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Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: AZRedhawk44 on September 09, 2020, 03:40:42 PM

Title: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on September 09, 2020, 03:40:42 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9xhJrPXop4&feature=youtu.be

I'm optimistic about this one.

I just watched Villeneuve's Blade Runner 2049 this last weekend, and he did a marvelous job preserving the ambiance of the original film, giving us new facets of a Replicant world to consider.

Lynch's 1984 Dune is a favorite of mine despite its flaws. I hated the SyFy channel Dune miniseries done in 2000. If Villeneuve can pay respect to the power of the mind in Herbert's original work, and keep Paul and his Atreides/Fremen cohorts on track as the stoics they are (Paul in particular...the religious/philosophical roots of the book demand it), this will be a monumental accomplishment. Dune has been described many times by many great filmmakers as "unfilmable." Villeneuve may have schooled them all.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Kingcreek on September 09, 2020, 03:50:36 PM
As a big fan of the original book, I never expect much from a movie. They can only present a summary of a literary work like that in a movie length production. Same for Lord of the Rings, etc.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on September 09, 2020, 04:31:31 PM
AZ and me must be one of the few people on the planet that didn't have a big problem with the original movie. It wasn't the greatest, but I didn't think it was that bad either. I still rewatch it every couple of years or so.

Trailer for the new one looks pretty good. A few thoughts:

IMDB has the Paul character as third billed. Maybe they're doing "order of appearance" or something.

The new Paul, according to IMDB, is 25, but he looks like he's 15. Not sure what I think of that casting.

Several interesting choices of actors for other characters.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on September 09, 2020, 04:37:40 PM
I also liked the original movie.  It's not perfect, but it's OK, and I watch it happily when I find it.

I really like the book Dune, but as long as they tell a decent story with good characterization and dialogue that is internally consistent, it's OK if they change a few things.  That's why it's called an "adaptation".  It's also where so many remakes go wrong these days.  Tell a good story, and people will like it.  Be lazy and pray nostalgia carries your movie?  That's rolling the dice.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on September 09, 2020, 04:55:45 PM
I saw Dune in the theater when it first came out. I only had the vaguest idea what it was about. My friends wanted to go, as they were far more into sci fi than I was at the time, so sure, whatever.

I knew we were in for trouble when they passed out a glossary sheet as we entered the theater. WTF?

Despite its flaws, I have to admit... I liked it. I really did. It's pure 80s big hair filmmaking, but I still watch it occasionally, and I still enjoy it.

I only finally read the book maybe 5 years ago. Almost 600 page, IIRC, in the paperback I had... I finished it in less than 3 days. Unbridled awesomeness is the only way I can put it.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on September 09, 2020, 04:59:05 PM
I think the last time I read Dune was in 1980 or so. I need to read it again before I see the new movie. Though like others, I'm not expecting "true to the novel", nor will I be upset by the lack thereof.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 09, 2020, 05:18:26 PM

The new Paul, according to IMDB, is 25, but he looks like he's 15. Not sure what I think of that casting.

Been a long long time since I read the book but IIRC Paul was around 15-16 or so in the first half of the book
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on September 09, 2020, 05:40:54 PM
Been a long long time since I read the book but IIRC Paul was around 15-16 or so in the first half of the book

Casting a 15 year old looking actor can make sense if they're looking at more than one movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 09, 2020, 05:43:15 PM
Casting a 15 year old looking actor can make sense if they're looking at more than one movie.

That's along the lines of what I'm thinking. They wanted someone who could look young in the first half but then appropriately older in the second.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: lee n. field on September 09, 2020, 05:47:41 PM
Been a long long time since I read the book but IIRC Paul was around 15-16 or so in the first half of the book

And Jessica wouldn't have been too much older than thirty. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on September 09, 2020, 07:13:15 PM
That's along the lines of what I'm thinking. They wanted someone who could look young in the first half but then appropriately older in the second.

Villeneuve's Dune is addressing the first book of Herbert's series, but it is doing so as two movies.  This movie is only part 1 of the book, up to where Paul flees into the desert and joins with the Fremen.  It'll probably include his romance with Chani, and his rise in Fremen leadership.  Unsure if it will end before or after he transmutes the sandworm bile.

There's a few years between parts 1 and 2 of this first book.  Enough time for Paul's sister to grow to somewhere around 6 to 9 years old, but I think she had accelerated development.

And of course having Chalamet available for a possible 2nd and 3rd book in the series to play Paul again, as an older man, is helpful.  Though I doubt Chalamet could play Paul from the 3rd book.  But... it might be neat to have Kyle MacLachlan play that particular Paul.  Especially 5-10 years from now.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 09, 2020, 07:50:47 PM
The trailer looks good.  Looks like it will get into all the politics.  The shields look cool.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on September 10, 2020, 11:00:15 AM
I loved the Dune series, absolutely devoured them when I was a kid.  The movie came out when I was 16 or 17.  I recall walking out of the theater after maybe 20 minutes.  I've tried watching it as an adult, thinking I was too immature at the time, but I don't think I watched all of it even then.  I don't think David Lynch had a good grasp of the material, or he got entirely something else out of the book than I did.

This one looks promising, though.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 10, 2020, 11:11:48 AM
I loved the Dune series, absolutely devoured them when I was a kid.  The movie came out when I was 16 or 17.  I recall walking out of the theater after maybe 20 minutes.  I've tried watching it as an adult, thinking I was too immature at the time, but I don't think I watched all of it even then.  I don't think David Lynch had a good grasp of the material, or he got entirely something else out of the book than I did.

This one looks promising, though.

While it had it's good points he was trying to cram too much book into one movie plus I got the impression they were aiming, and failed, for a summer big money blockbuster popcorn movie, ie Star Wars. Dune requires the hard sci-fi treatment, far more time to be told properly, and requires a studio willing to sink a ton of money into it knowing they may not see much of it back, ie Blade Runner 2049.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JN01 on September 10, 2020, 04:12:57 PM
I saw Dune in the theater when it first came out. I only had the vaguest idea what it was about. My friends wanted to go, as they were far more into sci fi than I was at the time, so sure, whatever.

I knew we were in for trouble when they passed out a glossary sheet as we entered the theater. WTF?

Despite its flaws, I have to admit... I liked it. I really did. It's pure 80s big hair filmmaking, but I still watch it occasionally, and I still enjoy it.

I only finally read the book maybe 5 years ago. Almost 600 page, IIRC, in the paperback I had... I finished it in less than 3 days. Unbridled awesomeness is the only way I can put it.

I tried reading the book as a teenager, but didn't make it very far with all the flipping back and forth to the glossary.  Guess my attention span wasn't up to it.  Later, I thought I'd go see the movie, wasn't any better. It's one of the few movies where I walked out in the middle of it.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on September 10, 2020, 04:41:50 PM
I actually liked the Mini series. It followed the books more closely that the movie. I also hated the books. Hubert's writing is as dry as the planet he writes about. It took me a few attempts to get through it.
I really like the casting for The Beast and I'm interested in seeing Stellen Starsgard as the Baron. However, I have fairly low expectations. It could be awesome, but considering the material and modern Hollywood, it's very possibly going to be crap.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 10, 2020, 04:56:15 PM
I get the appeal of Dune, but I find it difficult to buy into those 87-volume franchises. If I need a corpus of literature that extensive, I'll go with the Bible* or the Icelandic sagas, or Journey to the West or something.



*the real one, not the Orange Catholic one.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 10, 2020, 07:17:16 PM
Apparently the SJWs think feel it's too white and cultural appropriation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8RvVQcXGj4
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on September 10, 2020, 07:26:51 PM
Apparently the SJWs think feel it's too white and cultural appropriation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8RvVQcXGj4

That's a good sign.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 10, 2020, 08:10:45 PM
The trailer looks excellent!

One of my favorite books.

I remember checking out the original Dune movie on VHS.

I'm not sure if I was more horrified or gobsmacked.

When I saw Patrick Stewart charging into battle holding a lapdog, I thought I was hallucinating.  ???
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 10, 2020, 11:47:59 PM
The trailer looks excellent!

Indeed.  Plus Pink Floyd on the soundtrack. 

Been a fan of the novels for years.  Looking forward to seeing this film.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on September 11, 2020, 07:12:14 AM
Finally got to watch the trailer...

Holy balls that looks good.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on September 11, 2020, 09:01:20 AM
Wow. This may call for going to the theater and seeing it on the big screen and sound.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on September 11, 2020, 10:32:59 AM
Exactly what I'm thinking.

The last movie I saw in the theater that DEMANDED to be seen in the theater was Blade Runner 2049.

I also saw Deadpool 2 (very good) and Solo: A Star Wars Story (pretty crappy) in the theater because I was visiting friends and they wanted to see them. But neither one demanded to be seen in the theater.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 12, 2020, 09:50:32 AM
For hard Sci-Fi fans Foundation is coming up too.
Hopefully they won't screw this one up and give it the woke treatment. Unfortunately from what little we see in the trailer they may have.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZd3xUDudy8

For those unfamiliar with Foundation. Many consider it the daddy, or grand daddy depending on how you look at it, of modern hard Sci-fi including Dune
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_(Asimov_novel)
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ron on September 12, 2020, 10:00:06 AM
I read the first few Dune novels a couple decades ago.

I've never read Foundation.

If you've read both what would you recommend?

Should I reread Dune or read Foundation?

I have Dune on my Kindle already just waiting for me to jump into it. I have Foundation in my saved for later at Amazon.

Foundation has been recommended to me twice this year, from a cousin and a friend.

Maybe I'll try and knock em both out this winter.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 12, 2020, 10:00:41 AM
One of the things I really like about the Dune trailer is the dialogue between the Reverend Mother and Paul- it introduces the plot very well.  One of the big challenges of the movie is to avoid confusing people, and i think that did it very well.

And the weapons, armor, and sword fighting looked really cool too... =D

The use of heavy wearable body armor (along with the shields) makes sense in the Dune universe if blades are the most common weapon.

This was only briefly mentioned in the book (chain mail on Fayd Rautha).

Notice when Idaho is fighting the Sadukar?  There was a light effect when he stabbed one.  It looks like there may be some special tech with the blade that lets it penetrate physical armor... which is an neat concept!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 12, 2020, 10:02:36 AM
I was not fond of Foundation.  Obviously, opinions vary.

I do love Dune.

Keep in mind that "moral" behind Dune is not especially apparent in the first book (though hinted at).

I wonder how they will handle it in the book.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JN01 on September 12, 2020, 03:49:39 PM
For hard Sci-Fi fans Foundation is coming up too.
Hopefully they won't screw this one up and give it the woke treatment. Unfortunately from what little we see in the trailer they may have.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZd3xUDudy8

For those unfamiliar with Foundation. Many consider it the daddy, or grand daddy depending on how you look at it, of modern hard Sci-fi including Dune
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_(Asimov_novel)

Now that I would be interested in.  Not going to subscribe to Apple TV just to see it, however.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 12, 2020, 07:32:06 PM
From what I remember about Foundation, it was sort of a Great Man Theory of History the Future, and then The Mule comes along and takes that concept to 11, and not in a good way. Not sure I'd be interested in a film version. Dune I wouldn't read, but might want to watch a (good) film version.

The worm in that trailer is sick!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on September 14, 2020, 10:11:12 AM

. . . .

Notice when Idaho is fighting the Sadukar?  There was a light effect when he stabbed one.  It looks like there may be some special tech with the blade that lets it penetrate physical armor... which is a neat concept!

No blade tech required, shields can be penetrated by something moving slow enough. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: makattak on September 14, 2020, 10:24:27 AM
For hard Sci-Fi fans Foundation is coming up too.
Hopefully they won't screw this one up and give it the woke treatment. Unfortunately from what little we see in the trailer they may have.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZd3xUDudy8

For those unfamiliar with Foundation. Many consider it the daddy, or grand daddy depending on how you look at it, of modern hard Sci-fi including Dune
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_(Asimov_novel)

From the looks of it, they're actually doing "Prelude to Foundation" which is the novel I've actually read vs. Foundation which I don't know if I'll ever get around to. 
(Minor spoilers ahead)

Quick synopsis: "Prelude to foundation" is a guy (Hari Seldon, apparently the main character in this series) learning that he can predict events perfectly with enough data on history.* He's aided by a super intelligent AI with some telepathic abilities. I'm guessing the diverse lady isn't the AI.

Foundation is thousands of years in the future where Hari is long dead, but has left a series of instructions only to be opened at specific times in history, to guide humanity through the upcoming crisis. At every point in the last 1000 or so years, the instructions have perfectly described the events happening and what humanity should choose to do. Until "now". This time the galaxy looks absolutely nothing like what he predicted and the leaders panic. It is discovered that his analysis failed because of a biological anomaly that he could not account for. ("The Mule")

I have doubts this will be good, as my recollections don't really match up with the ACTION!!! and INTRIGUE!!! that the trailer suggests will drive the plot.




*(Deterministic view of the world, btw, and wrong because of less than perfect knowledge, but I digress.)

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 14, 2020, 10:37:45 AM
No blade tech required, shields can be penetrated by something moving slow enough. 

Not the metal body armor they are wearing in the trailer though.

(https://www.giantfreakinrobot.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/duneisaac-900x1273.jpg)
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 14, 2020, 11:04:49 AM
From the looks of it, they're actually doing "Prelude to Foundation" which is the novel I've actually read vs. Foundation which I don't know if I'll ever get around to. 
(Minor spoilers ahead)

Quick synopsis: "Prelude to foundation" is a guy (Hari Seldon, apparently the main character in this series) learning that he can predict events perfectly with enough data on history.* He's aided by a super intelligent AI with some telepathic abilities. I'm guessing the diverse lady isn't the AI.

Foundation is thousands of years in the future where Hari is long dead, but has left a series of instructions only to be opened at specific times in history, to guide humanity through the upcoming crisis. At every point in the last 1000 or so years, the instructions have perfectly described the events happening and what humanity should choose to do. Until "now". This time the galaxy looks absolutely nothing like what he predicted and the leaders panic. It is discovered that his analysis failed because of a biological anomaly that he could not account for. ("The Mule")

I have doubts this will be good, as my recollections don't really match up with the ACTION!!! and INTRIGUE!!! that the trailer suggests will drive the plot.




*(Deterministic view of the world, btw, and wrong because of less than perfect knowledge, but I digress.)


I don't remember Prelude to Foundation including an AI.  And if I remember right, Hari's plan was to recover from the collapse of the Galactic empire in 1000 years instead of the predicted 10,000. 

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 14, 2020, 11:26:40 AM
I thought the shield technology made projectile weapons ineffective so fighting went back down to hand weapons.  I guess since sword swings would be stopped by the shield, shorter knives became preferred weapons.  It might be interesting to see one of the youtube medieval weapons guys take a deep dive on that subject.  I am curious if the experts would recommend other potential choices.  Also, if you can't bring a blade in hard, wouldn't chain mail work pretty good? 

