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Author Topic: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much  (Read 625 times)

MillCreek

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https://www.patientcareonline.com/atrial-fibrillation/arrive-ascend-and-future-aspirin

I have been taking 81 mg. aspirin every day for the past twenty years, based upon the medical literature recommending it for people with some risk of cardiovascular disease.  I have two risk factors: high lipids and a first-degree relative (father) with a coronary bypass graft.  The lipids have been well controlled since 1990, when they were first diagnosed.  Again based upon the medical literature, I have at various times taken fish oil and Vitamin E, but have discontinued that as more recent medical literature has shown they are not helpful and may even be harmful in some cases.

So now the very latest literature is showing that aspirin may not be all that helpful either at least for primary prevention of cardiovascular events.  Something to discuss with my internist at the annual visit this coming fall.
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MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

K Frame

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2019, 12:51:33 PM »

I take a daily aspirin primarily because of Leiden Factor V and its propensity toward causing DVTs.



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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2019, 04:40:12 PM »

*shrug* Dad's been taking aspirin forever (high blood pressure) and we now know he's had at least one silent heart attack, but considering his risk level I'm pretty sure that taking a whole bottle of baby aspirin a day for his entire life wouldn't have prevented it from happening eventually.
"Okay, um, I'm lost. Uh, I'm angry, and I'm armed, so if you two have something that you need to work out --" -Malcolm Reynolds

MillCreek

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2021, 12:36:50 PM »

_____________
Regards,
MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

K Frame

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2021, 12:43:30 PM »

double tap

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K Frame

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2021, 12:44:50 PM »

I continue, with my doctor's blessing, to take a full 325 mg aspirin every day as a less aggressive means of dealing with Factor V Leiden.

But, to everyone who says follow the science...

THE SCIENCE SAID THAT TAKING ASPIRIN EVERY DAY WAS THE WAY TO GO??!!?? WHAT HAPPENED? IS THE SCIENCE NOW NOT SETTLED????

I'm so disillusioned...  :O
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

Hawkmoon

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2021, 01:05:59 PM »

Of course the science is settled. It's just re-settling.

T.O.M.

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2021, 08:03:11 PM »

My doc and I discussed it.  He looked at my health, my family history, and recommended against an aspirin regimen.  He believed the risk of gastrointestinal issues was greater than the benefits from the aspirin.
No, I'm not mtnbkr.  ;)

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230RN

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2021, 07:43:00 AM »

Who commissioned the study?

And it's preliminary.

And IIRC, it only goes up to age 60-ish.  I'm past that by more than two decades so there goes  your standardization criteria.

I've been taking doses of aspirin on and off for +30ish years for arthritis.  Recent events indicated I needed a blood thinner and I've been resisting my Dr's. suggestions to go to Rx blood thinners and have therefore now been taking 1/4 regular aspirin daily.

I figure anything you have to monitor with clinical blood draws had to be a little dangerous, no? Whereas I know exactly how much aspirin I can take without nosebleeds, bloodshot eyes, visual "floaters," and affecting my mental processes.  Plus, a large bottle of regular aspirin and a pill cutter is parsimonious cheap.

And if I went to Rx-thinners, what would I take for arthritis... a blood thinner (aspirin) on top of an Rx blood thinner?

I don't just gulp down 1/4 aspirin, I take it with food and make sure it's chomped up a lot by chewing with that food. (Two or three crackers if nothing else.)  I figure that way, instead of hitting tummy walls like a thunderstorm, it spreads itself out like a gentle spring rain.

Anyhow, I remember that Dr.s are as subject to fads and fashion as anyone.

Mary Cooper (Sheldon's mother): "Oh what do they know, one week lard is no good for you, the next week you can't get enough of it."

The below is perhaps a little out of date... I notice another Rx-thinner has been advertised lately.  (Pardon the line-wrap problem from the original):

"
------------------------------------------
https://naturalbloodthinners.org/blood-thinner-medications-list/

