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Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Perd Hapley on April 04, 2022, 11:11:26 PM

Title: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 04, 2022, 11:11:26 PM
Getting back into the pickup truck market, and some advice wouldn't hurt. I could maybe afford this one (https://www.hollywoodmotorco.com/inventory/ford/f150-regular-cab/12949r/), at $16.5k, but I am also finding some trucks from the 2000s, with similar mileage, and at half the price. I also need to replace my wife's car, so cheaper is gooder.

Would those older trucks be a little easier to self-service? As in, is a 2001 any easier to work on than a 2013? I'm not a very good mechanic, but some things even I could figure out how to do by myself. My current car is a 2010 Chevy, and there were some repair jobs on that thing my retired mechanic father could not do, no matter how much he researched the problem. Very specialized equipment was required.

I'm looking for a full-sized truck, regular or ext. cab (not club/crew cab), with AC and a radio. Don't care what kind of transmission, don't need 4WD or a tow package, but wouldn't mind having them, either. Gas prices notwithstanding, it will be my daily driver.

Also, any tips on finding used trucks? Some that I've found on Autotrader look good, but the one I linked to I just found the old-fashioned way.

Thanks


Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on April 05, 2022, 05:32:07 AM
There wasn't  a huge change in ease of wrenching between my 2004 and 2014 F150's.  The 13th Gens have some wierd things that require a laptop, but most trucks 2014 and prior aren't  too bad to work on,

Both the ecoboost and the 5.0 coyote can have cam phaser ticking issues, not a huge deal, but a real pain to fix.

Prior to 2009 the 5.4 3v V8 had a bad head design that was prone to stripping spark plug threads.  They never really fixed it.


For a daily driver, the 2009-2014 had a 6 speed automatic (as opposed to a 4 speed for 2004-2009) so that would help your gas milage.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Grandpa Shooter on April 05, 2022, 06:50:51 PM
I have a 2002 F 150 with 247,000 miles on it.  I open the hood to verify the engine is still there, close it carefully and drive to my mechanic who gets paid to work on these things.  I once mentioned I was considering a F 250 and newer and he said don't do it.  He said mine is better than any of the newer ones past 2005.  I trust him.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on April 05, 2022, 08:23:14 PM
F250's and bigger are a different  animal.  A lot of repair procedures  start with "remove cab from truck".

Kinda of a PITA.  The 150's don't have that issue as much.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Bogie on April 05, 2022, 11:23:54 PM
One of my customers was bitching today.
 
He ordered one of the Ford hybrid trucks last year, and still hasn't seen it.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: BobR on April 05, 2022, 11:48:41 PM
One of my customers was bitching today.
 
He ordered one of the Ford hybrid trucks last year, and still hasn't seen it.

Not just the hybrids. I am still waiting on a Super Duty truck I ordered in Sept of 2021. There are quite a few people who have been on that train longer than I have.

bob
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Bogie on April 06, 2022, 12:22:53 AM
If  you really want to piss off  your neighbors...
 
https://www.commercialtrucktrader.com/listing/2015-VOLVO-VN+630-5020786142
 
Two axles, so no CDL required. You can probably lose the top fairing. And with a bed installed on the back, you won't have to worry about how much  you are hauling home from the garden store.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: BobR on April 06, 2022, 01:31:05 PM
If  you really want to piss off  your neighbors...
 
https://www.commercialtrucktrader.com/listing/2015-VOLVO-VN+630-5020786142
 
Two axles, so no CDL required. You can probably lose the top fairing. And with a bed installed on the back, you won't have to worry about how much  you are hauling home from the garden store.

That would make a great 5th wheel hauler! I have seen quite a few people towing with large trucks. They are actually cheaper than a tricked out Super Duty, etc.

bob

bob
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Bogie on April 06, 2022, 01:34:16 PM
500,000 miles is "just broken in."
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 06, 2022, 04:12:31 PM
Both the ecoboost and the 5.0 coyote can have cam phaser ticking issues, not a huge deal, but a real pain to fix.

On the flipside, if they've had the phasers replace with GENUINE FORD PARTS they are pretty much golden. Can't stress the genuine parts thing enough. The re-engineered OE replacement parts seem decently good. Most of the aftermarket replacements are worse than the piss poor originally-installed factory parts they're meant to replace.


Prior to 2009 the 5.4 3v V8 had a bad head design that was prone to stripping spark plug threads. They never really fixed it.

Stripped plug issue was on the 97-03 5.4 3V engines. Revised the heads for 04 but corrected the problem a little too well. They didn't spit plugs out any more. In fact, they held on to them so well they often broke the tip shroud off the plug and left it wedged firmly in the head. The deeper well in the combustion chamber let carbon build up between the well and plug tip shroud, wedging it in place. A change back to 1-piece plug for the 08 model year solved the problem. Didn't solve the cam phaser problem, but at least you didn't have to worry about plugs any more.

I had an 07 with the 5.4, the one that had problems with seized plugs. Fortunately, mechanics and gearheads came up with a reasonably successful workaround that kept broken plugs to a minimum. Rather than trying to spin out the plugs gently with a ratchet, use an impact gun. Set on low, put socket on plug, pull trigger and begin slowly dialing up the gun pressure. The impact action will jar the carbon loose and the plug will eventually begin to spin. Stay on the trigger until it's all the way out. With this method it's relatively rare to have a shroud separate. I did mine this way and all eight came out fine even after almost 100k the motor.

Install replacement plugs with a thin film of silver-based anti-seize on the shroud and threads.


For a daily driver, the 2009-2014 had a 6 speed automatic (as opposed to a 4 speed for 2004-2009) so that would help your gas milage.