The 80's movie showed some sort of projectile gun that fired a round that slowly penetrated the shield.  I only remember it being used once.  If it existed, why not use it all the time. 

The book seemed to indicate there was a lot of suppression of technology if it would threaten the Emperor's power.  There were also some extreme rules against using computers or AI.  I don't remember where they drew the line. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AJ Dual on September 14, 2020, 11:36:18 AM
I don't remember Prelude to Foundation including an AI.  And if I remember right, Hari's plan was to recover from the collapse of the Galactic empire in 1000 years instead of the predicted 10,000. 



The AI was Dors Venibili Hari Seldon's Girlfriend then wife. She was a humanform robot. Nobody but Hari Seldon knew this, or even he just suspected, but didn't know for sure or care. She was working for Daneel Olivaw the first humanform robot who'd been around for 10,000 years since the old-Earth and the original 50 Spacer colonies. (Caves of Steel, Robots of Dawn, The Naked Sun)

Daneel was working under the guidance of the "Zeroth Law", the implied meta-robotic law that supersedes the first law. Namely that a robot must work to prevent harm to all of humanity collectively. Which is why he helped foster the growth of the Galactic Empire, and then encouraged Hari Seldon's Psychohistory to shorten it's collapse. Always looking for ways to keep the galaxy as peaceful and unified as possible.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: makattak on September 14, 2020, 11:44:17 AM
I don't remember Prelude to Foundation including an AI.  And if I remember right, Hari's plan was to recover from the collapse of the Galactic empire in 1000 years instead of the predicted 10,000.  

From Wiki:

Quote
The finale reveals that "Hummin" is actually Eto Demerzel. Seldon then gets Demerzel to admit he is a robot; Demerzel is in fact R. Daneel Olivaw, who can influence humans mentally. He wants the development of psychohistory to help him better protect humanity, as per "The Zeroth Law Of Robotics". Seldon also suspects Venabili of being a robot, as well.

Ah, I see AJ recalled more of the specifics than I did. As I recall, Daneel was also in works from thousands of years before, e.g. Robots of Dawn.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 14, 2020, 11:46:56 AM
It has been years since I read the Foundation books.  Those were details I forgot.  Thanks. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 14, 2020, 12:05:37 PM
Re Dune: if memory serves, the personal shields were of limited utility on Arrakis because the energy field attracted sandworms.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AJ Dual on September 14, 2020, 01:28:51 PM
Re Dune: if memory serves, the personal shields were of limited utility on Arrakis because the energy field attracted sandworms.


Yes, Herbert used the shields to keep ray-gun play at a minimum to get the neo-feudal feel he wanted in his book, and then he did away with shields by making their vibrations drive the worms crazy.

Personally, I think with all the high technology the Dune universe possessed even after the Butlarian anti-AI jihad the answer would be to just use ever larger guns that would knock a shield user ass-over-teakettle so hard that they'd die anyway even if the shield prevented penetration of the round.

So I imagine everyone running around with semi-automatic over-the-shoulder recoiless rifles.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 14, 2020, 01:30:44 PM


So I imagine everyone running around with semi-automatic over-the-shoulder recoiless rifles.

You mean all the time, or just when you think about Dune?
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on September 14, 2020, 01:41:02 PM
Yes, Herbert used the shields to keep ray-gun play at a minimum to get the neo-feudal feel he wanted in his book, and then he did away with shields by making their vibrations drive the worms crazy.

Personally, I think with all the high technology the Dune universe possessed even after the Butlarian anti-AI jihad the answer would be to just use ever larger guns that would knock a shield user ass-over-teakettle so hard that they'd die anyway even if the shield prevented penetration of the round.

So I imagine everyone running around with semi-automatic over-the-shoulder recoiless rifles.

Evidently if laser weapons were used against shields, it would set of an explosion on par with nuclear yield weapons.  IIRC, the Baron exploited this when attacking the Atreides on Arrakis to bring down their shields around the palace.  And the Baron did deploy artillery, too, which was an "ancient" concept to their perspective.  Seems military tech ran cyclical; as defenses cycled, offensive strategies would also change, requiring alternative defenses... but that things tended to return to once-outdated concepts.

And I believe that shields redirect kinetic energy of the offending mass away from the shield.  So a massive projectile wouldn't help. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 14, 2020, 01:45:33 PM
There was one point in the 80's movie that showed a gun being used.  Fired some sort of bullet or missile that went through the shield slow.  Never saw it used again in the movie.  You would think there would be clouds of those on the battlefield if they were useful.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on September 14, 2020, 02:50:47 PM
This thread is making me want to read Dune again for the umpteenth time . . .

I didn't notice the armor in the trailer.  I don't recall kinetic armor in the books. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 14, 2020, 03:34:27 PM
This thread is making me want to read Dune again for the umpteenth time . . .

I didn't notice the armor in the trailer.  I don't recall kinetic armor in the books. 
That isn't a bad idea.  I don't remember all the details either. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on September 14, 2020, 04:08:47 PM
This thread is making me want to read Dune again for the umpteenth time . . .

I didn't notice the armor in the trailer.  I don't recall kinetic armor in the books. 

Yeah, but now these guys are throwing Foundation in there too. It has been longer since I read the Foundation series than the Dune series. Hitting both is some serious reading time!  :laugh:

On Foundation the movie, frankly, while I liked the book, from what I remember, if a movie at all follows the book, the movie will be boring as hell. Foundation just seems to be a more gripping tale in the written word.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on September 14, 2020, 04:25:04 PM
Hate to admit this...

But I'm not sure that I've ever even heard of the Foundation series...
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 14, 2020, 04:53:53 PM
Yeah, but now these guys are throwing Foundation in there too. It has been longer since I read the Foundation series than the Dune series. Hitting both is some serious reading time!  :laugh:

On Foundation the movie, frankly, while I liked the book, from what I remember, if a movie at all follows the book, the movie will be boring as hell. Foundation just seems to be a more gripping tale in the written word.
I remember realized it was a bit different as it always involved the hero thinking their way out of the problem rather than fighting. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AJ Dual on September 15, 2020, 10:50:07 AM
There was one point in the 80's movie that showed a gun being used.  Fired some sort of bullet or missile that went through the shield slow.  Never saw it used again in the movie.  You would think there would be clouds of those on the battlefield if they were useful.

Yeah, the book makes mention of "Slow pellet stunners" that could go through a shield, however it's not clear how a pellet or dart moving slow enough to penetrate a shield wouldn't have excessive drop or be nearly useless as a "gun". And that limitation aside, the dart or pellet would have to be very heavy to make up for it's low velocity.

And considering a shield would fend off even a knife blow at fast human speed, that's really slow, like slower than throwing speed. Considering it's possible to see and dodge Airsoft BB's and paintballs in flight at round 290-300fps without Dune super-skill, it just doesn't seem like a really feasible thing.

Although in the Lynch film, I kind of pictured the projectile that killed Duncan Idaho as some kind of hunter seeker. (more handavium give or take on how suspensors interact with shields) Where the dart was very heavy, and the suspensors kept it flying level, at a velocity that could penetrate the shield and keep on pushing slowly.

If I were to armor up troops for the Dune universe, I'd fit the guns with bullets that were small disposable laser pointers. Since a laser touching a shield causes them both to explode. Just have the laser bullet distance armed and boom. Although the lasgun/shield explosion handwavium isn't clear if it's the power supply or just the act of being touched with the laser that explodes.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on September 15, 2020, 10:55:27 AM
"Yeah, the book makes mention of "Slow pellet stunners" that could go through a shield, however it's not clear how a pellet or dart moving slow enough to penetrate a shield wouldn't have excessive drop or be nearly useless as a "gun". And that limitation aside, the dart or pellet would have to be very heavy to make up for it's low velocity. "

My guess? They work sort of the same way as the hunter-seeker that's used to try to assassinate Paul.

"The device floated through the air, using a tiny Holtzman Field Generatorto maneuver. The tip held a camera that transmitted a video signal back to the operator. Vision was distorted by the compressed suspensor field. Once detected, the target was almost guaranteed to be killed. The killing device itself was a tiny needle, tipped with a quick-acting, lethal poison. The needle was retracted until a target is acquired, at which point it appeared, shortly before the device shot into the victim."


So, a dumb version of a hunter seeker with no drop and no need to be controlled by someone.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 15, 2020, 12:00:04 PM
The Dune novel mentioned physical armor very briefly.  Feyd Rautha was mentioned as wearing a partial coat of mail on two occasions.

Given that knives and swords are used extensively in the novel, physical armor would be a obvious supplement to energy shields. 

I am glad it looks like the movie is using this idea.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 15, 2020, 12:51:25 PM
He dropped the Baron's red hair which in the book helped connect Jessica to the Baron but I will admit this change among others does work better in a visible medium for the Harkonnens in general.

DUNE 2020 - Denis Villeneuve Explains New Harkonnen Appearance and Homeworld Changes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OU4JEFg4VuA

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 15, 2020, 01:02:03 PM
In the YT comments
Quote
Sanbro
1 day ago
Say what you want about the David Lynch movie, it's cast was outstanding. Real theatrical greats.
9

Vedla's House of Old TV Commercials
35 minutes ago
Indeed.  For me, the most memorable line was Jose Ferrer as Shaddam IV saying, "Bring in that floating fat man, the Baron!"

His voice did wonders with that line.  :rofl:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 15, 2020, 03:28:28 PM
"Yeah, the book makes mention of "Slow pellet stunners" that could go through a shield, however it's not clear how a pellet or dart moving slow enough to penetrate a shield wouldn't have excessive drop or be nearly useless as a "gun". And that limitation aside, the dart or pellet would have to be very heavy to make up for it's low velocity. "

My guess? They work sort of the same way as the hunter-seeker that's used to try to assassinate Paul.

"The device floated through the air, using a tiny Holtzman Field Generatorto maneuver. The tip held a camera that transmitted a video signal back to the operator. Vision was distorted by the compressed suspensor field. Once detected, the target was almost guaranteed to be killed. The killing device itself was a tiny needle, tipped with a quick-acting, lethal poison. The needle was retracted until a target is acquired, at which point it appeared, shortly before the device shot into the victim."


So, a dumb version of a hunter seeker with no drop and no need to be controlled by someone.
I imagine such a weapon would be easy to evade or defeat one on one, but in a battle melee, there might be hundreds sent toward your group and you wouldn't see them all.  I guess there would be armor to defeat that in a battle.  It depends heavily on the technology used.  Could the tip of the penetrator have an explosive to punch through once it passed the shield? 

If it was just blades, I would think advanced technology would allow a fine chain mail or tough fabric that prevented penetration of a blade.  A poison needle might be different.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on September 15, 2020, 03:58:41 PM
I believe it's the kind of advanced tech that can be designed after a couple doses of spice.  Before the folding space thing, but after the mentat mantra.

Also, in the Lynch move during the fall of house Atradies, both sides were mostly using projectile (or at particle beam) weapons, which leads me to believe the personal shields were expensive, and tended to be used on higher ranks and royalty, and the slow rounds to defeat them were likely also scarce.

The anti shield round seems to travel quickly (at least at normal "projectile speeds) until it encounters the shield, then it slows down and drills/powers through.  I always assumed that it was self powered (like the hunter/killer) and when it got to the person inside the shield it just continued it's slow advance under power, not needing mass or velocity to penetrate.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 15, 2020, 04:43:34 PM

Also, in the Lynch move during the fall of house Atradies, both sides were mostly using projectile (or at particle beam) weapons, which leads me to believe the personal shields were expensive, and tended to be used on higher ranks and royalty, and the slow rounds to defeat them were likely also scarce.


That was in complete contradiction to the novel.

Projectile weapons were rarely used (with the exception of artillery the Baron used to collapse caves).

Energy weapons existed, but were not used often, as the intersection of a lasgun beam and a shield created subatomic fusion with a wildly unpredictable effect.

The fremen used projectile weapons more than most others, due to the uselessness of body shields in the desert.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 15, 2020, 06:33:18 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NE_-0IdWioU
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 17, 2020, 07:49:15 AM
(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/dude.jpg)
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: makattak on September 17, 2020, 09:15:58 AM
(https://cdn.ricochet.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/dude.jpg)

 :rofl:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on October 07, 2020, 09:36:48 AM
Look like you'll have to wait another year.

Quote
Warner Bros. and Legendary Pictures have delayed the release of “Dune,” the big-budget sci-fi epic from director Denis Villeneuve. It will no longer premiere on Dec. 18 and is now slated to debut in theaters on Oct. 1, 2021.

A spokesperson for Warner Bros. declined to comment.
https://variety.com/2020/film/box-office/dune-release-date-delayed-2021-1234767105/
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on October 07, 2020, 09:40:41 AM
Look like you'll have to wait another year.
https://variety.com/2020/film/box-office/dune-release-date-delayed-2021-1234767105/

Bunch of horses asses.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on October 07, 2020, 09:49:08 AM
"Bunch of horses asses."

No, not really. This year has completely screwed everything, including the movie industry. Hell, Greyhound was pulled from theaters and then released to streaming. What REALLY sucked about that is that it was released on Apple streaming, which means that a ton of people who were really looking forward to seeing it... won't. I know I won't unless it's released from Apple, and I'm pretty sure that once something hits Apple it doesn't surface anywhere else.

But, once again, 2020 *expletive deleted*ing SUCKS!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on October 07, 2020, 10:47:27 AM
"Bunch of horses asses."

No, not really. This year has completely screwed everything, including the movie industry. Hell, Greyhound

Dammit. I had that on my list to watch on Netflix (or Netflix DVD) then somehow forgot about it. Now I see why it fell off my radar. I just saw that pushing the new Bond movie to next year has caused a bunch of theaters to shut down.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 04, 2020, 02:16:32 PM
News

Unless I overlooked it I didn't see a date

Warner Bros. to Debut Entire 2021 Film Slate, Including ‘Dune’ and ‘Matrix 4,’ Both on HBO Max and In Theaters
https://variety.com/2020/film/news/warner-bros-hbo-max-theaters-dune-matrix-4-1234845342/
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on December 04, 2020, 03:00:36 PM
I guess I'll finally have to motivate myself to get HBO Max now that I have AT&T service...


And the 75" 4K TV I've been contemplating.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 11, 2020, 12:30:46 PM
Why can nothing be simple? I couldn't care less about G vs KK

Quote
WarnerMedia's plan to debut 2021 Warner Bros. titles like The Suicide Squad simultaneously in theaters and on HBO Max has reportedly ruffled the feathers of production company Legendary Pictures.

According to Variety, Legendary Pictures is considering suing Warner Bros. over its plans to debut Godzilla vs. Kong and Dune on HBO Max. Both of these bid-budget projects were primarily financed by Legendary yet the production company was kept in the dark on WB's plans to release the films onto HBO Max. Providing additional frustration is that Warner Bros. reportedly prevented Legendary from selling Godzilla vs. Kong to HBO Max competitor Netflix months prior.

