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Author Topic: Worst case scenario  (Read 22263 times)
grampster
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« on: September 19, 2007, 02:26:21 PM »

OK.

Hillary is POTUS.

The House is solidly Democrat.

The Senate is solidly Democrat.

For the sake of argument, the Dem majority is as solid as the best majority that the Republicans have had recently.

What happens now?
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« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2007, 02:27:57 PM »

Do you have the book of Revelation handy?   smiley
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« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2007, 03:22:40 PM »

Do you have the book of Revelation handy?   smiley

Think worse than that...

http://www.cracked.com/index.php?name=News&sid=2391
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« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2007, 04:38:25 PM »

You are now on her list and you'll find out what happens to you personally in Jan 09 police
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Standing Wolf
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« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2007, 11:00:18 PM »

Quote
For the sake of argument, the Dem majority is as solid as the best majority that the Republicans have had recently.

Oh. Nothing changes, then, eh?

If nothing changes, nothing changes.
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The Rabbi
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« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2007, 11:36:33 PM »

All the Bush tax cuts are repealed.  A series of expensive entitlements are introduced, including Hillarycare.  We cut and run in Iraq.  We suffer another terrorist attack, which is blamed in Bush of course.  The stock market tanks.  Companies outsource everything to Dirkdirkastan and move off shore to Bermuda.
Unemployment skyrockets, leading to more govt programs.  Eventually we look just like France.
Oh, and gun control measures make it basically too much hassle to own a gun.
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HankB
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« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2007, 11:57:41 PM »

. . .  Eventually we look just like France. . .
Oh no, oh no . . . I am NOT giving up my soap, water, deodorant, and basic hygiene!
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griz
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« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2007, 12:22:08 AM »

Worst case?  The sky will fall.
Realistically?  It will be just like Clinton the 1st:  They will make several attempts to change everything and outlaw rich people, and the republicans will start acting like republicans and fight the legislation.  Two years later the house and/or senate goes republican, and the process starts over again.
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« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2007, 12:44:25 AM »

OK.

Hillary is POTUS.

The House is solidly Democrat.

The Senate is solidly Democrat.

For the sake of argument, the Dem majority is as solid as the best majority that the Republicans have had recently.

What happens now?

To be honest I really don't know.

What I could speculate is that some form of Hillarycare will be passed.

There will be a time-line drawn with dates from troops leaving Iraq, probably won't be followed and the war will probably escalate because some of the extremists will be pissed because there is a women leader of the infidels now and attempt another attack similar to 9-11. Hillary will say that the escalation is to preserve human rights of the middle eastern people.

Republicans will take back the House and Senate in 2010 because Hillarycare causes lines outside doctor offices and spins us into deficit in the teens of trillion dollars.

2012 Hillary is defeated in her reelection campaign


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The Rabbi
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« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2007, 12:45:59 AM »

. . .  Eventually we look just like France. . .
Oh no, oh no . . . I am NOT giving up my soap, water, deodorant, and basic hygiene!

It's tete de veaux for you, mon ami! BWAHAHAHA!!!
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« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2007, 01:14:33 AM »

Eventually we look just like France.

I wouldn't mind a mandatory 35 hour work week.
Well,it would suck-having no money-but I'd have more time to spend online complaining about everything & pining for a Socialist Eutopia.
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The Rabbi
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« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2007, 01:17:21 AM »

Actually news this AM is that Sarkozy is trying to loosen the 35 hr work week.  His biggest opponents are of course the public sector unions.  I saw that in France a street sweeper can retire at age 50 with full pension and benefits.

Yeah, 35hr work week with paid 2-4 week vacations every year and almost guaranteed employment is great.  If you're the one working.  If you aren't it kind of sucks because it means you're unlikely to get a job.
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Joe Demko
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« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2007, 01:21:24 AM »

Some legislation will get passed that a portion of the population will be against.  Some of that portion will spend a lot of time complaining about it on the internet.  Eventually the Donkeys will lose their majority  and an Elephant will become POTUS.  At that point, some legislation will get passed that a portion of the population will be against.  Some of that portion will spend a lot time complaining about it on the internet.

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Mike Irwin
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« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2007, 01:24:00 AM »

I've been to France and see the streets there.

The street sweepers get a work out.  laugh
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Paddy
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« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2007, 02:03:30 AM »

Not all the Dems are spittle flying Air America type radicals.  A bunch of them are still somewhat reasonable, and some are even comparable to 'moderate Republicans'.  'What happens' largely depends on how extreme Hillary gets during the first term.

Some kind of 'socialized medicine' 'single payer' (or whatever you want to call it) health insurance scheme attempt is inevitable.  I think a majority of Americans favor 'universal health care' and would welcome a 'plan' where everyone is covered.  It seems to me that employers currently pay most of the health premiums in this country and would jump at a chance to transfer the burden to someone else.

So if she has a majority of both Americans and employers on her side, she's there.

On national defense, who knows?  I don't think she's a '60's 'all we are saying is give peace a chance' hippie (anymore), would retaliate immediately if we are attacked.  OTOH, she wouldn't get entangled in 'preemptive' wars, either and the Dem congress wouldn't allow it.