Helped a little with the 5.4 but the addition of the Coyote 5.0 in 2011 was a much bigger boost. Fuel economy really took a jump in 2017 with the new 10 speed trans. Not one, not two, but three overdrive gears. The super-short-ratio 1st-3rd gears help with acceleration, too (sometimes a little too much if traction is limited).

If I played nice, my 2wd '07 got 16.5-17.0 mpg on the highway at 77mph cruise. In town was usually 13.5-14.0 but it didn't take much of a heavy foot to knock it down to the 11-12 range. My 2019 4WD F150 with the 5.0, 10-speed trans, and 3.73 differential gearing regularly gets 19.5-20.0 mpg at 77 mph cruise. If I go to New Mexico and hit a slew of 65mph stretches, it will easily get 22.5 mpg. At a steady 55 mph it will come within a tenth or two of 24 mpg. A truck with the 3.31 or the stupid-tall 3.15 ratio should see even better than that. Probably wouldn't tow worth poop and likely pretty doggy off the line, but would sure get decent economy.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: RoadKingLarry on April 06, 2022, 05:10:31 PM
Quote
if they've had the phasers replace with GENUINE FORD PARTS

I would prefer photon torpedoes, or quantum torpedoes if they are available.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on April 06, 2022, 07:04:34 PM
On the 5.4 plugs I've had good luck with half following the TSB, where you loosen them just a touch and put penetrating oil in there to soften the carbon,  then I do like you and run them out with a 3/8"s impact.  But the point remains the plugs are *special* in a 5.4, and the fix just changed the problem,  it didn't  fix it.

My 3.5 EcoBoost has the phaser rattle  on start up, but honestly  I just ignore it.  It goes away in a couple seconds, and it's no where near annoying enough to tear the top of the engine apart.

On the 10 speed, I assumed since Perd linked a 2013 XL work truck, he wasn't springing for a 2017 or newer F150.  There's  a significant price bump to get that transmission and the aluminium  bed.  Does help the mpg though.  My buddy with an 18 xlt 4wd gets like 20 on the highway.  I get 13.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 07, 2022, 01:39:37 AM
Not springing for the 2013, either, the more I think about it. I've seen a bunch of older trucks with less than 90k miles, and half the price. I think that's going to be a much wiser choice.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 07, 2022, 09:56:11 AM
Look into trucks from the desert southwest U.S. - west Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, et al.. Little to no rust and 100k miles is still in their prime. Lots of people with "city trucks" that have lots of highway miles but very little in the way of hard use or undo wear.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: charby on April 07, 2022, 10:11:16 AM
Look into trucks from the desert southwest U.S. - west Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, et al.. Little to no rust and 100k miles is still in their prime. Lots of people with "city trucks" that have lots of highway miles but very little in the way of hard use or undo wear.

Brad

100k may mean a lot of life still left on the power train, but older will mean suspension or steering parts will need to be replaced.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 07, 2022, 10:30:13 AM
100k may mean a lot of life still left on the power train, but older will mean suspension or steering parts will need to be replaced.

Around here, "older" and "high mileage" aren't necessarily synonymous. In the southwest it's common to have very long distances between destinations, even for regular travel. It's common to see three or four year old trucks with 80k-100k on the clock and still be in nearly- or like-new condition in every other respect, including steering and suspension gear. Fluids and filters, belts, basic tune up items, brakes, and the occasional wheel bearing are usually all that's needed.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 16, 2022, 02:43:37 AM
Is it no longer true that 4WD reduces fuel efficiency? Was it ever?

Most of the older-but-low-mileage trucks I'm seeing are white. Does that mean they're probably fleet trucks? (kind of a bummer, 'cause white is one of the few colors I really don't like, on most vehicles)
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Bogie on April 16, 2022, 06:47:38 AM
White is anonymous.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 16, 2022, 09:36:35 AM
White is anonymous.


Grey man drives a white truck?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on April 16, 2022, 10:19:55 AM
4wd will still lower mpg, but not as much as it used to. Figure 1 or 2 mpg difference for a circa 2010 half ton.

If you run across a white XL or stripped XLT, yeah odds are that was a work/fleet truck.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: zxcvbob on April 16, 2022, 10:39:19 AM

Grey man drives a white truck?

Yes.  Or a gray or light brown sedan.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 22, 2022, 06:24:31 PM
I had to take a few weeks off from the truck thing. It made more sense to replace the wifeís car first, because reasons, so we got her an old Highlander w/o a crazy amount of miles on it. Now back to the truck.

Been trying to learn a few things about the comparative reliability of various, older trucks. As mentioned, Iím looking for a low-mileage full-size truck I can get for less than $10,000. There do seem to be a few of them out there, all about 15-20 years old, and not necessarily in my state. I think I can deal with that.

Now I have to sort through various opinions and stories about which truck runs the longest, or has the fewest/cheapest maintenance problems. Oy.

A few things have emerged that seem like reasonable guides to me, but then again, I donít know if theyíre true. Iím not a gear-head, and donít pretend to know what Iím talking about. But what Iíve learned is:
 
Four wheel drive is extra complexity, so Iíll probably avoid that. The 2004/2005 F-150s are to be shunned. Other F-150s are OK, but the legends tell of problems with spark plugs, and with reaching all of the spark plugs. After the mid-2000s, GM and Dodge pickups have active fuel management (or the Dodge equivalent). Good for mileage, but can lead to problems. GM engines from the early 2000s are easy to service, and most GMs have simpler, push-rod engines that are less complex than the Ford or Dodge equivalents. Scotty Kilmer thinks youíre stupid, if youíre not driving a Toyota. (Pretty sure that last one is true.)