Warner Bros. May Face Lawsuit Over Godzilla vs. Kong, Dune HBO Max Release
Legendary Pictures is reportedly considering suing Warner Bros. over its plans to drop titles like Godzilla vs. Kong and Dune onto HBO Max.
https://www.cbr.com/warner-bros-lawsuit-godzilla-vs-kong-dune-hbo-max/
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on December 11, 2020, 01:03:38 PM
Why can nothing be simple? I couldn't care less about G vs KK

Warner Bros. May Face Lawsuit Over Godzilla vs. Kong, Dune HBO Max Release
Legendary Pictures is reportedly considering suing Warner Bros. over its plans to drop titles like Godzilla vs. Kong and Dune onto HBO Max.
https://www.cbr.com/warner-bros-lawsuit-godzilla-vs-kong-dune-hbo-max/
The last Godzilla movie was a pretty good big screen movie.  I would prefer to see it at a theater.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 11, 2020, 01:05:20 PM
I want Dune
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on June 28, 2021, 03:00:33 PM
Looks like the Dune release date has been pushed back from 10/1 to 10/22. Hopefully, that's the final date.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on July 21, 2021, 04:00:15 PM
Another trailer is being released on Friday. They're releasing it for free at IMax theatres in select cities today and tomorrow, I just heard about it today. If anyone is interested tickets and info are available at dunemovie.com.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on July 22, 2021, 10:02:45 AM
The humor seen in the trailer feels forced to me and was quite frankly a little jarring. Perhaps added to appeal to a wider audience than just the hard core Dune fans.

Dune | Official Main Trailer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8g18jFHCLXk
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on July 22, 2021, 10:21:53 AM
The humor seen in the trailer feels forced to me and was quite frankly a little jarring. Perhaps added to appeal to a wider audience than the hard core Dune fans.

Dune | Official Main Trailer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8g18jFHCLXk

To me, the humor seemed to show the camaraderie and affection between Gurney and the Atreides. Which fits with the book and is necessary for the plot.

I've started re-reading the original book for the millionth time. I'm really looking forward to this adaptation, even though there are discrepancies obvious even just from the trailers.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on July 22, 2021, 10:26:48 AM
I'm going to re-read the book before I see the movie.

I saw the original movie when it first came out (and hadn't read the book). It was a fun movie, but a lot of it I just didn't understand (although the glossary sheet they handed out at the movie helped)...

I read the book in something like 4 days. I was absolutely captivated by it.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on July 22, 2021, 10:30:04 AM
To me, the humor seemed to show the camaraderie and affection between Gurney and the Atreides. Which fits with the book and is necessary for the plot.


I think the way the trailer is edited had a lot to do the impression I got.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on July 22, 2021, 10:36:31 AM
I'm going to re-read the book before I see the movie.

That's a great idea. I rewatch the David Lynch movie quite a bit, and I guess am one of the few weirdos that likes it. I haven't read the book in probably 30 years though, and it would be good to reacquaint myself with the "baseline" before the new movie comes out.

What's the latest on it - will it be theaters only now, or are they still thinking about a streaming release?
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Angel Eyes on July 22, 2021, 10:59:22 AM
Not as cool as the one with the Pink Floyd soundtrack, but not bad.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on July 22, 2021, 11:16:43 AM
My first experience with the Dune book was a book on tape.  About a dozen cassettes.  Listened to most of it on a hung over Saturday.  I read the book later and picked up on a lot of the background information.  The book is great. 

I like the idea of re-reading it before the movie.  We will see.  Thinking of reading the Lord of the Rings first.  I haven't read that in a long time.  Working on Out of the Silent Planet right now.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on July 22, 2021, 11:28:31 AM
They picked that girl from Spiderman: Far from Home for the Fremen girl.  In this case, her looks fit. 

I like the armor they showed at the end of the trailer. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on July 22, 2021, 11:36:12 AM
Seeing it in a theater is mandatory in my book.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: makattak on July 22, 2021, 05:54:26 PM
My first experience with the Dune book was a book on tape.  About a dozen cassettes.  Listened to most of it on a hung over Saturday.  I read the book later and picked up on a lot of the background information.  The book is great. 

I like the idea of re-reading it before the movie.  We will see.  Thinking of reading the Lord of the Rings first.  I haven't read that in a long time.  Working on Out of the Silent Planet right now.

The Lewis Space Trilogy is very good. That Hideous Strength is a particularly frightening book. (Because he understands human nature so well.)

I may have to reread Dune. I loved the book and the David Lynch version as well. I'm sure I said it before (probably in this very thread) that the movie feels like they spent all their money making the first half of the movie and then had to finish the second half in 30 minutes or less.

This one looks like it could be good. I have very little faith that modern Hollywood will do it well, though, but every now and then they mess up and make something impressive.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on July 22, 2021, 06:39:41 PM
The Lewis Space Trilogy is very good. That Hideous Strength is a particularly frightening book. (Because he understands human nature so well.)

Shamefully, I only recently became aware of this trilogy right here on APS. I bought the full trilogy for my kindle. There are five books ahead of it in my kindle queue right now, but I look forward to reading it.

I need to reread that dang foundation series as well. It's been more like 40 years since I last read those. I think I may even still have the paperbacks from back then in a box somewhere around here. I think it will be good Wintertime reading.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on July 22, 2021, 10:22:27 PM
Shamefully, I only recently became aware of this trilogy right here on APS. I bought the full trilogy for my kindle. There are five books ahead of it in my kindle queue right now, but I look forward to reading it.

I need to reread that dang foundation series as well. It's been more like 40 years since I last read those. I think I may even still have the paperbacks from back then in a box somewhere around here. I think it will be good Wintertime reading.
I am not sure I want to re-read Foundation.  I will have to think about it.  I need to get Lord of the Rings on my Kindle.  The book I have was published for Tolkien's 100th birthday.  It has artwork from the artist that helped make the movies.  It isn't in bad shape, but not as tight as it was new.  I hate to drag it around everywhere while reading.

The Out of the Silent Planet series is one of several I bought on a classic spree I got on a couple years ago.  Animal Farm, Fahrenheit 451, Brace New World, Shakespeare, Edgar Allen Poe, War of the Worlds.  Can't think of any others I got.  Just figured I wanted a copy of them. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JTHunter on July 22, 2021, 10:55:36 PM
Dune - while I like the original movie, they tried to cover too many years and should have used someone younger than Kyle MacLachlan at the beginning.  I have (and have read) all the Dune books.  I have also read the Foundation books (and no desire to reread them at this time!).
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on July 24, 2021, 12:31:55 AM
"Dune" is one of my favorite novels.

"Dune Messiah" was "ok."

I just finished "Children of Dune" for the first time.

Horrible... Frank Herbert took pretentious dreck prose dial and turned it up to 11/10 for this novel... he took the few bad traits of "Dune" and magnified them to titanic size.

No human being talks or thinks anything like the people in the book.  Much of the dialogue is basically incomprehensible.

Beloved characters undergo horrific personality changes.  The plot is terrible.

The "transformation" at the end is incredibly stupid.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on July 24, 2021, 08:24:55 AM
"Dune" is one of my favorite novels.

"Dune Messiah" was "ok."

I just finished "Children of Dune" for the first time.

Horrible... Frank Herbert took pretentious dreck prose dial and turned it up to 11/10 for this novel... he took the few bad traits of "Dune" and magnified them to titanic size.

No human being talks or thinks anything like the people in the book.  Much of the dialogue is basically incomprehensible.

Beloved characters undergo horrific personality changes.  The plot is terrible.

The "transformation" at the end is incredibly stupid.

Now that you mention it, I think I might not have liked the following books myself. Perhaps reading them 30 years later I might have a different opinion, but I think I might not have even finished Children of Dune.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Perd Hapley on July 24, 2021, 11:21:36 AM
One thing I've read about Lewis's "scientifiction" is that he knew his descriptions of Mars and Venus were not consistent with what was known about them at the time. Not surprisingly, he was taking his cues from mythology. Lewis gonna Lewis.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on July 24, 2021, 11:51:56 AM
Now that you mention it, I think I might not have liked the following books myself. Perhaps reading them 30 years later I might have a different opinion, but I think I might not have even finished Children of Dune.
I was warned about the follow on books.  I listened to one or two of the prequel books, but didn't like them as much and gave up.  It is great stand alone book.  I can let my imagination work on what might have happened.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on July 24, 2021, 12:24:33 PM
I was warned about the follow on books.  I listened to one or two of the prequel books, but didn't like them as much and gave up.  It is great stand alone book.  I can let my imagination work on what might have happened.

Yeah, if I were you, I'd just quit after the first book.

I am on "God Emperor of Dune" now.  It is actually readable, but so far the plot is laughable. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: lee n. field on July 24, 2021, 05:29:29 PM
Yeah, if I were you, I'd just quit after the first book.

I am on "God Emperor of Dune" now.  It is actually readable, but so far the plot is laughable.

I always thought of it as "God Awful of Dune".  Herbert was going somewhere, but I wasn't interested enough to follow any further.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on July 24, 2021, 06:30:40 PM
I always thought of it as "God Awful of Dune".  Herbert was going somewhere, but I wasn't interested enough to follow any further.

"God Emperor of Dune" is absurd it deserves a David Lynch film.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JTHunter on July 24, 2021, 10:46:51 PM
deleted - late to the party  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: fifth_column on July 26, 2021, 10:51:13 AM
"Dune" is one of my favorite novels.

"Dune Messiah" was "ok."

I just finished "Children of Dune" for the first time.

Horrible... Frank Herbert took pretentious dreck prose dial and turned it up to 11/10 for this novel... he took the few bad traits of "Dune" and magnified them to titanic size.

No human being talks or thinks anything like the people in the book.  Much of the dialogue is basically incomprehensible.

Beloved characters undergo horrific personality changes.  The plot is terrible.

The "transformation" at the end is incredibly stupid.

I concur. I've read the first one many times. I read the second and third novels once when I was a teenager. I've never read any of the other dozen (or whatever) that were written by his son.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on July 28, 2021, 10:41:09 AM
FOUNDATION Trailer 2 (NEW 2021) Sci-Fi Series
https://youtu.be/ijml1syQ3_0

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 02, 2021, 08:56:18 AM
Looks like not only did they remove the Baron Harkonnen's red hair, which in the book helped connect him to Jessica but I can live with that, but they also did a race and gender swap of Liet Kynes in the name of wokeness to "modernize" the story. This fundamentally changes the character and how he was able to integrate in with the Freman. I can live with it I guess but not the reasons they give on why they felt the need to do it.

Reason for the DUNE 2021 Gender Swap Revealed!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKZ7i-1v5NE
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 02, 2021, 03:01:55 PM
So the guy is saying that a black woman is a more modern messenger.  That is just silly and shows he is politicizing the story to present day politics.  What other parts of the story did they mess with?  Telling the story is not their primary goal.

I just finished the book.  Chani (daughter of Liet Kynes) was on the trip with the men when Paul met her.  She had apparently proven herself and rode sand worms and all that.  She killed some men in duels later who had come to challenge Paul.  They made a point later in the book that a bunch of Imperial Troops attacked the home where Paul's son was killed and his sister was captured.  Only a handful of the troops managed to escape.  That was when the fighting age men were gone so it was all old men, women, and children fighting. 

My only criticism of the book reading it again is it seemed the ending was hurried.  He skipped over a whole bunch of stuff involving Paul training the Fremen, helping them develop rockets and artillery, helping them develop better tactics for attacking the Harkonens.  He then skipped over a lot of the final fighting.  Not a lot of mention of the Fremen gathering for the final battle, they were just there.  Was that needed?  I don't know.  Just thought a couple more chapters covering that stuff would have been nice.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 02, 2021, 03:47:38 PM
I also was annoyed at the director for turning Liet Kynes into a woman.

Kynes is also supposed to be the sibling of Stilgar.... yet Stilgar is white in the film, and the "new and improved" female Kynes is black.

On the positive side, they released a clip of Paul and Gurney practicing knife fighting... and it is excellent!

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2021/09/dune-clip-timothee-chalamet-josh-brolin

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on September 05, 2021, 10:51:08 AM
Hmm. Reviews don't seem to look good. Example:

https://www.indiewire.com/2021/09/dune-review-denis-villeneuve-1234660459/

Personally, I ignore "professional film critics" as they seem to hate almost everything I like. Still, it can't be good PR. I will agree with him that the film has been so over-hyped that anything other than "spectacular" will be viewed by many as a failure.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 05, 2021, 11:20:59 AM
Hmm. Reviews don't seem to look good. Example:

https://www.indiewire.com/2021/09/dune-review-denis-villeneuve-1234660459/

Personally, I ignore "professional film critics" as they seem to hate almost everything I like. Still, it can't be good PR. I will agree with him that the film has been so over-hyped that anything other than "spectacular" will be viewed by many as a failure.

Most "professional film critics" lack the ability to just sit back and enjoy the show and far too often get too hung up on one single aspect, real or imagined, of a movie.

This for example
"Villeneuve’s film sees this story through the eyes of the great family’s young heir, Paul (Timothée Chalamet), and embraces the boy’s awestruck confusion at moving to a desert world and learning that he was bred to be the white savior of its native people. "

My guess without seeing the movie for myself is that he went into it with that view of the main character already cemented in his mind and that view could have colored his opinion of the whole movie

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: bedlamite on September 05, 2021, 11:34:39 AM
Hmm. Reviews don't seem to look good. Example:

https://www.indiewire.com/2021/09/dune-review-denis-villeneuve-1234660459/

Personally, I ignore "professional film critics" as they seem to hate almost everything I like. Still, it can't be good PR. I will agree with him that the film has been so over-hyped that anything other than "spectacular" will be viewed by many as a failure.

Not everybody hates it:

https://twitter.com/ErikDavis/status/1433833732381741057
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 05, 2021, 11:37:53 AM
Some more

Dune Blows Away All Expectations! The Reviews are In!
https://youtu.be/dbc4JhierFA
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on September 05, 2021, 12:24:26 PM


This for example
"Villeneuve’s film sees this story through the eyes of the great family’s young heir, Paul (Timothée Chalamet), and embraces the boy’s awestruck confusion at moving to a desert world and learning that he was bred to be the white savior of its native people. "


*spoliers*

That's absurd because... 1) the fremen are Caucasians also and 2) he isn't bred to be the savior of the native people, they falsely believe he is the messiah because their religion has was cynically manipulated by outsiders and  2) Paul doesn't save the Fremen.

The central idea of the series is that heroes are disastrously for humanity, because people follow them (or their ideas about their hero) to destruction.

One of my favorite lines in the book is "No more terrible disaster could befall your people than for them to fall into the hands of Hero."