On taxes, well you know where that's goin'.  The upper 1%-15%...and corporations will get hit hardest. Nevermind that corporations don't pay taxes, they just add it onto the price and pass it along to you and me.

Gun control?  That's been a loser for the Dems but there are still enough gun grabbing blissninnies in Congress to force something-maybe another AWB.

The size of fed.gov (Thanks Bush  rolleyes) won't decrease under a Hillary admin but hopefully she'd address illegal immigration in some other way than amnesty.  The next POTUS will have to deal with illegal immigration, the elephant in the living room is too big to ignore.

AND, I think it's likely the Dems will be sharply divided whichever way she goes-'semi' moderate or hard left.  So they'll schism like the Republicans, with lots of infighting.
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Mike Irwin
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« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2007, 02:11:40 AM »

"Not all the Dems are spittle flying Air America type radicals."

True.

Virginia's most recent past Governor, Mark Warner, is a perfect example of this.

I truly expected him to be the archetypical Democratic governor in the same vein as Doug Wilder, who tried desperately to grab guns and push for a social services state that would rival DC or Maryland.

He was partially successful on the guns, managing to pass the one handgun a month law, but that has been partially rolled back since Wilder's term in office (much to his dismay).

Anyway, Mark Warner proved to be a pretty good friend to Virginia gunowners (far better than "Republican" Tom Davis has been for us in Congress) and was a fine governor overall.

He's now running for John Warner's (no relation) seat in Congress, and will very likely win it.

I'm a bit torn, because even though he's a very moderate Democrat, he'll still vote with the Democtrats most of the time.
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longeyes
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« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2007, 02:18:54 AM »

Secession.

It may take a few years and a few catastrophes, but it's coming...
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« Reply #17 on: September 20, 2007, 02:46:36 AM »

Secession.

It may take a few years and a few catastrophes, but it's coming...

Actually, I doubt it. Civil wars are no fun, and civil war against the US military would be hell. Things would have to get unbelievably bad before a serious secessionist movement would get off the ground. As in "way worse than Cuba" bad. IMHO, of course.

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Mike Irwin
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« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2007, 02:52:50 AM »

Ok, to answer Grampster's question... What happens now...

There will be another election cycle.

If the majority of the people in the nation aren't happy with the way things are going, they'll vote to change the situation.

That happened in 1994, only 2 years after Bill Clinton resoundingly thwacked Bush I.

Clinton pushed through a large tax cut, people were disgusted with it, and the Democrats paid.

As for secession, you're joking, right?

There are virtually none of the regional issues extant today of the type that sparked the civil war.

Who would sucede?
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Manedwolf
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« Reply #19 on: September 20, 2007, 02:57:56 AM »

Who would sucede?

Vermont, maybe, but who would notice?  grin

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longeyes
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« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2007, 03:10:58 AM »

Quote
Actually, I doubt it. Civil wars are no fun, and civil war against the US military would be hell. Things would have to get unbelievably bad before a serious secessionist movement would get off the ground. As in "way worse than Cuba" bad. IMHO, of course.

I didn't say civil war, I said secession.  The "red" contingent will begin to realize that they are going to be submerged by the "blues."  Demographic momentum and bad government policies.  They will have a choice: get with the program or OPT OUT.   National unity will be setting aside the Constitution and becoming a good little socialist/consumer.  Those who think that the social predicates aren't there are dead wrong...but time will tell.

Oh yeah, one more consequences of a Democrat utopia: millions of Americans will start packing "illegally."  Deteriorating social conditions in the new "everybody welcome" America will catalyze that.

California is the future, and I already live there.
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Len Budney
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« Reply #21 on: September 20, 2007, 03:12:31 AM »

I didn't say civil war, I said secession.  The "red" contingent will begin to realize that they are going to be submerged by the "blues."  Demographic momentum and bad government policies.  They will have a choice: get with the program or OPT OUT.

It's hard to envision how that would happen without violent suppression from Washington.

--Len.
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Mike Irwin
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« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2007, 03:29:25 AM »

OK, serious question time, Longeyes...

Given the ebb and flow of political fortunes in this nation on a rather cyclical basis, what makes you think that an upcoming situation where one party is in power exclusively would trigger an upwelling in secessionism?

What would be the catalyzing event?

And just where would these individuals coalesce?

Would we suddenly have a bunch of new states form?

Upper Peninsula Michigan as a red state?

East Maryland blue, West Maryland red?

North East Virginia a blue state shearing off Virginia?

Pennsylvania could end up as THREE new states...
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« Reply #23 on: September 20, 2007, 03:33:59 AM »

And all that in the next 4 years.  shocked

No, like the Carter years when Republicans were supposedly a dying breed (I remember reading a NYT article titled something like "Will the GOP Survive?") this too shall pass.
There are enough conservative Democrats in Congress that damage will be somewhat limited.  There isn't a mandate for the kind of Great Society nonsense we've had in the past.
And with any luck it will give the GOP some time to re-think where they're going and come back with real ideas.
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HankB
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« Reply #24 on: September 20, 2007, 04:02:21 AM »

. . . Clinton pushed through a large tax cut, people were disgusted with it, and the Democrats paid. . . .
I don't remember my taxes going down during the Clinton administraton.
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Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain
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