Other things are not as clear. One source says just get any Toyo if you can afford it. Another says to avoid the earlier models (only ones I can afford). The Car Wizard on yootoob says donít buy a Silverado made after 2006, but in another video he says the 2008 model is the one you should get. Unreserved praise for the Nissan over here, and warnings to avoid it, over there.

The end result, so far, is that Iím leaning toward an early 2000s GM. And I do see quite a few of them showing up in my Autotrader results, so perhaps fate would have it so.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: bedlamite on April 22, 2022, 07:27:29 PM
Scotty Kilmer thinks youíre stupid, is a loudmouth ahole that is going to get someone killed

FTFY.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 22, 2022, 07:41:42 PM
You think he's dangerous? Is it because of how violently he waves his arms?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: charby on April 22, 2022, 07:58:20 PM
I'm in the same boat as you, I need to think about replacing my truck. I have a 2002 Nissan Frontier with 151k on it. I'm fortunate that I have a vehicle for provided for work so I have no commute. I'm really frustrated with what is available for trucks and I've been thinking about going back to an SUV and trailer. That is something for you to think about.

For me switching from a truck to an SUV wouldn't be hard because I have a topper on my truck.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: bedlamite on April 22, 2022, 08:00:12 PM
You think he's dangerous? Is it because of how violently he waves his arms?

Feel free to take his advice to not use jackstands and use hardware store soft copper plumbing for brake lines. I'm sure it'll work out great.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: charby on April 22, 2022, 08:02:30 PM
Around here, "older" and "high mileage" aren't necessarily synonymous. In the southwest it's common to have very long distances between destinations, even for regular travel. It's common to see three or four year old trucks with 80k-100k on the clock and still be in nearly- or like-new condition in every other respect, including steering and suspension gear. Fluids and filters, belts, basic tune up items, brakes, and the occasional wheel bearing are usually all that's needed.

Brad

Sorry for the slow reply, but I have noticed once vehicles start getting years on them, things like the rubber dust covers on ball joints and tie rods start to deteriorate and crack, this allows moisture and dirt to get in there.

Low miles on older vehicles also means that exhaust systems start to rust out because they don't get driven regularly to temps to boil all the condensation out. I have that problem with my truck, about every three years I have to replace the muffler. Joys of living in a town where everything I need is at most 2 miles from my house.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 25, 2022, 09:49:25 AM
The end result, so far, is that Iím leaning toward an early 2000s GM. And I do see quite a few of them showing up in my Autotrader results, so perhaps fate would have it so.

Only things I can think of for those years are the 6.0 piston slap problems and ABS modules on the 2500/3500 series.

6.0 engines from that era had an issue with cold-start piston slap, essentially the piston design allowing a cold piston just enough free play to cause a slight knock at start up. If the performance environment was one of starting, driving short distances, shutting off the engine long enough to cool significantly, then starting again, this can lead to excessive piston scuffing. On the upside, reasonably priced reman long blocks are available from darn near everyone short of 7-11. Ditto performance upgrades, some of which are astonishingly cheap.

ABS modules are a known Achille's heel of early 2000's 2500/3500 series trucks. They live under the truck and are a common failure point, mostly leak-related. Cheap third-party replacements are available but should be avoided (Dorman, Cardone, etc). They are a waste of time an money. Factory modules, now revised and reliable, are expensive but will likely outlast the truck.

Plan on replacing the fade-prone headlight assemblies. They can be polished out but once they've begun oxidizing it's only a matter of time, the process will continue to accelerate regardless of how much UV protectant you slather on.

Otherwise the trucks are pretty decent. Relatively easy to work on, parts are readily available, and the ride and performance are good.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 25, 2022, 09:50:53 AM
Sorry for the slow reply, but I have noticed once vehicles start getting years on them, things like the rubber dust covers on ball joints and tie rods start to deteriorate and crack, this allows moisture and dirt to get in there.

Low miles on older vehicles also means that exhaust systems start to rust out because they don't get driven regularly to temps to boil all the condensation out. I have that problem with my truck, about every three years I have to replace the muffler. Joys of living in a town where everything I need is at most 2 miles from my house.

I was speaking tot the opposite, relatively new trucks with a buttload of miles. I wouldn't touch a low-mileage older truck unless I had full service records and an intimate knowledge of the truck's history.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 25, 2022, 02:48:49 PM
I was speaking tot the opposite, relatively new trucks with a buttload of miles. I wouldn't touch a low-mileage older truck unless I had full service records and an intimate knowledge of the truck's history.

Brad


Why is that?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 25, 2022, 03:33:36 PM

Why is that?

Old with low miles means they probably either sat unused a lot, were idled a bunch, or were driven only sporadically on trips too short to get things up to temp. Most likely a combination of all three. You also have to presume they probably weren't serviced a lot, if at all. That's when things like the stuff charby was talking about begin to set in. If I were buying an older low-mileage vehicle without service records it would get the ultra-double-squinky Mk 1 Calibrated Eyeball. I might even go so far as to pop for a full mechanical inspection. I'm one helluva good mechanic but someone who wrenches every day might catch something I didn't.

If you find one in decent mechanical shape, presume you'll need axle and pinion shaft seals. If they aren't leaking now, they will be soon. Good thing is parts are cheap and someone with experience can do them in no time. New bearings while you're at it as they are right there and it only takes a few extra minutes. Might as well slap on new brake slave cylinders while you're there, too, and save yourself the hassle down the road. Again, cheap and they will be staring you in the face.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 26, 2022, 02:07:00 PM

OK. Presumably, the fleet trucks I'm seeing on the market will have records.

I have an advantage, in that my Dad has a lift, and the know-how, and probably won't mind helping me out with the items you mention.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on April 26, 2022, 02:11:35 PM
OK. Presumably, the fleet trucks I'm seeing on the market will have records.