Setting this up is the purpose of the first book.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on September 05, 2021, 12:42:50 PM

That's absurd because... 1) the fremen are Caucasians also

I don't think that Earth ethnicity applies to an alien race on an alien planet.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on September 05, 2021, 12:48:41 PM
I don't think that Earth ethnicity applies to an alien race on an alien planet.

The Fremen aren't an alien race as they are the descendants of humans that arrived there thousands of years before the book. There are no alien races in Dune unless you count the genetically modified humans, ie The Spacing Guild (mutated by the spice in their case), as non-human.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on September 15, 2021, 10:25:04 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBBenVUVpEs
DUNE Extended Trailer - "Royal Houses"

Looking at this, the movie looks like it will be pretty good.  Aside from a couple of casting choices, it appears it is following the book pretty close.  We will see.  October 22 will come pretty quickly.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on October 07, 2021, 01:02:40 PM
Well this is pretty darned cool!

My friend Dave and I saw the original 1984 version of Dune in the theaters.

We were talking the other night while we were gaming and I told him he needs to grab a seat on a plane and come east so we can see this version of Dune on 22 October.

He checked into it, and he should be able to get a flight. His son has been hired on with American Airlines's Envoy Air subsidiary, so he gets to fly for free.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on October 07, 2021, 02:38:24 PM
The only thing about this is it is just the first half of the story.  I am sort of assuming they will end it where the Harkonens take Arrakis back and Paul and his mother find sanctuary with the Fremen.  It might be interesting to see where the first movie ends as that point is 2/3 to 3/4 of the book. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on October 07, 2021, 03:15:07 PM
The only thing about this is it is just the first half of the story. 

Well I did not know this was gonna be a two part movie. It makes sense for telling the story better, but the way Hollywood works these days, part two will be released around 2035 or so.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: bedlamite on October 07, 2021, 06:05:32 PM
The only thing about this is it is just the first half of the story.  I am sort of assuming they will end it where the Harkonens take Arrakis back and Paul and his mother find sanctuary with the Fremen.  It might be interesting to see where the first movie ends as that point is 2/3 to 3/4 of the book.

The last scene is Paul's knife fight with the Fremen, It fades to credits as they are carrying away the body.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on October 08, 2021, 07:57:28 AM
Well *expletive deleted*it. I had no idea it was a two parter, either.

That makes me a bit happier, though, because the one thing I realized when I finally read Dune a couple of years ago is just how much the first movie left out.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on October 08, 2021, 10:37:12 AM
Plus, the book lays out the story up to that point in pretty great detail with only a handful of things just mentioned in passing*.  From his joining the Fremen to the end, there are large gaps left which a 2nd movie could fill in if they are careful.

* I had forgotten that the Duke staged a raid on the Harkonnen home world and destroyed the excess spice they were holding back in reserve.  Something I picked up rereading the book recently.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on October 13, 2021, 10:10:19 PM
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/244690557_6491008010941856_6857120922189761219_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_rgb565=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=825194&_nc_ohc=X6TfU8A_AaUAX-KZcLo&tn=CSOFowsnxjfI_ihP&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=5d80d84783d8a3acb651da20b5bbcaaf&oe=618E973A)
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on October 22, 2021, 07:42:22 AM
It's D Day!

DUNE DAY!

My friend flew in from Iowa yesterday. He originally was going to get in around 2:30 my time, but when you fly standby you take what you can get, so he finally arrived at Reagan National at... 12:20 this morning.

Ugh.

After some confusion over which level he was to meet me at (there are 3 levels at Reagan, I was on the top level, he was on the middle level), we finally met up.

I got to bed around 2 a.m. Of course, I snapped awake at 6:30...

I'm going to need to take a nap or I'm going to sleep through the damned movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on October 22, 2021, 11:35:33 AM
I just watched it on HBO Max.  It is an amazing visual spectacle with good writing and acting to boot.  I am now putting an ornithopter on my Christmas list. I hope there is a part two.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on October 23, 2021, 08:22:19 AM
OH MY VARIOUS GODS! WHAT AN INCREDIBLE MOVIE!!!!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on October 23, 2021, 08:45:20 AM
I just watched it on HBO Max.  It is an amazing visual spectacle with good writing and acting to boot.  I am now putting an ornithopter on my Christmas list. I hope there is a part two.

Shoot. I thought it was only in theaters. I'm signing up for HBO for the month to watch it. Or maybe I should wait until I fish or cut bait on going to a 65" TV to get another 10" of screen space.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on October 23, 2021, 09:11:06 AM
Shoot. I thought it was only in theaters. I'm signing up for HBO for the month to watch it. Or maybe I should wait until I fish or cut bait on going to a 65" TV to get another 10" of screen space.

I watched it on the big TV, but I suspect that for this movie, it is best appreciated in a theater with surround sound.  I may very well go see it in the theater in a few weeks after the crowds go down.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on October 24, 2021, 08:00:40 AM
Shoot. I thought it was only in theaters. I'm signing up for HBO for the month to watch it. Or maybe I should wait until I fish or cut bait on going to a 65" TV to get another 10" of screen space.

Dress Steve up in a tu-tu and take him on a date night. Go into Boise and see the movie on the big screen the way God intended!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on October 26, 2021, 04:44:24 PM
I watched it on the big TV, but I suspect that for this movie, it is best appreciated in a theater with surround sound.  I may very well go see it in the theater in a few weeks after the crowds go down.

Saw it in a conventional theater last weekend.  It was a triumph.  I was left in awe of the visuals of what this world looked like.  In particular the spice harvesters, carry-alls, and ornithopters.  Adherence to the novel was very good.  Liet did not come across as woke.  A woman in that role doesn't really fit in the Dune universe, it is a very patriarchal feudal world.  But they basically de-feminized her.  Her interactions on screen were based on her role as Judge of the Change, or as the Liet for the Fremen.  Stretches credulity a little bit, but not jarring to this particular telling of the story.

Going to see it a second time with BIL in Imax soon.

I hope this film inspires Hollywood to make better movies.  It's the best thing to come from them since LotR.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on October 26, 2021, 08:03:49 PM
I enjoyed it.

I want to see how they do the Wyrding style fighting. I also like how they set him up for picking out Muad'dib as his name by having him notice the little mouse so many times. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on October 26, 2021, 08:09:26 PM
Part two given the greenlight: https://gizmodo.com/dune-part-2-is-official-will-be-here-october-2023-1847938646
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on October 29, 2021, 08:52:04 AM
This guy is a HUUUUGE Dune fan and he's impressed.
Check out his channel for a metric ton of Dune related videos.

Dune (2021) Review | Quinn's Ideas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7mKJzGKb1c
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on November 07, 2021, 09:24:30 AM
https://youtu.be/wCDIYvFmgW8
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: RoadKingLarry on November 07, 2021, 09:31:39 AM
https://youtu.be/wCDIYvFmgW8

Needs more cow bell.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: zahc on November 07, 2021, 09:45:11 AM
I watched it in the theater. It's been a while since I read the book. It was obviously marred by quota casting. That was the standout flaw. Second, the music and direction choices were a bit heavy handed and made me think I was watching blade runner 2049. Third, it had pacing issues and started to blur together in the second half. On the plus side they did stick to the book. Except for the character sex and race changes.

They also deleted "jihad" and all references to Baron Harkonnen's homosexuality.
Even half the book is too much for a single film. Too bad they couldn't do a miniseries like Mandalorian-length.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on November 07, 2021, 10:06:06 AM
Except for the character sex and race changes.

They also deleted "jihad" and all references to Baron Harkonnen's homosexuality.

I haven't seen it yet and am curious: Did they add any implied homosexuality to "good" characters? I'm wondering if they removed implications of the Baron being homosexual because they didn't want to tie homosexuality to "evil" characters.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 07, 2021, 10:13:07 AM
They also deleted "jihad" and all references to Baron Harkonnen's homosexuality.

The Baron wasn't homosexual but rather pansexual in the book IIRC.
His "curse" was put on him as punishment for brutality raping one of the Bene Gesserit sisters, Jessica's mother IIRC. She was there to be impregnated by him as part of the BG's plan anyway but he took it further.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on November 07, 2021, 08:15:40 PM
The Baron wasn't homosexual but rather pansexual in the book IIRC.
His "curse" was put on him as punishment for brutality raping one of the Bene Gesserit sisters, Jessica's mother IIRC. She was there to be impregnated by him as part of the BG's plan anyway but he took it further.

In the original novel, the Baron was apparently bisexual, but was primarily a homosexual pederast and rapist.  The stuff about the Baron raping a Bene Gesserit was an invention of the Brian Herbert "prequels" and had was not sourced from the Frank Herbert novels.

I haven't seen the new film, but I expect portraying an evil man as homosexual would be too politically incorrect.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 07, 2021, 08:18:47 PM
Been a long time since I read the book and much of my memory of it may have been tainted by later stuff
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 07, 2021, 08:29:57 PM
Yeah, doing a quick scan of some stuff on line that came from Brian Herbert's writings and not everyone considers his books canon.
Over the decades my memories of the books have blurred
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on November 07, 2021, 08:40:10 PM
I haven't seen it yet and am curious: Did they add any implied homosexuality to "good" characters? I'm wondering if they removed implications of the Baron being homosexual because they didn't want to tie homosexuality to "evil" characters.

Just re-watched it again today in theaters.

Baron's homosexuality and pedophilia are not present.  I expect we might see traces of it once Fayd is introduced in part 2.  Then again, maybe not.

I didn't detect any homosexuality anywhere in the screenplay.

One thing that I found intriguing on a re-watch was the Guild Highliners.  In the scene where the Bene Gesserit come to Caladan to test Paul, they come out of one end of the Highliner, in orbit over Caladan.  But if you look through the tube/maw of the Highliner, there's another planet in the background of the tunnel of the ship, that doesn't match up to the backdrop of space around Caladan.  I can only assume that in this portrayal, the Navigators use their Highliners as wormhole generators rather than as some sort of FTL capable carrier craft like traditional depictions have done.  Which then begs the question of how the Highliners are able to travel, since they don't stay on station permanently like some sort of Stargate.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on November 07, 2021, 08:51:43 PM
I need to watch the movie again, but I thought the Baron made some comment or look such that he regretted having to kill Paul.  My memory could be affected by the book and past movies, not sure. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 08, 2021, 07:43:11 AM
the cinematography of dune (2021)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEQJHZxwVrg
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on November 08, 2021, 08:04:50 AM
the cinematography of dune (2021)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEQJHZxwVrg

Thank God Alec Baldwin wasn't part of the movie or it might have looked a LOT different...
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 08, 2021, 08:16:30 AM
Thank God Alec Baldwin wasn't part of the movie or it might have looked a LOT different...

They would need a new cinematographer and maybe recast a few parts for the 2nd movie
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 08, 2021, 09:05:25 AM

One thing that I found intriguing on a re-watch was the Guild Highliners.  In the scene where the Bene Gesserit come to Caladan to test Paul, they come out of one end of the Highliner, in orbit over Caladan.  But if you look through the tube/maw of the Highliner, there's another planet in the background of the tunnel of the ship, that doesn't match up to the backdrop of space around Caladan.  I can only assume that in this portrayal, the Navigators use their Highliners as wormhole generators rather than as some sort of FTL capable carrier craft like traditional depictions have done.  Which then begs the question of how the Highliners are able to travel, since they don't stay on station permanently like some sort of Stargate.

Starts at 1:26

https://youtu.be/VEQJHZxwVrg?t=86

Which then begs the question of how the Highliners are able to travel, since they don't stay on station permanently like some sort of Stargate.

Maybe they do? ??
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 08, 2021, 10:13:41 AM
To answer a question that had popped up in my mind on whether or not Alia referred to the Baron as grandfather in the book.

Quote
Of all the uses of time-vision, this was the strangest. "I have breasted the future to place my words where only you can hear them," Alia had said. "Even you cannot do that, my brother. I find it an interesting play. And ... oh, yes—I've killed our grandfather, the demented old Baron. He had very little pain
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on November 08, 2021, 11:43:23 AM


Maybe they do? ??

If the Highliners/Gates are planet-bound and incapable of FTL travel themselves and only function as jump-gates for smaller craft, they couldn't exist in the year 10191.  This is a galaxy-spanning civilization.  Technically they call the Emperor the "Emperor of the known Universe."  Not even the galaxy, so it could be a trans-galactic civilization.

If Highliners are limited to sub-relativistic travel it would take tens of thousands of years for them to seed other stars with Highliners.  Once a ship arrived at a target system of course it makes travel near instantaneous between two systems with ships, as long as the traveling ships are smaller than the Highliner.  Perhaps a Highliner can be made to decrease its radius and fit through another one, then expand again once out, and they can leap-frog one another?

Although, a different idea has now struck me and now I'm trying to wrap my head around the notion of one Highliner simultaneously being in two places instead of two separate Highliners creating a wormhole bridge.  Perhaps when we saw with the Kaitain/Caladan scene with the Bene Gesserit ship, the ship was simultaneously in orbit around Kaitain and Caladan.  Then when it provides transport for the Atreides armada, it shifts its reality to be simultaneously at Caladan/Arrakis. 

I definitely think it's intentional though, that Villeneuve opted to make the Highliners look like sandworms.  I'm excited to see what the Navigators look like.  Though he strikes me as a filmmaker that appreciates unresolved mystery and he may leave that as a nugget for fans to gnaw on in their own minds.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 08, 2021, 12:05:34 PM
There is/was FTL travel without spice. How else would mankind have gotten to Arrakis in the first place? Spice enabled jumps are just much safer and quicker and is greatly preferred despite the huge price the guild charges for them.
I like the two places idea and it makes sense.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on November 08, 2021, 12:08:31 PM
In the original movie back in 1984 they described the guild navigators as being able to "fold" space as a mean of space travel across vast distances. All that was brought about by the ability of the navigators to use Spice to focus the powers of their mind.

To me that means that, because Spice is found ONLY on Arrakis, the empire had to start in or around the Arrakis system.


"Technically they call the Emperor the "Emperor of the known Universe."  Not even the galaxy, so it could be a trans-galactic civilization."

Could also be a massive amount of chutzpah. Hey, we've only traveled out to a radius of 100 light years, but our emperor? He's STILL the emperor of the known universe! Because we say so!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 08, 2021, 12:19:41 PM
In the original movie back in 1984 they described the guild navigators as being able to "fold" space as a mean of space travel across vast differences. All that was brought about by the ability of the navigators to use Spice to focus the powers of their mind.

To me that means that, because Spice is found ONLY on Arrakis, the empire had to start in or around the Arrakis system.


"Technically they call the Emperor the "Emperor of the known Universe."  Not even the galaxy, so it could be a trans-galactic civilization."

Could also be a massive amount of chutzpah. Hey, we've only traveled out to a radius of 100 light years, but our emperor? He's STILL the emperor of the known universe! Because we say so!

