Armed Polite Society

Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: WLJ on November 03, 2020, 09:25:48 AM

Title: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on November 03, 2020, 09:25:48 AM
Poor? Addicted to drugs? Mentally ill? Say hello to your get out of jail card.
What could possibly go wrong?

Quote
The Seattle City Council is considering new legislation that would create a legal loophole that would make substance addiction, mental illness or poverty a valid legal defense for nearly all misdemeanor crimes committed in the city.
Quote
If approved, the ordinance would excuse and dismiss -- essentially legalizing -- almost all misdemeanor crimes committed in Seattle by offenders who could show either:

    Symptoms of addiction without being required to provide a medical diagnosis;
    Symptoms of a mental disorder; or
    Poverty and the crime was committed to meet an "immediate and basic need." For example, if a defendant argued they stole merchandise to sell for cash in order to purchase food, clothes or was trying to scrape together enough money for rent. The accused could not be convicted.

Seattle City Council mulls law that could result in dismissal of many misdemeanor crimes
https://komonews.com/news/local/seattle-city-council-mulls-plan-that-could-result-in-dismissal-of-many-misdemeanor-crimes



Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: dogmush on November 03, 2020, 09:29:27 AM
I'll drink to that.   >:D
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on November 03, 2020, 09:32:27 AM
I'll drink to that.   >:D

I guess if you're an alcoholic this would mean that you could walk into any liquor store and just steal a bottle or two whenever you felt like it.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MechAg94 on November 03, 2020, 10:03:15 AM
Makes me want to move to Seattle and start a business.  I guess to pay my employees $15 per hour to watch people walk out of the store with merchandise.  I am sure the cops will show up in force to put a stop to petty theft after that.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MillCreek on November 03, 2020, 10:24:31 AM
Makes me want to move to Seattle and start a business.  I guess to pay my employees $15 per hour to watch people walk out of the store with merchandise.  I am sure the cops will show up in force to put a stop to petty theft after that.

This very reason is why Bartell's, a local drugstore chain, have closed their stores in downtown Seattle.  The amount of retail shrinkage and injury to their employees was unsustainable.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: French G. on November 03, 2020, 11:08:40 AM
So what’s next? I guess we wait for the stores to close and then pass laws because there is a food desert.  [popcorn]
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: dogmush on November 03, 2020, 11:13:54 AM
So what’s next? I guess we wait for the stores to close and then pass laws because there is a food desert.  [popcorn]

No what's next is they make it illegal to go close your store if you are in an "underserved area".
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: K Frame on November 03, 2020, 11:16:04 AM
This very reason is why Bartell's, a local drugstore chain, have closed their stores in downtown Seattle.  The amount of retail shrinkage and injury to their employees was unsustainable.

Well obviously there needs to be a city ordnance prohibiting retailers from closing their stores because that's every bad "ist" thing there is... fascist, racist, capitalist, all bad!

They have a duty to serve the people of Seattle!
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MillCreek on November 03, 2020, 11:30:10 AM
https://www.q13fox.com/news/bartell-drugs-says-it-will-not-open-any-more-stores-in-downtown-seattle-after-violent-assaults-on-employees

https://crosscut.com/2019/10/whats-seattle-doing-solve-its-shoplifting-problem-nothing-really
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: K Frame on November 03, 2020, 11:55:16 AM
Just read that Bartell's is being sold to Rite Aid corporation.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on November 03, 2020, 12:24:50 PM
So what’s next? I guess we wait for the stores to close and then pass laws because there is a food desert.  [popcorn]

IIRC that is already has or is happening in several cities.

We've got the city paying stores with tax payer money to open or stay open in the inner city
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on November 03, 2020, 12:31:14 PM
When I work at Convenient back in the 80s had a manager tell me that he knew for a fact from the numbers that one of the stores in a certain part of town that at least 1/3  of what was leaving the store dollar wise had five finger discounts applied. That was back in the 80s.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: TommyGunn on November 03, 2020, 12:34:09 PM
 :facepalm:


Many years ago .... probably 1980s,  I read a dystopia  S. F.  book in which you could get a license to commit crime.  Law enforcement existed but had largely gone covert, or underground,  enforced mainly only by "true believers"  who risked the wrath of what might be called "social justice warriors" today if outed.  It was entertaining,  but I sort of thought it wasn't really very realistic or probable.

 [tinfoil]  I have changed  my mind on that ....  :facepalm:     :'(
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: just Warren on November 03, 2020, 12:41:03 PM
How's this for a long-term play in Seattle or any city:

Create circumstances in which many people leave the city which drives down property values.

Buy up the property at a discount.

Change the circumstances back to what they were before.

Sell or rent the property for a huge profit.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on December 13, 2020, 10:39:18 AM
They're still pushing this with a new twist

Quote
The new twist is that Herbold wants the new legal defense to be added to the Seattle municipal code. It would provide an affirmative defense for someone who committed a crime because they need to meet a basic need to survive.

“The defendant would just have to prove that the needs fit within the definition of immediate basic need,” Asha Venkataraman, a member of the council’s Central Staff, told the Public Safety Committee.