Yep, if it's one thing companies with vehicle fleets are known for, it's pulling a working vehicle out of service to do preventative maintenance on time.  Just like how drivers of fleet vehicles are known for the care with which they treat the vehicles entrusted to them.

/sarcasm

I would look any known fleet truck over very closely before I bought one.  Other than ex rental car fleet I can't think of a vehicle likely to be run harder or put away wetter than a fleet work truck.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: charby on April 26, 2022, 02:14:49 PM
Fleet=Beat like a rented mule.

Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 26, 2022, 02:31:44 PM
Depends on the fleet. If fleet=rental then, yeah, it's probably been flogged hard and service intervals have been pushed to the absolute limit. If it's a corporate fleet, that could be a different story. Better chance of it being someone's "city truck" used for deliveries or as a middle-manager's "company car". If that's the case, much better chance of it having been properly maintained (or at least not horribly abused).

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on April 26, 2022, 02:45:52 PM
IME the nicely maintained city trucks or manager cars are swapped out in the 5-7 year old range.

Perd is talking about 20 yo trucks.  If it's a 20 yo white base model fleet truck, it's been beat.  I'd bet on it. Or it was a city truck that has had an owner or two since then. 
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on April 26, 2022, 04:16:19 PM
If it's a 20 yo white base model fleet truck, it's been beat.  I'd bet on it. Or it was a city truck that has had an owner or two since then. 

Agreed.

Trucks of any stripe are going for a premium right now, at least around here. I was recently offered a trade-in value on my truck equal to what I paid for it almost three years ago. Sounds great, but then there's this little issue of nothing for sale to replace it.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 26, 2022, 04:41:43 PM
Yep, if it's one thing companies with vehicle fleets are known for, it's pulling a working vehicle out of service to do preventative maintenance on time.  Just like how drivers of fleet vehicles are known for the care with which they treat the vehicles entrusted to them.

/sarcasm

I would look any known fleet truck over very closely before I bought one.  Other than ex rental car fleet I can't think of a vehicle likely to be run harder or put away wetter than a fleet work truck.

I was just talking about the records.

When I drove fleet trucks, I know we weren't always gentle with them. On the other hand, we were also required to change the oil on a schedule, and the bean counters didn't shy away from having the trucks professionally serviced when it was needed.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Declaration Day on April 27, 2022, 04:32:43 PM
The end result, so far, is that Iím leaning toward an early 2000s GM. And I do see quite a few of them showing up in my Autotrader results, so perhaps fate would have it so.

I had both a 2003 and 2005 Silverado, brand new. Both of them were nightmares starting at 50,000 miles. Numerous electrical problems emerged, and on both of them, the bolt heads holding the headers to the engine started breaking off, one by one, until the headers fell off the sides of the engine. The '05, as I was driving it to a dealership to trade in, the gauges and climate control stopped working. I wouldn't take one of those heaps for free.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: charby on April 27, 2022, 04:37:46 PM
My 2002 4x4 Frontier Nissan is still running strong with 152,000 on the clock.

I've had to replace the ball joints at 83k, did it myself. Recently I spun a front wheel bearing and some reason the ABS sensor cable broke and tore the inner CV joint cover on the front axle. I fixed all that myself. Rear bumper rusted off, so I replaced that at 140k.

Oher than that, just been gas, oil, brake pads, tires and couple batteries.

I do need to replace the valve cover gaskets this summer, they are starting to weep oil.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: zxcvbob on April 27, 2022, 04:38:58 PM
I had both a 2003 and 2005 Silverado, brand new. Both of them were nightmares starting at 50,000 miles. Numerous electrical problems emerged, and on both of them, the bolt heads holding the headers to the engine started breaking off, one by one, until the headers fell off the sides of the engine. The '05, as I was driving it to a dealership to trade in, the gauges and climate control stopped working. I wouldn't take one of those heaps for free.

I had a 2001 Silverado with the 4.8L engine, and I never had any trouble with it at all until it rusted apart from the underneath. The body just had a little rust but the frame and the brake lines and cables and some of the suspension was totally shot.  I would love to have one just like it that had never been driven in salt.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: JTHunter on April 28, 2022, 12:04:45 AM
The first truck I had was an '82 Toyota SR-5 longbed 4WD with the 4 cyl. 22R engine.  Despite a cracked block and fist-sized rust holes behind both front tires, this truck finally threw a rod at about 180,000 miles.
Next was a '97 GMC Sonoma, 4.3 V6 2WD.  It was a good and comfortable truck but the center U-joint on the drive shaft went bad at about 90,000 miles.  Then it went bad again at about 125,000 miles.  I hated getting rid of that truck but it was just getting too expensive to maintain.
Now I have an '08 Ford Ranger 2WD with a 4L V-6 and the "suicide doors" on both sides of the cab.  As this truck doesn't get as good a MPG as the Sonoma, it doesn't get used much.  Other than fluids, filters, and a battery, it is still all original, even the tires, as I only have about 9,800 miles on it.  I'm keeping my eyes on the tires for signs of dry rot but none is showing up - yet.
  =D
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 05, 2022, 04:03:54 PM
I had both a 2003 and 2005 Silverado, brand new. Both of them were nightmares starting at 50,000 miles. Numerous electrical problems emerged, and on both of them, the bolt heads holding the headers to the engine started breaking off, one by one, until the headers fell off the sides of the engine. The '05, as I was driving it to a dealership to trade in, the gauges and climate control stopped working. I wouldn't take one of those heaps for free.

Is there a truck that era you'd recommend?

Apparently, the bolts breaking on those engines is well-known problem, as is the dash displays needing to be resoldered. One YouTuber I looked at even said that generation of Chevy trucks are a great engine, with a truck that falls apart all around it.