Kind of like calling The World Series THE WORLD Series
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on November 08, 2021, 04:45:31 PM
There is/was FTL travel without spice. How else would mankind have gotten to Arrakis in the first place? Spice enabled jumps are just much safer and quicker and is greatly preferred despite the huge price the guild charges for them.
I like the two places idea and it makes sense.

To my recollection, FTL travel was possible with computers thousands of years earlier, but they had their own Terminator/Matrix problems with AI and the Butlerian Jihad, so computers are now forbidden.  Spice is the mechanism by which Guild Navigators are able to perform the task manually.  It's supposed to be a type of prescience that allows them to see the mistakes they might make while flying a ship, before making them, allowing them to make only the right moves to accomplish a safe voyage.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 09, 2021, 10:25:38 AM
More

The Beauty That Is DUNE (2021)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTPOY4aQIxY
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: lee n. field on November 09, 2021, 10:56:31 AM
I don't think that Earth ethnicity applies to an alien race on an alien planet.

Nothing but humans in the Dune universe, AFAIK.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on November 09, 2021, 11:47:20 AM
To my recollection, FTL travel was possible with computers thousands of years earlier, but they had their own Terminator/Matrix problems with AI and the Butlerian Jihad, so computers are now forbidden.  Spice is the mechanism by which Guild Navigators are able to perform the task manually.  It's supposed to be a type of prescience that allows them to see the mistakes they might make while flying a ship, before making them, allowing them to make only the right moves to accomplish a safe voyage.
I got the impression it may not have been terminator/matrix problems, but nerd cookies has a video on it. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YnAs4NpRd8
The Nerd Cookies channel has a bunch of videos on Dune lore. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: freakazoid on November 11, 2021, 11:53:47 PM
Read the book once years ago, need to read it again. Also saw the first movie once years ago, and need to watch it again.
Saw the new movie a few days ago and thought it was really good. Didn't know it was a two parter. I wonder if his name will still be a killing word, which was something from the first movie and not actually from the book if I'm remembering correctly. For some reason that quote had stuck with me.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on November 12, 2021, 04:32:36 PM
I wonder if his name will still be a killing word, which was something from the first movie and not actually from the book if I'm remembering correctly. For some reason that quote had stuck with me.

Lynch left out something called the "Ma'dhi" (not sure on spelling), which is a fremen word for an anticipated prophet.  There's an implied parallel between the sound of "Muad'dib" and "Ma'dhi" despite the fact that Muad'dib is just the name of a little desert mouse species.  In each work so far the mouse is figured somehow... obviously the book has all three, the Lynch version leaves out the Ma'dhi but makes reference to Muad'dib via a string of shadowed craters on a moon of Arrakis, probably since neither CGI nor puppetry was sufficient to the task of bringing such a creature to life on screen in 1984, the SyFy version had Ma'dhi, the mouse and Muad'dib, and the 2021 version has Ma'dhi and the mouse but no reference to Paul as Muad'dib yet.

I think the intent behind "my name is a killing word" was to tie the apparent power of Muad'dib to the power of a Ma'dhi.  The sound weapons were invented out of whole cloth by Lynch, but are intended to represent the combination of the fremen discipline with the Wierding Way under leadership of a fanatic.

Something I'm frustrated that was not included yet in any telling of Dune on screen, is the cyclic nature of warfare technology.  In the constant struggle for the high ground they end up playing rock paper scissors through the ages.  Lasers were popular until body shields came along.  The act of a laser hitting a body shield is catastrophic to an entire battlefield and the resulting effect is like a nuclear explosion, so lasers fell out of favor for melee weapons that could penetrate the shields.  Projectile small arms could have limited effect on body shields, as well as artillery, but couldn't be wielded by parties protected by shields.  Which makes lasers appealing to use against artillery units, since they're unlikely to be shielded and even if they are shielded the explosion will result in taking out the entire artillery company and surrounding area, which generally doesn't have friendlies intermixed anyways.

At the point in the story where the Baron launches his sneak attack on the Duke, the Baron opts to introduce artillery to the battlefield again (in the book).

In the 2021 movie, we see the fremen using lasers on Harkonnen spice harvesters in the opening of the movie.  Because the desert makes shields useless.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 12, 2021, 04:40:27 PM

In the 2021 movie, we see the fremen using lasers on Harkonnen spice harvesters in the opening of the movie.  Because the desert makes shields useless.

I seem to recall something about shields also attracting worms and putting them into a frenzy.
And shields might make being swallowed by a worm even more unpleasant  [barf]
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 16, 2021, 07:26:09 PM

Paul understands  :rofl:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qhwLY2P_eQ
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 16, 2021, 09:56:38 PM
Another one  :rofl:

Dune - Someone is Far, Far Away From a Galaxy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4d3b6fVsCQ
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AJ Dual on November 17, 2021, 11:49:44 AM
I got the impression it may not have been terminator/matrix problems, but nerd cookies has a video on it. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YnAs4NpRd8
The Nerd Cookies channel has a bunch of videos on Dune lore.

In the original Frank Herbert books, the problems with robots/AI's were left kind of vague, and implied that humans with the tech enslaved or repressed everyone else.

In the later books by Herbert's son and other writers dealing directly with the Butlerian Jihad, there were first a group of Cyborgs "Titans" who took control of everything, then an evil AI named "Omnious" then co-opted the Cyborgs as slaves/generals and was running the show. A rather ham fisted allegory to Sauron and the kings he coopted as the Ring Wraiths.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 18, 2021, 11:05:29 AM
Was in Sam's and noticed they had Dune books where the cover art showed the characters as they are portrayed in the 2021 movie. It was very similar to some of the movie posters I have seen with one exception, no Liet-Kynes. I wonder if that is because the Liet-Kynes of the 2021 movie doesn't resemble  how Liet-Kynes is described in the book and they thought that would confuse some readers. How long before the SJWs notice and start raising a stink?
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on November 18, 2021, 12:17:09 PM
I've long disliked this tendency to clothe a paperback in imagery from a motion picture version of the story.  To the best of my knowledge it really started with LotR in the early 2000's, I don't recall it with any other books before that.

But now all the Darryl Sweet illustrations from the WoT books are going to be replaced with what I consider to be an unsatisfactory imagining of Jordan's Wheel of Time by Amazon, especially since Amazon is hell-bent on convincing the world that WoT is "the next Game of Thrones!11!eleventy1one!"
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on November 18, 2021, 12:20:06 PM
I've long disliked this tendency to clothe a paperback in imagery from a motion picture version of the story.  To the best of my knowledge it really started with LotR in the early 2000's, I don't recall it with any other books before that.


I seem to recall it being done with the 84 Dune as well.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on November 18, 2021, 12:56:27 PM
"I've long disliked this tendency to clothe a paperback in imagery from a motion picture version of the story.  To the best of my knowledge it really started with LotR in the early 2000's, I don't recall it with any other books before that."

Hell, I remember it happening regularly back well before that.

In 1993 The Stand (complete paperback edition) was printed with Gary Sinise and Molly Ringwald on the cover. They were in the TV miniseries adaptation.

Before that in the mid 1970s Carrie was reprinted with Sissy Spacek on the cover.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: cordex on November 19, 2021, 08:12:24 AM
My copy of True Grit has John Wayne on the cover.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: brimic on December 01, 2021, 06:46:23 PM
I got to see this version of Dune this last weekend and found it to be absolutely fantastic. I can’t wait until the 2nd part comes out.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on December 01, 2021, 06:57:33 PM
I have bought plenty of Scifi books that had covers that bore no relation to the book.  It doesn't bother me a great deal, but it does affect how you imagine the characters and landscape when you read the story for the first time. 

I was lucky with Lord of the Rings.  The book I read was a commemorative copy for what would be Tolkien's 100th birthday.  It has nice artwork distributed through the book (had all three books in one).  As it happens, that same artist consulted on the movie so the movie creatures looked very similar. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 02, 2021, 09:00:47 AM
I about fell off my chair, I wasn't expecting that*.  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Dune Thufir/Twiki Calculation scene
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pf1cTSa9kRQ


*Of course recognizing the sound effect helps  :rofl:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on December 02, 2021, 09:04:19 AM
I about fell off my chair, I wasn't expecting that*.  :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Dune Thufir/Twiki Calculation scene
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pf1cTSa9kRQ


*Of course recognizing the source of the sound effect helps  :rofl:

 :rofl:

That's definitely showing your (and my) age!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 02, 2021, 09:08:59 AM
Twiki wouldn't be allowed to exist in the Dune universe
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on December 02, 2021, 09:46:52 AM
There is/was a math competition in grade school that required all work to be done in your head.  No calculators, no notes.  Write the answer only.  There a number of techniques for doing more complicated math in your head.  I imagine remembering all the facts and figures for instant recall takes a lot more mental discipline.  I wasn't sure in Dune if they had no computers or just no AI/robots.  With no computers, there would likely be a lot of people around doing that sort of mental work with the mentats being at a level above everyone else.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 02, 2021, 09:50:52 AM
There is/was a math competition in grade school that required all work to be done in your head.  No calculators, no notes.  Write the answer only.  There a number of techniques for doing more complicated math in your head.  I imagine remembering all the facts and figures for instant recall takes a lot more mental discipline.  I wasn't sure in Dune if they had no computers or just no AI/robots.  With no computers, there would likely be a lot of people around doing that sort of mental work with the mentats being at a level above everyone else.

Kids nowadays look at you like you have some sort of bizarre superpower if you can figure out taxes and/or tips in your head in front of them.

biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi

Tip $4.25
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 02, 2021, 10:21:41 AM
Darn it, miss the opportunely for a joke

That should have been

biddi-biddi-biddi, biddi-biddi-biddi, biddi-biddi-biddi, biddi-biddi-biddi
4 Bucks 25
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on December 02, 2021, 10:26:02 AM
Darn it, miss the opportunely for a joke

That should have been

biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi
4 Bucks 25


Your math is off...

Its tree fiddy!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on December 02, 2021, 02:09:14 PM
Kids nowadays look at you like you have some sort of bizarre superpower if you can figure out taxes and/or tips in your head in front of them.

biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi biddi-biddi-biddi

Tip $4.25
There have always been people who looked at math that way.  At least they were there when I was still in school. 

I had an engineering physics class at junior college with a retired guy who taught it.  He could look at a huge equation on the board and do it all in his head.  He would round up a lot and do it piece by piece, but he would always be within 10% of the answer.  He figured that was close enough for discussion purposes. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on December 17, 2021, 09:16:48 AM
Reading Villeneuve may be doing Rendezvous With Rama
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on December 17, 2021, 09:19:50 AM
That could be fun!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: RocketMan on December 17, 2021, 09:21:01 AM
Reading Villeneuve may be doing Rendezvous With Rama

Just saw that moments ago.  Interesting, for sure.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Brad Johnson on March 28, 2022, 09:23:47 AM
Finally saw it this weekend. Damn! Really, really looking forward to the next installment.

Brad
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 28, 2022, 09:25:29 AM
Unless you saw it in a theater, you didn't really see it.

Dune is one of those movies that MUST be seen on the big screen.


On a positive note, it won 6 Oscars yesterday. All technical category, but still.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on March 28, 2022, 09:26:39 AM
Finally saw it this weekend. Damn! Really, really looking forward to the next installment.

Brad

Yeah, after I watched it I was thinking that I should have held off watching it until part 2 was ready to drop. I hate the waiting.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Brad Johnson on March 28, 2022, 09:32:57 AM
Unless you saw it in a theater, you didn't really see it.

Dune is one of those movies that MUST be seen on the big screen.

On a positive note, it won 6 Oscars yesterday. All technical category, but still.

65" screen at 8' viewing distance has the same effective field of view as sitting in most movie theaters. Sound setup is Dolby DTS:X capable and driving two fifteen inch subs. Trust me, not only did I get the full movie experience, I probably had the neighbors experiencing it, too.

Brad
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 28, 2022, 09:34:44 AM
If your feet weren't sticking to the floor because the jackwad in back of you spilled his big chug Pepsi, then you did NOT see it.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 28, 2022, 09:35:56 AM
If your feet weren't sticking to the floor because the jackwad in back of you spilled his big chug Pepsi, then you did NOT see it.

Or if you not getting bedbugs from the seat.....     [barf]
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Brad Johnson on March 28, 2022, 09:39:15 AM
If your feet weren't sticking to the floor because the jackwad in back of you spilled his big chug Pepsi, then you did NOT see it.

Well, yeah, there's that.

I was in my old ratty house shirt & day-old gym shorts and may have dropped some sammich crumbs on the floor. Does that count?

Brad
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 28, 2022, 10:37:32 AM
Back to I have to see this mode
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 28, 2022, 10:42:01 AM
$9.99 on Amazon Prime.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 30, 2022, 01:56:11 PM
Scrolling around HBO last night and I saw that Dune (1984) version is playing!

So I port over and... someone screwed up!

It's the 2021 version being billed as the 1984 version.

About damned time that it gets to HBO (as opposed to HBO Max)!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on March 30, 2022, 03:46:05 PM
Scrolling around HBO last night and I saw that Dune (1984) version is playing!

So I port over and... someone screwed up!

It's the 2021 version being billed as the 1984 version.


(https://78.media.tumblr.com/0b450e65ed550e8cabafddd271332e62/tumblr_mvjwwbl9mE1sykpjyo5_400.gif)

What a horrible movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on April 01, 2022, 07:19:22 PM
Just finished watching it on TV. I recorded it from HBO a few days ago.

Even on my small screen it's an incredible movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on April 04, 2022, 09:15:43 AM
(https://78.media.tumblr.com/0b450e65ed550e8cabafddd271332e62/tumblr_mvjwwbl9mE1sykpjyo5_400.gif)

What a horrible movie.


Wait... what?

Which one? The 2021 version or the 1984 version?

The 1984 version certainly wasn't a great movie, but it had its charms and Lynch actually made a pretty good movie given the constraints of fitting a 9 million page book into a 2 hour movie.


Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on April 04, 2022, 10:30:06 AM

Wait... what?

Which one? The 2021 version or the 1984 version?

The 1984 version certainly wasn't a great movie, but it had its charms and Lynch actually made a pretty good movie given the constraints of fitting a 9 million page book into a 2 hour movie.

The 1984 version you saw must have been a totally different 1984 version than the one I saw.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Angel Eyes on April 04, 2022, 11:47:08 AM
The 1984 movie was a decent highlight reel, but far too campy for my taste.  It did have memorable visuals.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 04, 2022, 11:51:36 AM
The 1984 movie was a decent highlight reel, but far too campy for my taste.  It did have memorable visuals.


Yeah, it was straight up 80's sci-fi cheese. Schlocky, but fun enough to enjoy with a couple beers.

