Author Topic: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control  (Read 61098 times)

Ben

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #450 on: June 01, 2022, 10:16:20 AM »
Very little of this Federal stuff has been hitting the MSM. They seem to be focusing on covering legislation in places like New York, where it appears that among other things, a body armor ban is "a sure thing".

Whether anything passes or not, once this hits the MSM, I suspect a lot of prices are going through the roof. I don't necessarily need more right now, but I just order more 5.56 and .300BLK mags while the prices are still normal. If they sit in the gun closet for ten years, that's fine.

I might even order some Level IV plates. Just because.
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WLJ

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #451 on: June 01, 2022, 10:19:47 AM »
Very little of this Federal stuff has been hitting the MSM. They seem to be focusing on covering legislation in places like New York, where it appears

Almost as if they don't want you to know what your betters are doing for your own good in congress.  [tinfoil]
« Last Edit: June 01, 2022, 10:33:39 AM by WLJ »
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MechAg94

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #452 on: June 01, 2022, 10:42:12 AM »
GOA has been sending legislative action alerts.  Yesterday was a link to contact my Senators.  I assume trying to head off attempts at compromise.  I am sure there are better ways to wipe out the Republicans advantage this Fall, but not many.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Pb

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #453 on: June 01, 2022, 11:25:59 AM »
Do you all think we are getting another ammo buying freak out again?   :mad:

Brad Johnson

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #454 on: June 01, 2022, 11:29:43 AM »
Do you all think we are getting another ammo buying freak out again?   :mad:

Yep.

Brad
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Ben

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #455 on: June 01, 2022, 12:05:46 PM »
I haven't seen any federal legislation regarding ammo. Did I miss it (quite possible)?

Surprising, actually, that they wouldn't try for some quantity caps, or like CA, eliminate mail order.
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WLJ

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #456 on: June 01, 2022, 01:39:51 PM »
National red flag bill is being pushed

 BREAKING: Senators WAY TOO CLOSE On National Red Flag Bill
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idw8OMmjIhY

Think it's this one.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/2377/text

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Ben

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #457 on: June 01, 2022, 01:50:55 PM »
I'm going to predict right now that Rs will cave on minimum age of 21 and red flag laws as "reasonable compromises". I don't like either, but dislike the red flag laws the most. Very dangerous.
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sumpnz

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #458 on: June 01, 2022, 06:33:48 PM »
I'm going to predict right now that Rs will cave on minimum age of 21 and red flag laws as "reasonable compromises". I don't like either, but dislike the red flag laws the most. Very dangerous.

The basic idea of a red flag law is good.  If someone you know well is behaving in a way that a reasonable person would think is a significant risk to themselves or others then having a means to intervene before tragedy strikes is great.  But, like so many times, a good idea quickly get corrupted and at best it becomes a useless law, and at worst gives political enemies a means to cripple the opposition. 

I think to tame that abuse potential there should be some mechanism to hold accountable those that abuse red flag laws.  In theory my sister (a very anti-gun lefty) could call in an ERPO on me even though we barely talk to each other every couple of years.  If she wanted the upper hand in, say, division of our parent’s estate after they pass and she used an erpo to get that I should be able to take her to the cleaners in a lawsuit.  And/or she should become subject to whatever term in prison I faced. 

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #459 on: June 01, 2022, 09:08:16 PM »
Show me actual due process before confiscating any property and VERY severe penalties (huge fines and felony level jail time) for false/malicious reports and I'll start listening.
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Pb

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #460 on: June 01, 2022, 09:43:05 PM »
The basic idea of a red flag law is good.

I disagree.  The basic idea is that the government can strip you of your rights based on an accusation.  In modern history, gun rights have always been treated as a fake right.  That should change.

Ben

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WLJ

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #462 on: June 03, 2022, 02:02:04 PM »
 [popcorn]

Quote
    We need to:

    Ban assault weapons — and if we can’t, then we should raise the age to purchase them from 18 to 21.

    Ban high-capacity magazines.

    Strengthen background checks.

    Enact safe storage laws and red flag laws.

    Repeal gun manufacturers’ immunity from liability.

    — President Biden (@POTUS) June 2, 2022
Quote
    Your crackhead son lied on a federal background check form so he could illegally buy a gun.

    I don’t want to hear a word from you on gun laws until your deadbeat, crackhead, porn-addled gun criminal son Hunter is behind bars. https://t.co/gLHuQokKGS

    — Sean Davis (@seanmdav) June 3, 2022

https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2022/06/03/your-crackhead-son-lied-so-he-could-illegally-buy-a-gun-sean-davis-just-annihilates-biden-for-tweet-pushing-new-gun-laws/
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
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Pb

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #463 on: June 03, 2022, 02:07:32 PM »
Americans have a right to own weapons of war.  That is exactly why the Second was written.  Every court case regarding that addressed what weapons we have a right to own from the beginning of the country to US versus Miller made it clear that weapons that are part of the ordinary military equipment are protected.  Most of these cases involved state RKBA provisions.