I’m still trying to get caught up on other things, so it may be another week or two before I pull the trigger. But Perd got more dum questions. Viz –

Anyone ever buy a vehicle from a distance? I’m seeing good-looking trucks in other parts of the country, and I like the idea of getting one from the sunbelt. I was wondering about finding a local garage, and then asking the seller to take it over there for a look-see. Is that a thing?

I don’t see a lot of stick shifts for sale, but would one of those be a safer bet, on an older (15-20 year old) truck?

On the dangers of a low-mileage vehicle: On a 2000s truck, I think of low mileage as 100,000 or less. Is that low enough to be wary, or are we talking 50,000?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 05, 2022, 04:16:13 PM
Broken exhaust manifold bolt on LS engines are a known problem. There are a couple of tricks for getting them out with minimal swearing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIdRuc4ZbNs

Circuit Board Medics offers a flat-rate refurb on instrument clusters. I had them do the cluster in my 07 F150 to correct a known brake light issue. Was completely satisfied with their service.

https://circuitboardmedics.com/chevrolet-instrument-cluster-repair/

Also, plan on replacing the factory speakers. They were prone to cone rot. No big deal as inexpensive, quality bolt-in replacements complete with harness adapters are available from several sources. Installation is easy. Couple of screws a bolts to dismount the panels. Figure an hour or so to do all four. Worst part is dealing with the factory weather sealant. Goopy black stuff that gets everywhere if you aren't super careful.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on May 05, 2022, 04:20:31 PM
What are you looking to spend?  I bought my current truck from 200 miles away, and I bought my previous car from a dealer in Atlanta while I was in Kuwait.  It depends on the quality of the pictures they provide, how bad I want that particular vehicle, and how easy it is to back out if it looks bad when I see it.

Trucks are expensive as heck right now.  If you are in the 10-15K range, realistically, you're getting an almost 20 year old truck with a fair amount of wear and tear.  At that range, I'd find one close enough I could poke it with a stick, look for obvious issues, and grab one I liked.  All vehicle models from the early 2000's are going to have their quirks so just roll the dice on one you like.  Whatever you get is likely to need some TLC anyway.

20k ish is where I'd be willing to look for  a truck farther afield, in nice shape with the right options. 

As for models, I really like 2011 and up F150s.  Both the 3.5 ecoboost and the 5.0 are pretty decent motors without too many "bite you down the road" issues.  There's a millions of them so parts are cheap, they tend to run to 200,000 ish before anything major needs a rebuild, etc.  I don't like RAM's until they put the good transmissions in them (2019 or newer)  The third gen Silverado's seem to be holding up pretty well. A mid teens Tundra or Titan is probably fine too.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 05, 2022, 05:12:17 PM

Circuit Board Medics offers a flat-rate refurb on instrument clusters. I had them do the cluster in my 07 F150 to correct a known brake light issue. Was completely satisfied with their service.

https://circuitboardmedics.com/chevrolet-instrument-cluster-repair/

That's pretty cool, especially the part where you can upgrade to LED for $30. Looks nice.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 05, 2022, 05:25:18 PM
What are you looking to spend?  I bought my current truck from 200 miles away, and I bought my previous car from a dealer in Atlanta while I was in Kuwait.  It depends on the quality of the pictures they provide, how bad I want that particular vehicle, and how easy it is to back out if it looks bad when I see it.

Trucks are expensive as heck right now.  If you are in the 10-15K range, realistically, you're getting an almost 20 year old truck with a fair amount of wear and tear.  At that range, I'd find one close enough I could poke it with a stick, look for obvious issues, and grab one I liked.  All vehicle models from the early 2000's are going to have their quirks so just roll the dice on one you like.  Whatever you get is likely to need some TLC anyway.

20k ish is where I'd be willing to look for  a truck farther afield, in nice shape with the right options. 

As for models, I really like 2011 and up F150s.  Both the 3.5 ecoboost and the 5.0 are pretty decent motors without too many "bite you down the road" issues.  There's a millions of them so parts are cheap, they tend to run to 200,000 ish before anything major needs a rebuild, etc.  I don't like RAM's until they put the good transmissions in them (2019 or newer)  The third gen Silverado's seem to be holding up pretty well. A mid teens Tundra or Titan is probably fine too.

I have to keep it under 10.

Given my super-amazing mechanical know-how, I am thinking that having a mechanic give it a once-over is probably a lot better than looking at it myself. The Internet claims that some garages will do a pre-purchase inspection for you, for around $100 or so. Between that, and a good set of photos, I think I might feel OK to pull the trigger without actually seeing it.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Declaration Day on May 05, 2022, 05:41:03 PM
Is there a truck that era you'd recommend?

The best truck I owned was a '91 F-150, until I got into a catastrophic accident in which I should have died, but walked away from.  In more modern terms, I've owned trucks from all of the big three, brand new, starting with an '01 Ford.  They were all junk after 50,000 miles.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on May 05, 2022, 08:01:51 PM
The best truck I owned was a '91 F-150, until I got into a catastrophic accident in which I should have died, but walked away from.  In more modern terms, I've owned trucks from all of the big three, brand new, starting with an '01 Ford.  They were all junk after 50,000 miles.

If you can find one that's not beat to hell, my 95 F150 w/ Straight 6 went to 230k or so with me, then I sold it and I still see it ocasionally driving around 6 years later. I fixed stuff, but it was tough.

The problem is those trucks have reached "vintage" and are pretty  pricey if not rusted out crap.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 05, 2022, 09:54:28 PM
Just wanted to bring up these questions one more time:


Anyone ever buy a vehicle from a distance? Iím seeing good-looking trucks in other parts of the country, and I like the idea of getting one from the sunbelt. I was wondering about finding a local garage, and then asking the seller to take it over there for a look-see. Is that a thing?