It was no Ice Pirates, though...  =D

Brad
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on April 04, 2022, 11:57:38 AM
"but far too campy for my taste. "

Yes, it was very campy, which is part of its overall fun.

It's the big hair movie of 1980s sci fi movies.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: bedlamite on April 04, 2022, 07:22:49 PM
It was no Ice Pirates, though...  =D


Laugh-a while you can, monkey-boy
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on April 05, 2022, 12:42:44 PM
The 1984 movie was a decent highlight reel, but far too campy for my taste.  It did have memorable visuals.
I thought I was hallucinating when I first saw this scene.
(https://i.imgur.com/3RjG7Lf.gif)

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on April 05, 2022, 01:24:31 PM
THERE ARE FOUR SLOW STUNNER PELLETS!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on April 06, 2022, 07:26:06 AM
To answer a question that had popped up in my mind on whether or not Alia referred to the Baron as grandfather in the book.


In the new movie, the Baron refers to the Duke as "cousin."

I knew in the book that there had been some indications that the Harkonens and Atreides houses were related by blood.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on April 19, 2022, 09:20:10 AM
The Riout 102T Alérion Ornithopter; Frank Herbert’s Inspiration?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pj5r9kgni78
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on April 22, 2022, 03:45:52 PM
Dune 2021's "Sand Screen" Method VFX Breakdown
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5H8Nfl-pGw
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on May 13, 2022, 01:09:54 PM
Not sure how I feel about this especially with José Ferrer still stuck in my mind as the Emperor


Christopher Walken set to spice up Dune: Part Two
The veteran actor will portray Emperor Shaddam IV in Denis Villeneuve's sequel
https://www.avclub.com/christopher-walken-dune-part-two-the-emperor-1848918982?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=dlvrit&utm_content=avclub
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on May 13, 2022, 02:41:04 PM
Walken:  "I gotta have more cowbell spice!"
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on May 13, 2022, 04:56:57 PM
Actually, I think Walken would have made a GREAT Baron Harkonnen...
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on May 13, 2022, 05:09:30 PM
Actually, I think Walken would have made a GREAT Baron Harkonnen...

Well, he's not a floating fat man, but he does float, and he walks without rhythm, so doesn't attract worms, so he should be in the movie.

https://youtu.be/wCDIYvFmgW8
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on May 26, 2022, 08:49:17 AM
 Timothee Chalamet replaced by Elmo in Dune
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHK5fBm1YWk
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on August 19, 2022, 09:41:17 AM
HBO is running Dune again.

I watched it for the 5th time.

It's still *expletive deleted*ing awesome!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on August 19, 2022, 10:23:35 AM
It is an excellent movie!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on August 19, 2022, 10:32:03 AM
Timothee Chalamet replaced by Elmo in Dune
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHK5fBm1YWk

I didn't see that before.... that is some funny *expletive deleted*it!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on August 19, 2022, 10:46:49 AM
There were only a few choices about that movie that I think could have been done better.

The movie removed Piter de Vries personality... which was very vivid in the book.  I think that was kind of a missed opportunity.  They did also drastically alter the personality of the Baron, but I have no complaints, as he was very well done.  His portrayal was actually scarier than the book.

The movie also did not include the scene of Dr. Yueh talking with Lady Jessica about Yueh's wife. This would have made the plot more make more sense.  It is my understanding the scene was filmed, but removed.  I don't know why.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on August 19, 2022, 02:27:32 PM
"The movie removed Piter de Vries personality..."

That's one of my biggest gripes about this movie...

Compared to the book or the 1980s movie, this version almost completely obliterates the rational for WHY Spice Melange was so important to the empire.

The abilities of the mentats? Completely erased.

WHY the mentats existed? Completely erased.

The explanation of how Spice permitted expansion of the empire? Watered down to about a quarter section left-handed coughed reference that really didn't make contextual sense.

It was all -- Well, Spice is important, because it's a psychoactive drug. Hell, it's almost as if Arrakis is the far future Colombia, Spice is nothing more than cocaine, and the Harkonnens? Pablo Escobar's boys of the future.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: bedlamite on August 19, 2022, 07:34:45 PM
Part 1 could have bee 4-5 hours and it would have been better. I'm thinking they should have made this at least a trilogy.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on August 19, 2022, 08:04:16 PM
The Director plans a trilogy, with Dune Messiah being the third movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on May 03, 2023, 12:43:35 PM
 DUNE 2 Trailer (2023)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzJRhpKjio8
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on May 03, 2023, 12:53:05 PM
OHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGODOHGOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on May 03, 2023, 01:27:35 PM
Hurry up, November!
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on May 03, 2023, 01:43:42 PM
Nice trailer!

I was glad to see the gladiatorial combat scene... that is my favorite one in the book.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: BobR on May 03, 2023, 01:48:18 PM
Oops, wrong thread
bob
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on May 03, 2023, 01:51:48 PM
Oops, wrong thread
bob

I was just coming back to ask what is the price of a 2x4 on Dune?
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: BobR on May 03, 2023, 02:04:29 PM
I was just coming back to ask what is the price of a 2x4 on Dune?

I am thinking that with the lack of suitable forestation on the planet all lumber would have to be imported from off planet. To have wood would be a symbol of wealth, in fact the ultra-wealthy. With that is mind and knowing the value of melange you could probably get enough lumber for a house for half a gram or so of spice. Maybe ;)

bob
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on May 03, 2023, 02:50:33 PM
I recall in the book the Fremen were trying to grow green plants near the poles and were bribing the spacing guild to keep quiet about it and keep satellites out of the sky.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on July 02, 2023, 03:44:45 PM
New longer trailer

DUNE PART TWO Official Trailer 2 | 4K
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUiz5dRdMdk
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on July 02, 2023, 05:13:40 PM
Looking good so far. 

November 3rd.  Still a ways off.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on July 07, 2023, 03:57:09 PM
New longer trailer

DUNE PART TWO Official Trailer 2 | 4K
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUiz5dRdMdk

OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on July 07, 2023, 04:45:23 PM
Disney/Marvel/Lucasfilm: "People have no interest in classic sci fi or super hero movies."

Dennis Villeneuve with Dune and Zack Snyder with Rebel Moon:  "I'd like to thank the Academy..."
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on July 07, 2023, 04:49:23 PM
Disney/Marvel/Lucasfilm: "People have no interest in classic sci fi or super hero movies."

Dennis Villeneuve with Dune and Zack Snyder with Rebel Moon:  "I'd like to thank the Academy..."

Only if they meet the new diversity requirements.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on July 07, 2023, 05:29:41 PM
"super hero movies."

INTRODUCING THE 77TH INSTALLMENT OF THE MARVEL/DC/NAMCO/WHO GIVES A *expletive deleted*ck UNIVERSE THIS MONTH!

AND WE PROMISE THAT THIS ONE IS ONLY HALF AS CRAPPY AS THE PREVIOUS 34!



Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on July 07, 2023, 05:30:35 PM
"super hero movies."

INTRODUCING THE 77TH INSTALLMENT OF THE MARVEL/DC/NAMCO/WHO GIVES A *expletive deleted*ck UNIVERSE THIS MONTH!

AND WE PROMISE THAT THIS ONE IS ONLY HALF AS CRAPPY AS THE PREVIOUS 34!

And twice as woke
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on August 18, 2023, 10:04:23 AM
Goddamn it!

Article on CNBC saying that the writer's and actor's strike could delay the release of Dune II later this year.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/17/will-dune-part-two-move-to-2024-hollywood-strikes.html
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JTHunter on August 18, 2023, 02:34:18 PM
There are 2 "complaints" I had about the '84 version.  They tried to cover too much time in one film and that leads to the second problem.  They should have used a younger actor than McLachlan at the beginning of the movie.  He should not have appeared until after they had been ousted by the Harkonens and been fighting in the desert for a couple of years.
Other than that, the '84 battles were better, more visible and not as dark and hard to see as this newer version.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on August 18, 2023, 03:11:53 PM
I am hoping they better cover the battles to destroy the spice mining and take over the planet.  Even the book sort of glossed over that and kept everything in close to Paul.  One chapter they are still fighting and then it skips and they have the Harkonnens hemmed in around the capitol. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on August 25, 2023, 09:33:26 AM
Goddamn it, it's official...

Dune part II has been pushed back to March 2024.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/24/dune-part-two-departs-2023-movie-calendar-amid-hollywood-strikes.html


 :mad: :mad: :mad:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on August 25, 2023, 10:02:33 AM
Bummer. I just read that "Dune will likely not be affected". Bastards.

Millionaires gotta fight for better wages though, yo.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on August 25, 2023, 10:03:52 AM
Meanwhile except for rare exceptions like the above (Dune) 99% of people couldn't give a *expletive deleted*it about a Hollywood strike.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on August 25, 2023, 10:06:39 AM
Yeah, because everyone in the movie industry is a multi-millionaire.

Don't fall into that trap, dude.

Its just like falling into the trap of believing EVERY corporate CEO of EVERY company, earns multi thousands of times more money that their employees.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on August 25, 2023, 10:08:06 AM
Meanwhile except for rare exceptions like the above 99% of people couldn't give a *expletive deleted*it about a Hollywood strike.

I should start another thread, but I recently really, really streamlined my streaming subscriptions. I wasn't watching a ton of TV before, but have really cut it way back with a tactical cancel/resubscribe and "suspend" policy on my services. I'm saving $100/mo and still watching the stuff I want to watch, if delayed a bit.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on August 25, 2023, 03:58:34 PM
I am doing the same.  However, I just signed back up for YoutubeTV in preparation for college football starting. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on August 25, 2023, 04:02:56 PM
I just suspended Netflix.  Now the only streaming service I have that isn't bundled free with something else I use is HBO (not getting renewed when the year is up, and youtube premium for no commercials.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on August 25, 2023, 04:05:50 PM
Used to be there was 3-4 movies every year I wanted to go see. Now it's something like 1 every 3-4 years.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on August 25, 2023, 04:06:01 PM
Yeah, because everyone in the movie industry is a multi-millionaire.

Don't fall into that trap, dude.

Its just like falling into the trap of believing EVERY corporate CEO of EVERY company, earns multi thousands of times more money that their employees.
I agree.  Most of the actors, writers, and other crew people are middle class and keep other jobs. 

It sucks that there are so many idiots that make the whole industry look bad.  (far too many of them don't just "look" bad)
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on August 25, 2023, 04:12:00 PM
I agree.  Most of the actors, writers, and other crew people are middle class and keep other jobs. 

It sucks that there are so many idiots that make the whole industry look bad.  (far too many of them don't just "look" bad)

Kathleen Kennedy for one who has destroyed every thing she's touched and yet she's still there.
I think it was in one of the Critical Drinker discussions someone mentioned she has a no fire clause in her contract. Now how the heck does someone get that put in unless they've got something on the big shots in company but it would explain why she wasn't fired a long time ago.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on August 25, 2023, 04:25:12 PM
I just suspended Netflix.  Now the only streaming service I have that isn't bundled free with something else I use is HBO (not getting renewed when the year is up, and youtube premium for no commercials.

Do you mean canceled and will resubscribe, or actually suspended? I looked for a "suspend" function there and couldn't find one.

Hulu and Youtube TV made it really easy to suspend, and as much as I complain about Amazon, they make it super easy to cancel and resubscribe to all the streaming services they host. I was actually going to cancel the HBOMax I have through Amazon, but when I started, they offered me some ridiculous 75% off for three months deal to not kill it. So I'm on that for another month, then will kill it.  =D
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on August 25, 2023, 04:43:02 PM
Cancel and resubscribe.  They say as long as I pay at least 1 month every 14, all my history will be saved.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on August 25, 2023, 05:53:19 PM
They say as long as I pay at least 1 month every 14, all my history will be saved.

Oh, cool. I think I might do that as well. Paying for it 3 months out of the year will be more than enough to watch/catch up on anything of interest. Which, there hasn't been much for me with anything new they put out, and I'm sick of watching Arrested Development and Seinfeld reruns.

My Hulu restarts Monday, and the final episode of Justified City Primeval airs Tuesday, so I'll keep Hulu for a month to watch that, and then suspend it for another three or whatever their max is.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on August 25, 2023, 06:43:59 PM
Why I don't care, most movies/shows nowadays have extremely lazy writing. I was hoping this show would be different but nope.

No, Ahsoka Won't Save Star Wars
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=briM3doNrXA
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on August 25, 2023, 08:20:43 PM
Critical Drinker is being unnecessarily harsh, because that's his schtick.  Ashoka isn't OG Justified  or Season 1 of GoT, but it's a good show that is so far fun to watch.

Rosario is doing a good job portraying a character that has been fighting wars since literally puberty and seen everything she cared about destroyed,  and the Rebellion failing to live up to it's promise in real time.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on August 25, 2023, 09:05:07 PM
Critical Drinker is being unnecessarily harsh, because that's his schtick.  Ashoka isn't OG Justified  or Season 1 of GoT, but it's a good show that is so far fun to watch.

Rosario is doing a good job portraying a character that has been fighting wars since literally puberty and seen everything she cared about destroyed,  and the Rebellion failing to live up to it's promise in real time.

Over time I've learn to tell when he exaggerating for effect but there are times even he can't.
Everything he goes on here fit the pattern of Kennedy era Star Wars, lazy writing, bland characters, Mary Sues.
As Rosario goes, I like the actress and the character of Ashoka and feel both deserve better.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Angel Eyes on August 26, 2023, 12:51:28 PM
Critical Drinker is being unnecessarily harsh, because that's his schtick.  Ashoka isn't OG Justified  or Season 1 of GoT, but it's a good show that is so far fun to watch.

Rosario is doing a good job portraying a character that has been fighting wars since literally puberty and seen everything she cared about destroyed,  and the Rebellion failing to live up to it's promise in real time.


I disagree.

The first two episodes of Ahsoka have been marred by a plodding pace, wooden acting, and plot twists that don't make sense (the captain allowing the Sith wannabes to board his ship, for example).   

There was a particularly cringeworthy moment when Hera did her "I'm a general so I can do what I want" bit at the shipyard, which reminded me of Holdo from The Last Jedi.  The strong-female-character-humiliates-male-character trope has been a staple of most everything KK has touched, including the latest Indiana Jones flick, and it is tiresome.

Sabine Wren is a quite different, and less interesting, version of what she was in Rebels, and has become too Mary Sue-ish.  (speaking of Rebels, the show seems to assume that the audience has already seen that series, which IMO is a mistake.  The story should be more self-contained.)

So far, Ahsoka isn't as bad as Boba Fett, Kenobi, or season 3 of The Mandalorian, but it could have been a lot better.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 16, 2024, 04:18:46 PM
Man Just Hopes Western Civilization Holds Out A Few More Weeks So He Can See ‘Dune: Part Two’
https://babylonbee.com/news/man-just-hopes-western-civilization-holds-out-a-few-more-weeks-so-he-can-see-dune-part-2
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on February 17, 2024, 11:36:08 AM
Critical Drinker is being unnecessarily harsh, because that's his schtick.  Ashoka isn't OG Justified  or Season 1 of GoT, but it's a good show that is so far fun to watch.

