Arrested for feeding homeless people

[zxcvbob]

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2011-06-02/news/os-homeless-feedings-arrests-20110601_1_group-feedings-feedings-in-public-parks-orlando-police

Members of Orlando Food Not Bombs were arrested Wednesday when police said they violated a city ordinance by feeding the homeless in Lake Eola Park. Jessica Cross, 24, Benjamin Markeson, 49, and Jonathan "Keith" McHenry, 54, were arrested at 6:10 p.m. on a charge of violating the ordinance restricting group feedings in public parks. McHenry is a co-founder of the international Food Not Bombs movement, which began in the early 1980s. The group lost a court battle in April, clearing the way for the city to enforce the ordinance.

I'll have to look up the court case that they lost to see how the judge decided this did not violate their 1st Amendment freedom of assembly.  Looks like a case tailor-made for the ACLU. 

[longeyes]

It's a short jump from squirrels to homeless in some minds...

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

i generally am supportive of this kinda aid but have seen firsthand why it needs to be done wisely.  unless your desire is to create a homeless encampment that makes the park a no go zone for everyone else

[dogmush]

My understanding is that the courts have long upheld that requiring some kind of permit for an assembly doesn't violate the First Ammendment.

I would imagine that the ordinance "restricting" the feeding puts some sort of permitting burden on the feeding that the group could not/did not meet.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

in the cases of conflict i've seen its been the folks feeding think "we don't need no stinking permits!" and its part and parcel of their image/identity. on the other side the folks being fed can be problematic and will set up camp close to a food source. they are often not fun to live near. the local salvation army had conflicts when they set up a feeding program in a residential area.  guys would hang around between meals  they solved it by serving lunch at one locale and dinner at another

[zxcvbob]

My understanding is that the courts have long upheld that requiring some kind of permit for an assembly doesn't violate the First Ammendment.

I would imagine that the ordinance "restricting" the feeding puts some sort of permitting burden on the feeding that the group could not/did not meet.

The city has said it will only issue them 2 permits per year.  (or maybe it was 2 every 6 months, I don't remember the exact detail)

[seeker_two]

Sounds more like they were arrested for disrespecting the authority of the cops and the city council....the "illegal feeding" charges are just for the paperwork....

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

sounds like they don't want them feeding the homeless there.  my experiences are shaded by seeing the nonsense the ccnv pulled in dc and its impact on life in the city

[dogmush]

Sounds more like they were arrested for disrespecting the authority of the cops and the city council....the "illegal feeding" charges are just for the paperwork....

Or, alternativly:

The citizens (owners of the park) have professed through their duely elected representitives a desire to limit the number of days per year that there are large groups of homeless people in the park.  The self-rightous feeders have decided that they don't care and will do as they please.  And got arrested for it.

It seems to me that figuring out and enforcing the citizens desires vis-a-vis city park usage is an appropriate use of city government.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

statist!

homeless activists are "interesting"

[zxcvbob]

Or, alternativly:

The citizens (owners of the park) have professed through their duely elected representitives a desire to limit the number of days per year that there are large groups of homeless people in the park.  The self-rightous feeders have decided that they don't care and will do as they please.  And got arrested for it.

It seems to me that figuring out and enforcing the citizens desires vis-a-vis city park usage is an appropriate use of city government.

"The park would be a whole lot nicer without all those black people.  Make them go away..."  (cue the storm troopers)

With a stupid name like "Food Not Bombs", it's hard be sympathetic, but 2 meals a week hardly seems like they are taking over the park.

[dogmush]

"The park would be a whole lot nicer without all those black people.  Make them go away..."  (cue the storm troopers)

With a stupid name like "Food Not Bombs", it's hard be sympathetic, but 2 meals a week hardly seems like they are taking over the park.

"The park would be a whole lot nicer without all those strawmen. Make them go away..."

 

Not purposfully attracting homeless people to a recreation site =/= carting away black people.

Let's not be naive here, there are valid, non-naziesque, non police state reasons that a city government might go this route.  It's no different from ordinances dis-allowing people sleeping in city parks. That doesn't make the city the fourth reich, and it doesn't mean homeless are sub-human.  It just means that we don't want a bunch of homeless folks in the park.