I donít see a lot of stick shifts for sale, but would one of those be a safer bet, on an older (15-20 year old) truck?

On the dangers of a low-mileage vehicle: On a 2000s truck, I think of low mileage as 100,000 or less. Is that low enough to be wary, or are we talking 50,000?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 05, 2022, 10:41:13 PM
Only things I can think of for those years are the 6.0 piston slap problems and ABS modules on the 2500/3500 series.

6.0 engines from that era had an issue with cold-start piston slap, essentially the piston design allowing a cold piston just enough free play to cause a slight knock at start up. If the performance environment was one of starting, driving short distances, shutting off the engine long enough to cool significantly, then starting again, this can lead to excessive piston scuffing. On the upside, reasonably priced reman long blocks are available from darn near everyone short of 7-11. Ditto performance upgrades, some of which are astonishingly cheap.

ABS modules are a known Achille's heel of early 2000's 2500/3500 series trucks. They live under the truck and are a common failure point, mostly leak-related. Cheap third-party replacements are available but should be avoided (Dorman, Cardone, etc). They are a waste of time an money. Factory modules, now revised and reliable, are expensive but will likely outlast the truck.

Plan on replacing the fade-prone headlight assemblies. They can be polished out but once they've begun oxidizing it's only a matter of time, the process will continue to accelerate regardless of how much UV protectant you slather on.

Otherwise the trucks are pretty decent. Relatively easy to work on, parts are readily available, and the ride and performance are good.

Brad,

If I buy a GM, it's likely to be one of the 1500s from the 2000s. How much of the above (and your other musings) would you think apply to those?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: zxcvbob on May 05, 2022, 10:56:58 PM
Brad,

If I buy a GM, it's likely to be one of the 1500s from the 2000s. How much of the above (and your other musings) would you think apply to those?

I had an '01 1500 2WD standard cab.  4.8L V8, automatic, towing package.  Not sure if it was a slightly slicked-up work truck, or a stripped-down LS or whatever Chevy calls it. You could barely hear the engine running at idle even with the hood up.  I never had a bit of trouble with it until the bottom rusted out from salted roads.  I would love to have a sunbelt truck just like it, same year.  I also liked the 2500's (not HD) from the same era but I don't remember what engines were available. (I'd want a small V8, or a big straight 6 which I'm pretty sure they didn't have)
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 06, 2022, 12:23:32 PM
Brad,

If I buy a GM, it's likely to be one of the 1500s from the 2000s. How much of the above (and your other musings) would you think apply to those?

Plan on headlight assemblies. No getting around the plastic hazing over time. It's just what they do. At this age they are probably oxidized so thoroughly that yellowing and hazing can no longer be polished out. Might as well plan on tail lights while you're at it. They're bad about it, too.

Everything else is a maybe. If the truck has been well-maintained and necessary repairs done in a timely and complete manner, you may be okay for a while.

Depending on age, miles, and use, transmissions are another thing to keep an eye on. I'm not very up to speed on Chevy transmission from that time but I think that was the 4L60/4L80 era. They are both good trannys but, as with all slushboxes, they need to have been serviced regularly and not abused. See if you can get records. If not, take a good look and sniff. If the fluid doesn't appear sparkly or smell burnt and the trans seems to shift okay, you're probably okay for a while. However, if it's had a recent service this method won't give you much info.

In the end it's a twenty year old vehicle. It's gonna have problems, it's just a matter of how many and what kind. Mostly it's a matter of how the truck has been cared for. If the owner had problems repaired promptly, was conscientious about maintenance, and proactively addressed any potential known problem areas, they are as decent a used truck as you can get. If something does fail, there are a billion of the things on the road and GM used that powertrain for a lot of years. Most issues are relatively inexpensive to address, used parts are dirt-common, and new parts are readily available. A decent set of tools, YouTube, and LMC Truck are your friends.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Bogie on May 06, 2022, 12:37:50 PM
We still sell the big sealed beam bulbs... which, being glass, don't turn dark yellow with time. My '95 van uses those.
 
The auto assemblers need to come up with a real Work Truck. No frills. As in bench seat and hole for radio and crank windows... Whatever color you want, as long as it is white...
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: RoadKingLarry on May 06, 2022, 07:10:21 PM
Mandatory truck thread post

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4841/31169611107_55b3a95811_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Pumps4)
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Bogie on May 06, 2022, 07:30:37 PM
You know what would be cool? A truck about the size of the old Dodge Dakotas, extended cab, 2WD, with a one-ton rear axle and 8' bed, with a four cylinder diesel...
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on May 06, 2022, 09:00:51 PM
You know what would be cool? A truck about the size of the old Dodge Dakotas, extended cab, 2WD, with a one-ton rear axle and 8' bed, with a four cylinder diesel...
A Toyota Land Cruiser pickup is close to that. Not 2WD, but pretty close. You can't have one though.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 12, 2022, 10:06:05 PM
It's starting to look like the V6, half-ton trucks might be the way to find a low-cost truck, that's not already worn out. Going to look at one or two of them on Saturday, if they're still there.

I don't expect to be towing much of anything, or hauling anything very heavy. Just have to find a V6 truck whose owner(s) didn't use like it was a one-ton w/ a 10-cylinder.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 13, 2022, 09:15:15 AM
Just have to find a V6 truck whose owner(s) didn't use like it was a one-ton w/ a 10-cylinder.

Or a Daytona 500 qualifying lap.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 19, 2022, 11:18:10 PM
Saturday, Lord willing, I'm picking up a 2006 F150 XL, in Belleville, IL. Went to see it last Saturday, and just had to get funding in place.