Rosario is doing a good job portraying a character that has been fighting wars since literally puberty and seen everything she cared about destroyed,  and the Rebellion failing to live up to it's promise in real time.
Critical Drinker and others normally watch the shows multiple times to get all their notes and clips on the shows.  If a show is even a little bad, I imagine that makes it easy to nitpick and pull out every little negative point.  A show with an engaging story will carry you along and you either won't notice the flaws or can more easily ignore them.  I think that is a big reason why most reviews are either really positive or really bad.   

I might also add that he pays more attention to story structure and character development and I often don't notice those things on a single viewing.

Then there is the fact that this is Star Wars and there is an expectation that the shows be a cut above.  Disney doesn't appear to be reaching that level or really even demanding that quality.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 29, 2024, 08:17:32 AM
Speaking of Critical Drinker he's seen it and he's happy with only some very minor, and I mean very minor, nitpicking

 Dune Part Two - The Movie We All Needed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOtTsNnDnI8&t=308s
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on February 29, 2024, 08:42:42 AM
I can't freaking wait to see it.

My friend Dave is going to come in from Texas to see it with me.

We saw the original together in 1984, and we saw part 1 together in 2022.

But, I told him it's going to have to wait a week or two until I'm A) damned sure that Seren's not going to be sick as a human from the last round of chemo (so far so good), and B) until I can get the house whipped into shape a bit because it's such a disaster (also proceeding. Slowly, but getting better.)
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on February 29, 2024, 08:55:18 AM
I am bouncing back and forth between really wanting to see it, and really not wanting to set foot in a movie theater.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on February 29, 2024, 09:03:09 AM
I am bouncing back and forth between really wanting to see it, and really not wanting to set foot in a movie theater.

Ha! That's where I am, but likely won't set foot in the theater. This will be one of the few movies though, where I'll pay the Amazon "early rental fee" of $20 to watch it before it's released on DVD and streaming.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on February 29, 2024, 09:09:50 AM
I'm looking forwards to seeing it on DVD.  I really liked the first one; the early reviews are saying this going to be better.

Hopefully it will shut up the "white savior trope" complaining.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 29, 2024, 09:27:02 AM
Hopefully it will shut up the "white savior trope" complaining.

I wouldn't be holding my breath on that.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 29, 2024, 09:30:08 AM
I am bouncing back and forth between really wanting to see it, and really not wanting to set foot in a movie theater.


Ha! That's where I am, but likely won't set foot in the theater. This will be one of the few movies though, where I'll pay the Amazon "early rental fee" of $20 to watch it before it's released on DVD and streaming.

Swore off theaters a long time ago for a whole host of reasons

I don't like crowds
There's always some jackass or jackasses, often in packs nowadays, there to spoil the experience.
Kids directly in my line of sight texting through 90% of the movie with their screens on max brightness.
Grossly overpriced snacks.
My viewing area and seats at home doesn't smell like a hobo camp in august.
My shots don't have to up to date at home.
Bed bugs and who knows what else wanting to hitch a ride home.
At home I can pause the movie and/or go back and review a scene a 2nd time if need be if I missed something
Sitting through 30 minutes of loud previews of movies never in a million years I will want to see

Now that said this has almost made me want to put all that aside and go to one for this
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on February 29, 2024, 09:34:22 AM
Swore off theaters a long time ago for a whole host of reasons

I don't like crowds
There's always some jackass or jackasses, often in packs nowadays, there to spoil the experience.
Kids directly in my line of sight texting through 90% of the movie with their screens on max brightness.
Grossly overpriced snacks.
My viewing area and seats at home doesn't smell like a hobo camp in august.
My shots don't have to up to date at home.
Bed bugs and who knows what else wanting to hitch a ride home.
At home I can pause the movie and/or go back and review a scene a 2nd time if need be if I missed something
Sitting through 30 minutes of loud previews of movies never in a million years I will want to see

Now that said this has almost made me want to put all that aside and go to one for this

All similar reasons to mine. I used to consider it weighing loss of movie quality over the gain of eliminating all the other theater stuff. Now though, with the current 75" TV and sound system, ATMOS, etc., I don't really believe I'm losing any quality worth putting up with the movie theater negatives.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on February 29, 2024, 09:51:47 AM
There aren't many movies I want to see that I feel MUST be seen in the theater.

Blade Runner 2049, Dune I and now Dune II DEMAND to be seen in the theater.

Most movies I'm happy to wait until they come out on Max or Showtime or Hulu streaming.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on February 29, 2024, 10:00:56 AM
All the reviews I have seen so far recommend seeing it on the big screen.  They meant IMAX, but I don't have one of those very close.  Most everyone thought it was a really good movie.  They wanted to get into nitpicks about the books and stuff, but can't without spoilers.  I don't expect this movie to be 100% faithful to the book.  As long as it is a good movie, I think that is all I can expect.  I heard the gear porn with the ships and vehicles was pretty good. 

I want to see it tonight as I know youtubers I watch will eventually spoil it and I would rather not have that happen.  I think I will check how full the seating appears to be for the early showings this afternoon after I get off work.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 29, 2024, 10:06:02 AM
I want to see it tonight as I know youtubers I watch will eventually spoil it and I would rather not have that happen.  I think I will check how full the seating appears to be for the early showings this afternoon after I get off work.

If you've read the book and/or seen the 84 version (yeah I know) and/or the Syfi version I don't think watching YT videos is going to spoil it for you all that much.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Brad Johnson on February 29, 2024, 10:12:42 AM
Now though, with the current 75" TV and sound system, ATMOS, etc., I don't really believe I'm losing any quality worth putting up with the movie theater negatives.

This plus everything WLJ said.

I've tweaked my system and viewing space to a point I'd put the experience up against pretty much any theater environment short of domed IMAX. Seats are comfy, I can control the thermostat and wear whatever I want, snacks are bottomless, and the beer is actually cold.

Brad
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on February 29, 2024, 10:21:47 AM
+1 on Brad, Ben, and WLJ's comments, I'm in the same spot. 

Non  IMAX theaters are nasty and annoying enough that the experience, even with their bigger screen and more watts is not actually better than my TV and Atmos at home.  SO while part of me wants to go catch this in IMAX, because I love the franchise and think this series is doing it justice, the larger part of me just wants to watch it in my jammies with my dogs.

Not to mention, I think the last time Mrs. Mush and I went to a movie theater (prolly 2018?) between tickets, snacks, and soft drinks we were out like $60.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on February 29, 2024, 10:31:08 AM
wear whatever I want, snacks are bottomless, and the beer is actually cold.

Brad

Well as long as only the snacks are bottomless. Otherwise, TMI.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on February 29, 2024, 11:57:40 AM
I'm gonna splurge and go see it in Imax.  I have a major work project happening overnight this weekend so I can't see it opening weekend, but I'm taking Friday off next week on kind of a flex basis for this weekend's emergency work.  I'll see it on a weekday while the crowds are elsewhere.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on February 29, 2024, 12:16:00 PM
If you've read the book and/or seen the 84 version (yeah I know) and/or the Syfi version I don't think watching YT videos is going to spoil it for you all that much.
I have seen both of those and read the book.  I would still like to see this movie. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 29, 2024, 12:23:22 PM
I have seen both of those and read the book.  I would still like to see this movie.

I wasn't saying don't see it just that if you have read/seen the others that a YT video probably won't spoil it for you
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on February 29, 2024, 02:05:20 PM
I wasn't saying don't see it just that if you have read/seen the others that a YT video probably won't spoil it for you
It will because I don't know how this movie tells the story (what is left out/left in, etc).
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: zahc on February 29, 2024, 02:27:03 PM
I already ordered tickets. I don't have high hopes but it can't be that bad.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on February 29, 2024, 04:09:27 PM
One of the major advantages for my wife and I to watch these movies at home is the closed captions.  With both of us having bilateral hearing losses, it helps with the dialog.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on February 29, 2024, 04:32:17 PM
I already ordered tickets. I don't have high hopes but it can't be that bad.
My local theater has a 5:30 PM showing.  Unless the website is not updating, there are little if any advance tickets sold.  I guess most people just walk in here.  I am thinking the earlier showing won't be crowded.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on February 29, 2024, 05:06:54 PM
Oh, one of the other reasons I'd rather be home: Back when I used to go to the theater, movies were always around 90-120min. Now most of them - especially big budget stuff - go well over two hours, closer to three. Dune 2 is 2h46m.

Man, I just cannot sit in one spot that long. Even in my super comfortable lounge chair, let alone theater seating. I pretty much stop all the really long movies I watch somewhere in the middle for a break of at least 15min, but often an hour or so. Sitting kills, as they say.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on February 29, 2024, 08:18:24 PM
Yeah, that's a big one, Ben. It would be nice if the really long movies had intermissions in them.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on February 29, 2024, 08:24:32 PM
Yeah, that's a big one, Ben. It would be nice if the really long movies had intermissions in them.

Intermissions used to be the norm for long movies. Not sure when they stopped having them, maybe sometime around 1970 or so.

Typed that and then decided to google it. According to this 1982 in the US

Quote
First, a quick history lesson. As a 2014 Slate piece in defense of the intermission explains, a midway break was commonplace in cinemas back when theaters needed time to switch out reels. After reels were no longer needed, theaters kept intermissions going to give audiences a break, but eventually phased them out in lieu of packing more screenings into each day. According to SFGate, the last official movie to have an intermission in the U.S. was Gandhi in 1982.

Movies Are Too Long. We Need Intermissions Back.
https://www.menshealth.com/entertainment/a43250070/movie-intermissions-why-bring-back/

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 01, 2024, 07:32:08 AM
I saw Ghandi with the girl I was dating at the time.

I don't remember there being an intermission, but I do remember that, half way through the movie, I started feeling weird. Then I started feeling dizzy and sick, and by the time we got out of there she had to drive my car home because I was feeling so bad.

I ended up catching some weird virus that was going around. Made me dizzy as hell for several days, then gave me a dry cough from hell.... with muscle spasms in my chest that felt like my ribs were shattering.

To be honest, though, I'm not sure that I ever remember seeing a movie with an intermission. I'm sure that I did, I just don't recall.

But, this is my shocked face that theaters would actually drop the intermission in order to get one more showing in...
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on March 01, 2024, 10:09:07 AM
^^^But did she bail at that point or was there another date?
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 01, 2024, 10:24:48 AM
It was an... odd... relationship, for she was truly an odd girl.

But she had some redeeming attributes...  >:D
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JTHunter on March 01, 2024, 10:24:07 PM
It has very likely been over 20 years since I went to an indoor sit-down theater.
In that same timeframe, I may have gone to a drive-in movie a couple of times.  Between cable and now satellite, I don't need "theaters" as I'm willing to wait and watch them for (almost) free.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 01, 2024, 11:01:09 PM
I saw the movie at a 5:30 showing yesterday.  It wasn't crowded.  Maybe 10 other people, but maybe that was due to the early showing.  It isn't a busy theater. 

The movie was very well made.  Great effects and visuals.  It either departs from the book or omits somethings that might upset someone who is dedicated to the book.  It seems like it was setting up a 3rd movie so we will see where that goes.  I hate to get into any details to spoil things.  Plenty of spoiler reviews on youtube if you want to hear about it.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 02, 2024, 07:40:37 AM
Just remembered another movie that DEMANDED to be seen in the theater...

Prometheus.

Mtnbkr and I saw it when it came out.

Visually stunning movie. Just gorgeous filming and editing.

Story? Not so much. Some of the performances were quite good, but overall it was... lacking.

I was wondering if I was missing something until I realized that Mtnbkr was checking his watch. He wasn't that crazy about it, either.

Fortunately Alien: Covenant then came out (I didn't see it in the theaters) and it was such an incredible shitshow that it made Prometheus look like an Oscars sweep movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 02, 2024, 07:53:27 AM
According to this the first one did $434 million worldwide.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianbushard/2024/03/01/dune-part-two-grosses-11-million-in-previews-best-since-barbenheimer/?sh=31403371120e

Compared to what Hollywood usually expects nowadays that not that great for a big budget movie but for a more serious Sci Fi movie pretty good IMHO. These movies are more for those who enjoy hard Sci Fi more than the usual Star Wars type fan and frankly I'm both surprised and happy they were green lit probably knowing full well they weren't going to draw in massive numbers. I find that encouraging in today's Hollywood.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 02, 2024, 08:09:07 AM
Tried to read that article on Forbes...

Oh! Hey! You can't read this article because you have an ad blocker running! Please turn it off.

OK, good, thank you for turning your ad blocker off.

Here, have an ad. And a few more... AND A FEW THOUSAND MORE! THAT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH! EAT POP UP ADS, BITCH!

Never could read the article. Got the jist of it from the first paragraph. And Forbes is firmly in my "not worth the ad soaked trouble" category.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 02, 2024, 08:12:08 AM
Tried to read that article on Forbes...

Oh! Hey! You can't read this article because you have an ad blocker running! Please turn it off.

OK, good, thank you for turning your ad blocker off.

Here, have an ad. And a few more... AND A FEW THOUSAND MORE! THAT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH! EAT POP UP ADS, BITCH!

Never could read the article. Got the jist of it from the first paragraph. And Forbes is firmly in my "not worth the ad soaked trouble" category.

I'm using the uBlock Origin ad blocker in Firefox and it came right up for me.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 02, 2024, 08:19:47 AM
I'm using Adblocker Plus.

Apparently Forbes now recognizes it.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 02, 2024, 08:23:07 AM
According to something I read on the all knowing internet uBlock Origin is what Brave has built in as it's ad blocker. I have notice similar ad behavior from both brave and Firefire with uBlock
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 02, 2024, 08:26:42 AM
I'm going to look into UBlock a bit more, but it looks like a pretty good option. I've noticed AB+ has been less and less effective over the last couple of years.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 03, 2024, 06:58:18 PM
According to this the first one did $434 million worldwide.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianbushard/2024/03/01/dune-part-two-grosses-11-million-in-previews-best-since-barbenheimer/?sh=31403371120e

Compared to what Hollywood usually expects nowadays that not that great for a big budget movie but for a more serious Sci Fi movie pretty good IMHO. These movies are more for those who enjoy hard Sci Fi more than the usual Star Wars type fan and frankly I'm both surprised and happy they were green lit probably knowing full well they weren't going to draw in massive numbers. I find that encouraging in today's Hollywood.
If I recall, the first one was available on streaming either the same day or very soon after the movie release.  That had to hurt. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 04, 2024, 09:06:47 AM
Yes, it was. Primarily because of Corona.