[zxcvbob]

Whenever I've helped feed homeless ppl, we did it in the basement of a big downtown church.  The homeless didn't have so far to walk, and we had access to a proper kitchen.  'Course it doesn't make as loud a political statement...

[dogmush]

Me too.

Every time I've volunteered it was either in a church, or some kind of dedicated soup kitchen.  It gave the folks not only something to eat, but a place to eat it and a place to put the trash.  Non of the places I volunteered at ever had a problem with their respective cities either.

I think (non governmental) charity to feed the homeless is a great thing.  But I wouldn't want it doen in a city park in my city either.

[gunsmith]

Jonathan "Keith" McHenry once cornered me in San Francisco, you see as a bicycle messenger we carried the same kind of radios cops did ( circa 89/90 ) for no reason at all he started calling me "pig" & a bunch of other epithets,(thinking I was LE!) the guy is always spoiling for a fight, I am willing to bet a respectable group that did everything above board could feed the homeless every day of the week.

I once had a girl friend in "food not bombs" ( I used to be a punk rocker ) & first hand saw the facilities they were using at the time to feed people, they were not professional at all, no idea about hygiene WRT feeding large groups, & would "dumpsterdive" food too.

So, while it makes great press ( oh those repressive cops/gov't!!11 ) the facts are clear, they like to make trouble and they might accidentally poison somebody

[MicroBalrog]

I once had a girl friend in "food not bombs" ( I used to be a punk rocker ) & first hand saw the facilities they were using at the time to feed people, they were not professional at all, no idea about hygiene WRT feeding large groups, & would "dumpsterdive" food too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freegan

[MechAg94]

I was thinking I heard of a local outfit that was told not to feed the homeless due to lack of a permit.  I believe it was a permit to sell or make food that had to do with health inspections and all that.  I guess you might say that beggars can't be choosers, but setting some standard is likely not a bad idea.

[zxcvbob]

It's hard to find a good guy in this story.  I still think someone's 1st Amendment rights were violated -- not sure if it's the homeless or the Freegans (probably both.)

[roo_ster]

It's hard to find a good guy in this story.  I still think someone's 1st Amendment rights were violated -- not sure if it's the homeless or the Freegans (probably both.)

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble and serve roo_ster yummy Dickies BBQ(1), and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.





(1) Sims BBQ when in Little Rock.

[dogmush]

It's hard to find a good guy in this story.  I still think someone's 1st Amendment rights were violated -- not sure if it's the homeless or the Freegans (probably both.)

I still disagree. The right to peaceably assemble does not mean you can do whatever you want, wherever you want.

Controling the use of public parks is an appropriate role for city governments.

[brimic]

It sounds more like a public health issue if these people were doling out food of questionable origin.

Food scraps from dumpsters contaminated with rodent/insect diseases/waste fed to hungry people is just begging for a serious disease outbreak.

[seeker_two]

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble and serve roo_ster yummy Dickies BBQ(1), and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The Founding Fathers had low standards when it comes to BBQ....

[Azrael256]

It sounds more like a public health issue if these people were doling out food of questionable origin.

Aren't we the ones who are always saying that people should be charged with a crime if they commit one and not for some manufactured precursor to maybe committing one?

Did they serve refuse as food or not?  Negligently poisoning someone is not the same thing as trespassing.

[roo_ster]

The Founding Fathers had low standards when it comes to BBQ....

Name better BBQ in N Dallas up through Allen Plano area.  Not oriental BBQ, but something with roots from Texas to the Carolinas.  I will give it a try, I promise.  If you are temped to reply, "Spring Creek BBQ," slap yourself for a silly fool.

Two Podners across the street from Fair Park is very respectable, but a long ways away.

Used to go to Vern's Place after church before she retired(1), but it is in Deep Ellum.

In Little Rock, Sims BBQ is unbeatable.



(1) I wept, bitterly.

[seeker_two]

Name better BBQ in N Dallas up through Allen Plano area.

For a chain BBQ, you can start and finish here.... http://www.coltersbbq.com/locations/locations.htm ....and it's worth the drive.....

The best BBQ comes from the mom-&-pop joints off the main roads....takes a spirit of adventure to find the good ones......