Has 152,000 miles, and only a little bit of rust. Mostly, it seems pretty solid. Has a V6, and manual everything. I've had terrible luck with power windows.

Really excited about it. I like that it's a manual transmission, and it's getting hard to find a standard cab and 8' bed these days. I like the extra space behind the seat, so it's an ext. cab, without really being an ext. cab. No need to have a toolbox in the bed.

Don't like that it has a skull shift knob. Had to look through the owner's manual just to figure out the shift pattern!  :facepalm:  :laugh: (Normal shift knob is on order.)

Red is not my favorite color, but whatever. Since it's ultra-MAGA hat red, I have named this truck The Donald.  =D
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 20, 2022, 10:31:30 AM
Okay, so an XL trim with the 4.2 V6. If it's relatively unmolested other than miles and general wear, probably a solid buy. Door sticker axle code will let you look up the axle ratio and whether or not it's limited-slip.

Manual trans was standard with the V6. If memory serves it was made by Mazda. Good transmissions, smooth and reliable, just not tolerant of abuse. Treat it right and you should be fine. I think the last year Ford offered a manual of any kind in the F150 was either 07 or 08 and it was only available with the V6.

If it were mine, I'd do a full fluids refresh, belts (including idlers and tensioner), hoses, and maybe even a round of sensors (O2, throttle position, and MAF). Also plugs and coil packs if they haven't been serviced already. Aside from that the 4.2 is pretty solid presuming it was properly serviced.

06 is within the model range where the instrument clusters can have an issue with solder joints. Causes oddities like the brake light staying on all the time, dimming readouts, blank odometer panel, etc. It's a known thing and usually an easy fix. CircuitBoardMedic does a flat-rate repair. My 07 suffered the problem and I had CBM do the repair. Removing the cluster is an easy driveway job. Turnaround was fast and it fixed everything. They also offer flat-rate repairs on the PCM and SJB assemblies if you have problems.

Instrument Cluster: https://circuitboardmedics.com/2004-2008-ford-f150-instrument-cluster-repair

PCM: https://circuitboardmedics.com/2004-2008-ford-f150-pcm-repair/

Smart Junction Box: https://circuitboardmedics.com/2004-2008-ford-f150-smart-junction-box-repair

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Ben on May 20, 2022, 10:38:35 AM
Good deal, Perd. I had a 2002 "stripped" regular cab longbed F150 with the 4.2 and manual. I never had an issue, except if IIRC, once with an emissions doodad that was a quick fix.

The setup can get a little doggy on steep grades, but otherwise was fine. You should check the cargo capacity. I forget exactly what mine was, but it was actually under 1/2 ton. I ended up selling it to my cousin, who to this day uses it as one of his farm trucks. I have no idea of the miles on it by now, but it's driven every day.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 20, 2022, 11:39:54 AM
You should check the cargo capacity. I forget exactly what mine was, but it was actually under 1/2 ton.

QFT. Not much fun trying to pick up a load of something only to discover your half-ton... isn't.

There will be a spring code on the same door sticker as the axle code. It'll tell you what spring package is in it. Sticker will also have GVWR.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 20, 2022, 12:08:40 PM
It has two open recall notices, one for an airbag, and the other for the instrument cluster. My understanding is, Ford dealerships are supposed to take care of those, and Ford pays for it, yes?

As far as the payload capacity, I'll check into it. I don't expect I'll need to haul anything that heavy.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 20, 2022, 12:24:21 PM
It has two open recall notices, one for an airbag, and the other for the instrument cluster. My understanding is, Ford dealerships are supposed to take care of those, and Ford pays for it, yes?

Maybe. IIRC there is an 8-year limitation on free-repair recalls. After that the owner foots the bill. That's an old memory so don't hang your hat on it. Check with your dealer to make sure. I can't remember if there is differentiation for safety-related recalls like an airbag.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 20, 2022, 12:32:04 PM
According to Ford's recall FAQ:

Quote
Are recalls free?

Yes, absolutely. Any repairs required due to a recall from Ford Motor Company will be conducted at no cost to you.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 20, 2022, 12:38:05 PM
Excellent!

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Declaration Day on May 20, 2022, 12:42:48 PM
You can buy an air suspension lift kit to increase the load and towing capacity of a 1/2 ton pickup.  They range between $300 and $500 generally, and can be installed in a couple of hours with a socket / ratchet set by anybody with basic mechanical skills.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Ben on May 20, 2022, 01:36:52 PM
Oh - the other good thing about that truck/engine is having pretty luxurious workspace under the hood for basic maintenance stuff.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 20, 2022, 01:43:36 PM
Oh - the other good thing about that truck/engine is having pretty luxurious workspace under the hood for basic maintenance stuff.

I'll have room for the cappuccino machine and my reloading press!
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: zxcvbob on May 20, 2022, 02:04:22 PM
You can buy an air suspension lift kit to increase the load and towing capacity of a 1/2 ton pickup.  They range between $300 and $500 generally, and can be installed in a couple of hours with a socket / ratchet set by anybody with basic mechanical skills.

The limiting factor on that truck is probably not the springs.  Pretty sure it's the transmission or the clutch, then they will match the tires to the lower GWVR.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on May 20, 2022, 03:11:44 PM
I had that Mazda M5R2 5 speed in my 95 F150.  It's not a bad transmission, but it doesn't handle overloading well.  Not the truck, so much, but towing over the limit seems to break them.

FWIW I didn't have any trouble at all with mine, although if you put a new clutch in it, bleeding the slave cylinder is a right PITA.