Seattle City Council again mulls poverty defense for some accused suspects
https://komonews.com/amp/news/operation-crime-justice/seattle-city-council-again-mulls-poverty-defense-for-some-accused-suspects

So move to Seattle and just freely steal whatever you need.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: cordex on December 13, 2020, 10:46:41 AM
Aren’t there state laws against theft that would apply and not be impacted by a municipal code?
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on December 13, 2020, 10:49:33 AM
Aren’t there state laws against theft that would apply and not be impacted by a municipal code?

I guess that would depend on whether or not state law on theft is preemptive in the State of Washington I would think.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: Fly320s on December 13, 2020, 11:31:54 AM
Makes me want to move to Seattle and start a business.  I guess to pay my employees $15 per hour to watch people walk out of the store with merchandise.

Loophole time.

You steal your employees' pay to meet your immediate needs for food and rent.  And booze of course. 
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: Boomhauer on December 13, 2020, 12:01:03 PM
May they get what they want and deserve.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on December 13, 2020, 12:05:48 PM
May they get what they want and deserve.

And not drag the rest of us down with them
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on December 13, 2020, 12:08:18 PM
Might as well just get rid of the checkouts at stores. Just grab what you want, I mean *cough* need, and walk out.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: bedlamite on December 13, 2020, 12:13:31 PM
https://www.foxnews.com/us/seattle-area-homeowners-report-sovereign-citizen-property-seizure-attempts-report
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: RoadKingLarry on December 13, 2020, 12:17:21 PM
https://www.foxnews.com/us/seattle-area-homeowners-report-sovereign-citizen-property-seizure-attempts-report

Around here that would be a good way to obtain permanent residency in a 3'X6'X6' piece of real estate.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on December 13, 2020, 12:22:34 PM
Quote
That knock on your door? It might be someone attempting to take your home.

Police in suburbs north of Seattle say so-called “sovereign citizens” have been visiting homes in at least two communities, presenting homeowners with official-looking documents, and announcing that they’re the rightful owners.

In at least one case, a homeowner was told she was being evicted, Seattle’s KIRO-TV reported.

Reaching for my Biden shotgun
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: Hawkmoon on December 13, 2020, 12:52:52 PM
Poor? Addicted to drugs? Mentally ill? Say hello to your get out of jail card.
What could possibly go wrong?

Seattle City Council mulls law that could result in dismissal of many misdemeanor crimes
https://komonews.com/news/local/seattle-city-council-mulls-plan-that-could-result-in-dismissal-of-many-misdemeanor-crimes


I think this concept is discriminatory. The people who don't have can't fabricate an [alleged[/i] mental health issue are being discriminated against by not being allowed to steal with impunity. It's an equal protection violation.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: griz on December 13, 2020, 04:15:38 PM
That's amazing.  Takes redistribution of wealth to a new level.  I wonder how one would go about "proving" poverty?  If my wallet was stolen does that temporary poverty give me a free pass even though I have money in the bank?
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: dogmush on December 13, 2020, 04:18:58 PM
That's amazing.  Takes redistribution of wealth to a new level.  I wonder how one would go about "proving" poverty?  If my wallet was stolen does that temporary poverty give me a free pass even though I have money in the bank?

Are you caucasian?   Then I think you know the answer.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: just Warren on December 13, 2020, 04:48:58 PM
Are you caucasian?   Then I think you know the answer.

They'll use Liquid Paper, AKA white-out, to obscure your name on the deed.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: WLJ on June 09, 2021, 08:10:39 PM
Flipping mad

Quote
“When the arbiters of justice serve the false gods of white supremacy, they are not worthy of the power they wield,” Holmberg writes. “If police protection and restraint extend only to white people, they are no longer guardians; they are mercenaries and zealots, paid in the wages of white privilege, inflicting their wicked commandments upon us.”

Holmberg then ties cops to the Jan. 6 riot, which Holmberg says resulted from an unnamed “organized domestic white power terrorist cell (or cells).”

Seattle official sends out all-staff email accusing cops of serving ‘the false gods of white supremacy,’ ‘inflicting their wicked commandments upon us’
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2021/06/09/seattle-official-sends-out-all-staff-email-accusing-cops-of-serving-the-false-gods-of-white-supremacy-inflicting-their-wicked-commandments-upon-us/
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: Perd Hapley on June 09, 2021, 10:02:35 PM
Flipping mad

Seattle official sends out all-staff email accusing cops of serving ‘the false gods of white supremacy,’ ‘inflicting their wicked commandments upon us’
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2021/06/09/seattle-official-sends-out-all-staff-email-accusing-cops-of-serving-the-false-gods-of-white-supremacy-inflicting-their-wicked-commandments-upon-us/

As John McWhorter has told us a hundred times, "anti-racism" is a religion.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: K Frame on June 10, 2021, 07:51:27 AM
What surprises me is that the whole of the Seattle PD hasn't walked off the job. They're losing officers at a dramatic rate.

Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MechAg94 on June 10, 2021, 09:08:18 AM
What surprises me is that the whole of the Seattle PD hasn't walked off the job. They're losing officers at a dramatic rate.
There were reports last year that the PD's in all those cities were seeing a huge increase in retirement requests.  I imagine most all of them have resumes out to neighboring suburban departments and elsewhere.  The concern I have heard mentioned is that any cops who would refuse dictatorial orders will be gone before long replaced by cops that will do whatever the leadership wants. 
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: K Frame on June 10, 2021, 10:59:11 AM
That's still going on. Seattle, in particular, has been really hard hit. They're down a couple hundred officers right now, hiring is at a virtual standstill, and they're set to lose a lot more officers this year through retirement and intent-to-separate notifications, and it's not going to get any better if the council keeps up with crap like this.

Crime has been skyrocketing in Seattle, and it's only a matter of time the way things are going that law enforcement largely breaks down in Seattle.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MillCreek on June 10, 2021, 11:17:16 AM
I have been interested to see the stories in the local media about the number of new lateral hires in Snohomish county law enforcement from Seattle.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MechAg94 on June 10, 2021, 11:22:20 AM
That's still going on. Seattle, in particular, has been really hard hit. They're down a couple hundred officers right now, hiring is at a virtual standstill, and they're set to lose a lot more officers this year through retirement and intent-to-separate notifications, and it's not going to get any better if the council keeps up with crap like this.

Crime has been skyrocketing in Seattle, and it's only a matter of time the way things are going that law enforcement largely breaks down in Seattle.
Does Seattle do the cash-less bail or at least have they increasingly let suspected felons loose on low or no bail?

The judges in Houston have increasingly done that and Houston is seeing more crime.  I have heard it is the bail issue along with very generous plea bargains.  I need to keep up with local news a bit more.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: JTHunter on June 10, 2021, 11:27:33 PM
That's still going on. Seattle, in particular, has been really hard hit. They're down a couple hundred officers right now, hiring is at a virtual standstill, and they're set to lose a lot more officers this year through retirement and intent-to-separate notifications, and it's not going to get any better if the council keeps up with crap like this.

Crime has been skyrocketing in Seattle, and it's only a matter of time the way things are going that law enforcement largely breaks down in Seattle.

As you might expect, this "attitude" isn't limited to Seattle.
The new mayor of St. Louis, Tishara Jones, is still talking about taking money from the SLPD for more "social programs" and not filling the nearly 200 vacancies in the rank & file officers.  She is getting flak from many residents in north St. Louis, the predominately poor/black section, as they are complaining about the increasing levels of crime and the obvious lack of police in their neighborhoods.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: K Frame on June 11, 2021, 07:52:43 AM
Washington, DC, is in the same position. The force has lost something like 200 officers since the beginning of 2019, and no new officers have been retired. Even worse, the 2022 budget has NO funds for hiring new officers.

It's looking right now like another 100+ officers will separate by the time 2022 rolls around.

DC was in something of a similar position back in the 1970s and 1980s (for very different reasons) with a concomitant spike in crime rates, especially murder rates. It took a court various court orders to get them hiring again, including court orders that dropped the qualifications... It was an unmitigated disaster. A fair number of new police officers had criminal records, and continued their criminal activity while on the job. Huge scandals. And, around the same time, DC switched to Glocks from revolvers... and cut training budgets to the bone. Another unmitigated disaster as unintentional shootings SKYROCKETED. The city ended up paying out millions in settlements.

A lot of cities are on the same path, and it's going to take decades to sort out. We're quickly moving back into the situation in the 1970s where criminals ruled many of the major US cities and residents who could fled to the suburbs. 
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: grampster on June 11, 2021, 12:55:01 PM

A lot of cities are on the same path, and it's going to take decades to sort out. We're quickly moving back into the situation in the 1970s where criminals ruled many of the major US cities and residents who could fled to the suburbs.

And the guns will get the blame.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: MechAg94 on June 11, 2021, 03:06:27 PM
Houston had 400 people murdered last year.  They are at 199 as of early June from what I just got from a search.  Wrong direction for that one to move. 

https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/crime/article/Houston-surpasses-decade-high-for-murders-15716892.php
This link has a chart of historical murder data, but a subscription pop up keeps blocking me.  However, it looks like we haven't see 400 or more since the early 90's. 
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: HankB on June 12, 2021, 09:25:17 AM
And in a recent story in the newspaper, fact checker Politifact (perhaps it should be fact twister Politifake) went through all kinds of verbal contortions to argue that concluding anti-cop actions by democrats in democrat cities really can't be blamed as the cause of rising crime there.
Title: Re: More madness from Seattle
Post by: Ben on June 12, 2021, 10:00:03 AM
And in a recent story in the newspaper, fact checker Politifact (perhaps it should be fact twister Politifake) went through all kinds of verbal contortions to argue that concluding anti-cop actions by democrats in democrat cities really can't be blamed as the cause of rising crime there.

They don't need to go through verbal contortions. They can just come out and say that it's "Extremist white supremacy - the greatest danger to the US today."