 1.Aspirin: Many people are familiar with the daily dose of aspirin
 that is commonly recommended by health care professionals in order to
 prevent platelets from clumping together and forming clots. Although
 there is an almost never ending flow of new blood thinner medications
 emerging on the market, aspirin remains a commonly used preventative
 tool.
 2.Warfarin (Coumadin): Coumadin is one of the most well known
 medications used to thin the blood. It is an anti coagulant that is
 also used in some cases to prevent heart disease.
 3.Pradaxa: Pradaxa is a newer medication that is used primarily in
 people who have an arterial fibrillation. It is geared towards
 preventing blood clots and strokes.
 4.Elequis: Lowering the risk of both blood clots and strokes is
 essentially the purpose of Elequis, a relatively new drug that is
 thought to be a competitor to the side effect laden Coumadin.
 5.Xarelto: Especially useful in recipients of hip replacements and
 knee replacements, Xarelto is a newcomer amongst blood thinner
 medications. It is also been approved for use in cases of DVT as well
 as pulmonary embolisms.
 6.Plavix (Clopidogrel): Plavix works by preventing coagulation of the
 platelets in the blood. It is especially suited for people who have
 certain medical conditions and heart conditions. It is also used as a
 preventative tool against the formation of clots in persons who have
 had a heart attack or stroke.
 7.Prasugrel: In people who have been treated with angioplasty,
 Prasugrel may be used in conjunction with aspirin to prevent the
 formation of clots. Like aspirin, Prasugrel is an anti-platelet
 medication.
 8.Brilinta: Brilinta is typically prescribed following a heart attack
 and can be used in conjunction with aspirin. It has been proven
 effective at reducing the chance of recurring heart attacks in people
 who have had them before and the medication is thought to further
 reduce the risk of recurrent heart attacks with continued use.
 9.Cilostazol: Cilostazol is used to improve the flow of blood to the
 legs and can help assist with reducing the symptoms of intermittent
 claudication. Like some of the other blood thinner medications on our
 top ten list, Cilostazol is an antiplatelet medication, whereby it is
 used to prevent the platelets in the blood from clumping together.
 10.Aggrenox: Aggrenox is essentially a prescription super aspirin. It
 is a combination of two medicines, aspirin and dipyridamole. In people
 who have had blood clots, the medication can help to reduce the risk
 of stroke and the drug is also used in persons who have had mini
 strokes as well.

 Seek immediate medical help if you have any of the following:
•Severe bleeding, including heavier than normal menstrual bleeding
•Red or brown urine
•Black or bloody stool
•Severe headache or stomach pain
•Joint pain, discomfort or swelling, especially after an injury
•Vomiting of blood or material that looks like coffee grounds
•Coughing up blood
•Bruising that develops without an injury you remember
•Dizziness or weakness
•Vision changes
•Head injury, even if you're not bleeding .

 Rarely, warfarin can cause the death of skin tissue (necrosis). This
 complication occurs within a few days of starting warfarin treatment.
 Seek immediate medical care if you notice any sores, changes in skin
 color or temperature, or severe pain on your skin.

 Talk to your doctor about these less serious side effects:
•Bleeding from the gums after you brush your teeth
•Bleeding between menstrual periods.
----------------------------------------------
"
Terry, 230RN
Edited to remove accidental use of a real person's name.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2021, 02:03:17 PM by 230RN »

MillCreek

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_____________
Regards,
MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

Bogie

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2021, 10:11:52 PM »

Actually, you don't need to worry all that much about it hitting the tummy...
 
Two pain enzymes...
 
Cyclooxygenase I and II...
 
Cox-I is the one that messes with stuff like platelet aggregation and protection of the linings of the guts...
 
Cox-II works more with pain.
 
Blog under construction

Ron

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2021, 11:27:11 PM »

https://journals.lww.com/anesthesia-analgesia/fulltext/2021/04000/aspirin_use_is_associated_with_decreased.2.aspx

Quote
Aspirin Use Is Associated With Decreased Mechanical Ventilation, Intensive Care Unit Admission, and In-Hospital Mortality in Hospitalized Patients With Coronavirus Disease 2019
The wish not to believe can influence as strongly as the wish to believe.

Who can escape their own cognitive biases?

230RN

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2021, 11:29:24 AM »

With the this-a and the that-a and the maybes and the yeahbuts, and the moon phases, I keep in mind that:

1.  Medicine is a profit-making industry largely controlled by big pharma and insurance companies.

2.  Aspirin is cheap.

3.  Rx thinners are expensive.

4.  Rx thinners are dangerous enough that they need constant blood-draw monitoring to keep you from dying because of too much or too little.

5.  I know,after decades of taking aspirin for arthritis, exactly how much I can handle without nosebleeds, ringing in my ears, "floaters" in my eyes, and diminishing my mental integration capacity.

I therefore will stick with what I know, i.e., aspirin,  until all the "maybes" are settled --because the "science" sure as hell isn't.

MillCreek

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Regards,
MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

cordex

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Re: Taking aspirin to prevent that first heart attack: maybe not so much
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2021, 03:57:42 PM »

The story behind medical flip flops:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/22/well/live/aspirin-heart-attack-stroke.html
Interesting article.  Thanks.

My major issue with the reversals is the utter lack of humility with which medical advice (and then later the opposite advice) is typically given.  Yes, "following evolving science" is ultimately a good thing, but it's good to remember that the Expert who is confidently telling you that The Science says to Do This was equally confident a week ago that The Science says to Do That Instead.  They may have been right one of the times, but the person they are giving their advice to can't tell when that is, and the Expert has no shame that they have been giving bad advice for however long they've been doing so.

230RN

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So if last year's studies were misinterpeted or flawed somehow, why can't this year's opposite interpretation or correction also be flawed somehow?

Ohhhh, now I get it. It's the "evolution of science."

But of course.  I should have known.

The controversy is not due to the fact that Pharma makes oodles of money off Rx thinners and almost nothing off aspirin at all, and without an MD's scrip to boot, as I so crassly thought.

Silly me.

       
« Last Edit: Today at 05:56:26 AM by 230RN »