That truck should be pretty good for you.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 20, 2022, 03:44:32 PM
Also, Ford engines of that era are notoriously sensitive to carbon buildup in the throttle body. It can cause all kinds of idle and throttle tip-in strangeness. Easy fix. A few minutes with a rag, small brush, and some throttle body cleaner are all it takes.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: dogmush on May 20, 2022, 08:16:38 PM
Strictly speaking, not the throttle  body, but the idle air control valve.

You can clean them out, but they will gum up again. If you are getting low or surging idle, it's better to just replace the IAC. It's like $50 and two 8mm bolts.

The issues stems from sticky build up from the crankcase vent8being recirculated into the intake.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 20, 2022, 08:23:23 PM
Strictly speaking, not the throttle  body, but the idle air control valve.

You can clean them out, but they will gum up again. If you are getting low or surging idle, it's better to just replace the IAC. It's like $50 and two 8mm bolts.

The issues stems from sticky build up from the crankcase vent8being recirculated into the intake.

Are you talking about an improved IAC that doesn't repeat the problem, or does the new unit just take longer to gum up than an old unit that's been cleaned?
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 20, 2022, 10:08:06 PM
Are you talking about an improved IAC that doesn't repeat the problem, or does the new unit just take longer to gum up than an old unit that's been cleaned?

It's a twofer. Dogmush is spot on about the IAC. Not an improved unit, per se, just one that's clean and new. Between that and cleaning carbon buildhp in the throttle body throat, especially where the blade is, you can cure a whole host of ills.

Brad

Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 20, 2022, 10:27:29 PM
Thanks for the advice, y'all.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Lennyjoe on May 21, 2022, 02:20:49 AM
Broken exhaust manifold bolt on LS engines are a known problem. There are a couple of tricks for getting them out with minimal swearing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIdRuc4ZbNs


My 2500 HD with a 6.0 L engine is losing its exhaust manifold bolts and Iím using the Dorman flanges to keep the manifold leaks down.  Ticking was driving me crazy and I was about to tear I to it u til if ound the $28 fix on Amazon.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 21, 2022, 09:03:54 AM
Thanks for the advice, y'all.

Last bit of advice... don't use second-rate aftermarket parts like Dorman, Cardone, and BWD. They're almost universally pieces of crap. Go for at least a mid-tier line like NAPA Gold or the premium aftermarket manufacturers. If possible, use factory parts.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 21, 2022, 09:12:30 AM
Last bit of advice... don't use second-rate aftermarket parts like Dorman, Cardone, and BWD. They're almost universally pieces of crap. Go for at least a mid-tier line like NAPA Gold or the premium aftermarket manufacturers. If possible, use factory parts.

Brad

I promise to use only Duck brand duck tape and name brand bailing wire.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Lennyjoe on May 21, 2022, 09:13:22 AM
This is what I had to use as a temp fix to stop manifold leaks. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00GHT9L4O?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_9RGQSSW8X3YHCGZX9PFE
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Brad Johnson on May 21, 2022, 09:14:43 AM
I promise to use only Duck brand duck tape and name brand bailing wire.

You have learned well, young padawan.

Brad
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 21, 2022, 01:03:14 PM
Just got back from Illinois. The truck is from eastern Missouri, anyhow, so a bit of a homecoming for him.

Constant rain today, which is making the pedals extremely slippery. And I am still very rusty on the whole manual transmission thing.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Ben on May 21, 2022, 01:26:50 PM
Just keep it in 2nd gear and you won't have to shift!   =D
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: zxcvbob on May 21, 2022, 01:46:09 PM
Just got back from Illinois.

Locked the front door. Oh, boy!
Got to sit down, take a rest on the porch...  ♫   :laugh:

Anyway, I checked with the county compost site to see how much the stuff costs now; they used to give it away for free.  $20 a pickup load, which isn't bad.  I bought a used long-bed 3/4 ton last year.  We probably had one of these threads about it.  It should hold over 2 cubic yards and I only want about 1 or 1.5.  They will load it for $15 but only if your truck is at least 10000# GVWR.  I can't remember whether mine is 9500 or 9700.  :facepalm:  I called and asked if that was good enough if I signed a waiver.  Of course it's not.  I used to haul heavier stuff than that in a 7600 GVWR truck (and ruined a pretty beefy 9.50x16.5LT radial tire once when a load of mushroom mulch was soaking wet and it was loaded unevenly), that's when I switched to Load Range D to E and never had a problem again.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: Perd Hapley on May 21, 2022, 02:24:31 PM
I went fishing around the exterior of the truck, looking for a good spot to put a magnetic key box, and what do you think I found?  =D Had a good, old-fashioned flat key inside, too.

Just hours after getting it home, we have hail.  =D  You can't make this stuff up.

Don't think it hurt anything, though.
Title: Re: 'nother truck thread
Post by: zxcvbob on May 25, 2022, 12:32:37 PM
I finally used the truck I bought last year as a truck.  (after filling it up with $104 worth of gas. Ouch)  I bought a pallet of concrete blocks.  I thought it was about 2500# but it was just a few pounds shy of 3000.  The truck really squatted down on the springs when the forklift guy set it way in the back, half in the bed and half on the tailgate.  I thought the front tires might come up.  The back tires looked good.  When he pushed it forward just enough to get it all in the bed (still loaded towards the back) it was fine.  The truck even drove well like that; enough acceleration, the steering wasn't squirrelly, and the brakes were good.

Next time I buy a pallet of something heavy I'll take the tailgate off to get it out of the way.

Now it's raining, so too muddy to use a dolly or wheelbarrow to move them, I'll have to carry them one at a time to the backyard, and that's a pretty long way.  (I'm too much a wimp now to carry them 2 at a time like I coulda done 15 years ago)