I guess they figured it was a way to release the movie and capture at least some of the money they wouldn't have gotten otherwise.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 04, 2024, 09:12:28 AM
Just remembered another movie that DEMANDED to be seen in the theater...

Prometheus.

Mtnbkr and I saw it when it came out.

Visually stunning movie. Just gorgeous filming and editing.

Story? Not so much. Some of the performances were quite good, but overall it was... lacking.

I was wondering if I was missing something until I realized that Mtnbkr was checking his watch. He wasn't that crazy about it, either.

Fortunately Alien: Covenant then came out (I didn't see it in the theaters) and it was such an incredible shitshow that it made Prometheus look like an Oscars sweep movie.

There's Alien then there's Aliens. After them it seems like as if they had no clue how to make an Alien movie.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 04, 2024, 10:05:15 AM
There's Alien then there's Aliens. After them it seems like as if they had no clue how to make an Alien movie.
Those two movies were simple stories with teasers of deeper backstories that were left to the imagination.  Sometimes its best to leave it alone in our imagination and not try to explain it. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 04, 2024, 10:07:04 AM
There's Alien then there's Aliens. After them it seems like as if they had no clue how to make an Alien movie.

Yep, Aliens 3 went off an incredibly high cliff and augured in at the base in spectacular fashion. It was awful.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 04, 2024, 10:32:34 AM
Yep, Aliens 3 went off an incredibly high cliff and augured in at the base in spectacular fashion. It was awful.

The director and writers held great potential in their hands and threw it in the trash can. IIRC the director's prior experience was making music videos for MTV.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 04, 2024, 10:43:29 AM
They should have stuck with either the Horror story or the Bug Hunt story.  They could have done 2 or 3 more movies like that.  Instead they seemed to be trying to some sort of "deep" or meaningful stories. 

A movie showing a group of marines clearing an alien infestation out of a space station would be cool.  There was also a comic or something in the 90's that had aliens infesting Earth.  Not sure if that would play well.  A big part of Aliens was the marines didn't know what they were getting into.  A follow on movie would be marines who knew what to expect.   
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 04, 2024, 10:45:15 AM
If you think Alien 3 is bad try watching Alien 4. Yes it got worse and they had to work hard to get it there [barf]
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 04, 2024, 10:57:56 AM
I got about an hour into Alien Resurrection and I couldn't take anymore.

I shut it off, returned the disk to the person I borrowed it from, and vowed never to speak of it again.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 04, 2024, 11:11:30 AM
I got about an hour into Alien Resurrection and I couldn't take anymore.

I shut it off, returned the disk to the person I borrowed it from, and vowed never to speak of it again.

15 minutes, maybe not even that long, in and you just want everyone in the movie to die and get it over with. Not a single person in that movie you care about including Sigourney Weaver's character
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 04, 2024, 11:24:38 AM
IMDB ratings
Alien - 8.5
Aliens - 8.4
Alien 3 - 6.4
Alien Resurrection (4) - 6.2

Guess some liked 3 & 4 to keep it that high
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JTHunter on March 04, 2024, 02:09:50 PM
K Frame - I just hit the "stop loading" button on my FF browser and the Forbes page loaded.  Here's part of the article.

Topline
The highly anticipated sequel to Frank Herbert’s epic sci-fi novel, “Dune: Part Two” grossed at least $11 million in previews on Thursday, more than doubling its predecessor and putting it on pace with last summer’s double-barrelled blockbusters “Barbie” and “Oppenheimer.”
Key Facts

The sequel to 2021’s extraterrestrial sci-fi hit “Dune”—which will open in thousands of theaters Friday—has so far made $11 million in previews according to Deadline, while Variety estimates it made roughly $12 million, putting it well above the 2021 iteration’s $5.1 million, and just above Universal’s “Oppenheimer” ($10.5 million in previews) and October’s sleeper hit “Five Nights at Freddy’s” ($10.3 million).

The film trails still “Barbie,” which earned $22.3 million in previews last year.

“Dune: Part Two,” starring Zendaya, Timothée Chalamet, Florence Pugh and Austin Butler, also grossed roughly $2 million in Imax screenings this week, Deadline reported.

The sequel, which cost a reported $190 million to make, still has a long way to go to catch up with the so-called Barbenheimer duo—Warner Bros.’ “Barbie” pulled in $162 million at its domestic opening weekend, while “Oppenheimer” grossed $82.4 million in its U.S. opening weekend.


By comparison, the first “Dune” grossed just over $41 million domestically in its opening weekend, and has since gone on to take in nearly $434 million worldwide, according to data from Box Office Mojo.
What To Watch For

“Dune: Part Two” is projected to rack up a whopping $170 million worldwide in its opening weekend, including $80 million in the U.S. and Canada. If that projection holds up, the sci-fi sequel would be the first to cross the $50 million threshold in its opening weekend since October’s teen horror, “Five Nights at Freddy’s.” Still, it would fall short of “Barbie” and remain roughly on par with ‘Oppenheimer’ in terms of U.S. gross.
Chief Critics

So far, audiences have raved about “Dune: Part Two,” giving it a 95% audience score on Rotten Tomatoes, while critics have given mostly favorable ratings, including a 94% critics score on the site. Critics on Metacritic rated the second installment at a score of 79 out of 100. A review in the New York Times described the sequel, from director Denis Villeneuve, as “bigger and more far out” than its predecessor, lauding the “cinematic spectacle” as “alive and rocking” and a “blast.” A review in The Guardian also praises the follow-up as an “extraordinary visual spectacle.”
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MillCreek on March 04, 2024, 03:24:58 PM
My brother-in-law, who shares my love of science fiction, went to see it on Saturday on an Imax screen.  He said it was visually stunning, had a great plot, and should be seen on a big or Imax screen with a good sound system.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 05, 2024, 03:13:58 PM
More Babylon Bee

Bullies At Work Mercilessly Mock Man Who Hasn't Seen 'Dune: Part Two' Yet
https://babylonbee.com/news/bullies-at-work-mercilessly-mock-man-who-hasnt-seen-dune-part-two-yet
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 09, 2024, 07:36:16 AM
Seen a couple of clips on YT and I like how they did Stilgar in this. Like that favorite uncle that everyone likes to visit because he makes you laugh but at the same time is someone that in an instant has your back in battle. The actor was a good choice for the part.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: AZRedhawk44 on March 09, 2024, 09:21:36 AM
I enjoyed it very much.  Saw it yesterday on IMAX. 

"Visually stunning" seems like a talking point, but it fits.  I lack a more appropriate description.

Mostly faithful to the original novel, at least from what I remember.  A few lesser points left out, and a few world building elements glossed over that I would have preferred to see given more detail.

Honestly, I was rather impressed with Chalamet.  Then again, he faced the same challenge as Kyle MacLachlan in 1984: most saw him as too soft for the role as well.  Chalamet grew in stature as the film progressed.  I'm sure Villeneuve's cinematography helped greatly with that, but Chalamet did his part.

Go see it.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on March 09, 2024, 10:01:27 AM
I've just seen the first one, but I agree about Chalamet.  I had thought he didn't look like the part, but I was wrong- he did an excellent job.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: zahc on March 09, 2024, 10:16:49 AM
I was going to see it in imax in Dallas next week but as far as I can tell there's no theaters actually showing it in real imax.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 09, 2024, 10:21:20 AM
I, too, was very impressed with the job that Timothy Chalamet did in the role.

I never cared much for Kyle MacLachlan OR Sean Young in the roles as Paul and Channi in the 1984 movie, especially after I finally read the book.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on March 09, 2024, 10:37:45 AM
I was originally disappointed in Chalmet as the choice, not because of his acting ability, but because of his stature. I think higher up in this thread, someone made the good argument that he's likely fairly true to what the book expected Paul to be - someone just coming into manhood. And I think he plays this role very well.

I still think they could have bulked him up by ten or so pounds. He doesn't need to be Jack Reacher, but I'm thinking that the women leads outweigh him.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Pb on March 09, 2024, 11:30:23 AM
In the novel, Paul starts out as fifteen years of age, and is supposed to be even small for his age.  The actor they chose fits well.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: WLJ on March 16, 2024, 12:51:18 PM
Dune is about climate change......or something

‘Dune’ Is a Climate Story We Can Actually Root For
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-03-06/-dune-part-two-is-a-climate-story-we-can-actually-root-for?utm_source=website&utm_medium=share&utm_campaign=twitter

Leftist Killjoys Co-Opt 'Dune', Stick Heads Up Own Arrakis Instead
https://twitchy.com/amy-curtis/2024/03/16/bloomberg-dune-climate-change-story-n2393970

Yes the climate of Arrakis and how it's creature including humans adapted to it is a part of the story but that doesn't make it a climate story.
Guy reminds me of that Family Guy character that thinks Star Trek is about Sulu
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: K Frame on March 23, 2024, 07:34:20 AM
So...

Finally saw Dune part 2 last night. My friend came in from Texas again and we went with another friend.

I really really really liked it. Visually stunning again and exceptionally atmospheric.

But, I just didn't feel captured and captivated by it the way part 1 captured and captivated me.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: zahc on March 23, 2024, 10:20:53 AM
I watched it and, aside from a couple dumb Hollywood tropes that should have been avoided, enjoyed it 100%. Now the more I think about it, the more problems I can find with it. Solution: don't think about it too much.

Title: Re: Dune
Post by: dogmush on March 23, 2024, 03:14:35 PM
Is it on streaming yet?
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on March 24, 2024, 11:29:16 AM
Slight tangent, but every time I think I've seen all the uncut scenes from the original Dune, another one pops up. This one is with Harah, Jessica, and Alia. In some ways I can see why it was cut, because Alia's scream (using The Voice?) seems very forced. Nevertheless, despite the hate many have for the original (I like it), I would really love to see a full, uncut version of it someday. Even if it's five hours long.

https://youtu.be/dbaYiWE3Ttk
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 24, 2024, 09:17:31 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJykw3H4PDw

Might have been posted before.  There is a fan edit of the 80's Dune called the Spice Diver Fan Edit.  It adds in some deleted scenes.  I watched it a while back and liked it. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 24, 2024, 09:19:49 PM
I watched it and, aside from a couple dumb Hollywood tropes that should have been avoided, enjoyed it 100%. Now the more I think about it, the more problems I can find with it. Solution: don't think about it too much.
That is kind of my position.  I liked the movie.  It was very very well made.  A long movie that didn't seem long in the theater. 

There were just some departures from the book that bother me the more I think about it. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 24, 2024, 09:26:57 PM
Dune is about climate change......or something

‘Dune’ Is a Climate Story We Can Actually Root For
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-03-06/-dune-part-two-is-a-climate-story-we-can-actually-root-for?utm_source=website&utm_medium=share&utm_campaign=twitter

Leftist Killjoys Co-Opt 'Dune', Stick Heads Up Own Arrakis Instead
https://twitchy.com/amy-curtis/2024/03/16/bloomberg-dune-climate-change-story-n2393970

Yes the climate of Arrakis and how it's creature including humans adapted to it is a part of the story but that doesn't make it a climate story.
Guy reminds me of that Family Guy character that thinks Star Trek is about Sulu

I think it was either in the Dune book or a prequel about Kines, there was plenty of water on Dune for it not to be a complete desert, but the little makers kept the water locked up underground.  I think the Fremen were setting up gardens in the far North and bribing the spacing guild to keep anyone from knowing about it.

It would be kind of interesting if we learned that earth's climate was changing due to the action of microbes of some kind. 
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: zahc on March 24, 2024, 09:30:24 PM
The departures are forgivable if it helps adapt the script to the screen. But there's too many other flaws.

It's never explained in-movie why they have lasguns, but don't use them.

Why did it take feyd rautha to come up with the idea of using artillery? Isn't "bomb the enemy's base" basically a starting strategy?

Why did they only use sandworms on the last battle?

Why did nuking the mountains throw giant boulders for miles but not kill everyone from radiation and shockwave?

Why can paul get stabbed X times and not need any rest or medical attention?

What's the point of any conflict in the movie if the bene gesserit basically call every shot ever anyway?

It's a really good movie as long as you don't ask questions. Reinforcing my theory that the main problem with modern Hollywood is always writing.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: Ben on March 24, 2024, 09:36:05 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJykw3H4PDw

Might have been posted before.  There is a fan edit of the 80's Dune called the Spice Diver Fan Edit.  It adds in some deleted scenes.  I watched it a while back and liked it.

Hey, thanks for that, Mech.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 24, 2024, 09:49:14 PM
The departures are forgivable if it helps adapt the script to the screen. But there's too many other flaws.

It's never explained in-movie why they have lasguns, but don't use them.

Why did it take feyd rautha to come up with the idea of using artillery? Isn't "bomb the enemy's base" basically a starting strategy?

Why did they only use sandworms on the last battle?

Why did nuking the mountains throw giant boulders for miles but not kill everyone from radiation and shockwave?

Why can paul get stabbed X times and not need any rest or medical attention?

What's the point of any conflict in the movie if the bene gesserit basically call every shot ever anyway?

It's a really good movie as long as you don't ask questions. Reinforcing my theory that the main problem with modern Hollywood is always writing.
I think they briefly mentioned the laser gun issue with shields in the first movie.  It never explained why people were using lasers all the time.  There was a scene in the first movie where one character was flying out of the city to get away.  They were firing lasers at him which would seem stupid if he had shields on the craft.  Destroy the whole city. 

They compressed the timeline a great deal in this version so Paul and Chani's relationship doesn't get much time.  Paul was with the Fremen for 2 or 3 years. 

The Fremen were the greatest fighters in the universe from the start in the movie rather than learning the weirding way from Paul and Jessica to make them even better.  Again, no time for that to happen. 

In the book, Paul knew how to make rockets and other weapons the Fremen started using.  He also had been training at guerilla warfare tactics and advising the Fremen in their raids on the Harkonnen.  That was part of what gained him respect such that he was recognized as the leader. 

There is probably other stuff about the movie I may have missed.  Since I have read the book, some of the back story is assumed.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: JTHunter on March 24, 2024, 10:41:54 PM
Slight tangent, but every time I think I've seen all the uncut scenes from the original Dune, another one pops up. This one is with Harah, Jessica, and Alia. In some ways I can see why it was cut, because Alia's scream (using The Voice?) seems very forced. Nevertheless, despite the hate many have for the original (I like it), I would really love to see a full, uncut version of it someday. Even if it's five hours long.

https://youtu.be/dbaYiWE3Ttk

I prefer the '84 version as well with the only disagreement being that somebody younger than Kyle MacLaclan should have started the movie and Kyle come in after the wars had started.
I didn't really like seeing Thufir die that way despite knowing from the book that he had pulled his own heart plug.
Title: Re: Dune
Post by: MechAg94 on March 25, 2024, 09:10:06 AM
The whole "using sounds as a weapon" seems cheezy now.  However, at least it got the point across that Paul and Jessica had something to teach and helped the Fremen become better fighters.