, 10:30:58 PM »
Quote
BUT . . . the "10 year life" detectors began failing at about 9 years, so I replaced them all.

Must have been sitting on the store shelves for a year!   :P

Quote
When I check the old batteries, they still show over 9v

If you're using a DMM, batteries have to be measured with a current load to see if they will still maintain their voltage (I know you know that already, this is for the benefit of some of our newer readers!   ;) ).  I have a lot of DMMs for various unconvincing reasons, and a couple models have a battery test function.  I believe (hope) they are applying a current load when they measure the voltage.

230RN

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2020, 05:45:06 AM »
Must have been sitting on the store shelves for a year!   :P

If you're using a DMM, batteries have to be measured with a current load to see if they will still maintain their voltage (I know you know that already, this is for the benefit of some of our newer readers!   ;) ).  I have a lot of DMMs for various unconvincing reasons, and a couple models have a battery test function.  I believe (hope) they are applying a current load when they measure the voltage.

The little "$Free" to  ~$3.95 Harbor Freight Cen-Tech meters have a battery test function which puts a 360 ohm load on the battery.  For a 1.5 volt battery, it should read 4.0mA, and for 9 volt batteries, it should read 25 mA.  I find that handier than the actual battery tester I have, although the Cen-Tech won't test button cells directly.

I keep a couple of analog (D'Arsonval) meters around for various reasons, mainly because they're less sensitive than DMMs and will mechanically average squirrely voltages (and currents) and don't pick up every electron that happens to stick to the probes. =D

The detectors in my building are pretty old (25+ years?) so I figure regardless of the method of detection (radioactivity, optical, thermal, whatever) I'd better put up my own new one.  I think it was only about $15 at Ace Hardware, and I'm fairly certain I saw an ad for free ones with a purchase of $X.XX or more at another store.  Sure enough, it recently beep-beeped at me so I put a new 9UV in it, all OK.

Terry, 230RN

The battery test setting:
« Last Edit: September 11, 2020, 06:39:28 AM by 230RN »

K Frame

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2020, 07:14:44 AM »
"Must have been sitting on the store shelves for a year!"

Manufacturer's, by law, must put the manufacture date on the unit. You can tell how long it's been sitting around.

All of the ones I bought showed a manufacturing date of 2 to 3 months before I got them.
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K Frame

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2020, 01:24:45 PM »
"Have you tried unplugging it and plugging it back in?"

Yes, but those bastards failed to include a power cord.
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AmbulanceDriver

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2020, 04:54:23 PM »
"Have you tried unplugging it and plugging it back in?"

Yes, but those bastards failed to include a power cord.

Have you tried testing it with the smoke from a bunch of burning floppies?
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230RN

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Re: Problem with First Alert 10-year-battery smoke detector...
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2020, 09:15:45 PM »
I've been waiting for someone to say something about this.  I'm not sure, but I believe the higher 9 volts is necessary for the operation of (at least) the radiation-type detectors.

Please confirm or disconfirm.

I was also thinking maybe it was the fact that 9volt batteries consist of 6 individual cells, possibly enhancing the overall reliability or ease of monitoring the usable output voltage over time.

Just guesswork.

Terry
« Last Edit: September 11, 2020, 09:46:48 PM by 230RN »