I even recall a court case from Texas that specified cannons as protected weapons.

This is an actual fact of history, not my opinion.

An exhaustive treatment of RKBA in the 18th century can be found here:

https://davekopel.org/2A/LawRev/19thcentury.htm#III.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2022, 02:25:27 PM by Pb »

MechAg94

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #464 on: June 03, 2022, 02:20:53 PM »
The basic idea of a red flag law is good.  If someone you know well is behaving in a way that a reasonable person would think is a significant risk to themselves or others then having a means to intervene before tragedy strikes is great.  But, like so many times, a good idea quickly get corrupted and at best it becomes a useless law, and at worst gives political enemies a means to cripple the opposition. 

I think to tame that abuse potential there should be some mechanism to hold accountable those that abuse red flag laws.  In theory my sister (a very anti-gun lefty) could call in an ERPO on me even though we barely talk to each other every couple of years.  If she wanted the upper hand in, say, division of our parent’s estate after they pass and she used an erpo to get that I should be able to take her to the cleaners in a lawsuit.  And/or she should become subject to whatever term in prison I faced.
I agree with the responses. 

The idea that someone can get help or intervention doesn't seem like a bad thing, but it should be done by friends or close relatives if at all.  Using the law enforcement system to do that is never going to work and will always be overbearing and oppressive. 

Look at the older guy who was killed by police when he decided he didn't want to let them in?  No matter how many protections are put in place, stuff like that could still happen.  Even if you could be informed of a red flag hearing and attend to defend yourself, is that really something that should happen in a free country?  If you have done nothing criminal, you should be left alone.  Also, I have come across plenty of people who are excitable or don't communicate the best and would have difficulty defending themselves if cops came around to question them or a judge started grilling them.  They shouldn't have to go through that just because some well meaning person (or not well meaning) reported them. 

It wasn't that long ago we discussed an event in Georgia where a father was shot through an outside window by a cop who was lurking around the house and got the dogs barking.  The daughter's ex-husband's mother called in a false report after which the police decided to search around the house and peak through windows instead of knocking.  Anytime the police get involved, there are going to a percentage of bad incidents. 
« Last Edit: June 03, 2022, 06:09:40 PM by MechAg94 »
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Pb

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #465 on: June 03, 2022, 02:24:33 PM »
Yeah.

It seems that the easiest way to get an unruly family member killed is to call the police to "help" them.

Angel Eyes

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #466 on: June 03, 2022, 02:33:08 PM »
Some people have had enough.


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JTHunter

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #467 on: June 03, 2022, 02:35:20 PM »
Yesterday was a link to contact my Senators.

Considering that IL-ANNOY's senators are backing this garbage, contacting them is an exercise in futility.
“I have little patience with people who take the Bill of Rights for granted.  The Bill of Rights, contained in the first ten amendments to the Constitution, is every American’s guarantee of freedom.” - - President Harry S. Truman, “Years of Trial and Hope”

Perd Hapley

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MechAg94

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #469 on: June 03, 2022, 06:13:43 PM »
Considering that IL-ANNOY's senators are backing this garbage, contacting them is an exercise in futility.
The GOA contact forms just take a minute.  Yeah, your Reps might be rabidly anti-gun, OR they might be supporting it because a few more people asked them to.  IMO, they pay attention to the emails and calls even if it is just to tally up the numbers.  I wouldn't dismiss it too easily. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

JTHunter

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #470 on: June 04, 2022, 12:12:12 AM »
The GOA contact forms just take a minute.  Yeah, your Reps might be rabidly anti-gun, OR they might be supporting it because a few more people asked them to.  IMO, they pay attention to the emails and calls even if it is just to tally up the numbers.  I wouldn't dismiss it too easily.

Unfortunately, IL-ANNOY's senators are "Tricky Dicky" Durbin and Tammy Duckworth(less).  Durbin drank the Brady "Flavor-Aide" years ago.  [barf]
“I have little patience with people who take the Bill of Rights for granted.  The Bill of Rights, contained in the first ten amendments to the Constitution, is every American’s guarantee of freedom.” - - President Harry S. Truman, “Years of Trial and Hope”

sumpnz

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #471 on: June 04, 2022, 12:31:48 AM »
Unfortunately, IL-ANNOY's senators are "Tricky Dicky" Durbin and Tammy Duckworth(less).  Durbin drank the Brady "Flavor-Aide" years ago.  [barf]

They’re just as bad as my Senators (Murray, who is easily one of the stupidest senators in history, and Cantwell). 

Ben

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #472 on: June 04, 2022, 10:11:45 AM »
Quote
An increasingly mainstream message of gun maximalists is that the *reason* to be armed is so that you can use violence or the threat of it to get your way in the political sphere, basically:"People in government need to worry we'll pump their bodies full of lead if they cross us"

"Gun maximalists". Are they cousins to ultra MAGAs?

https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2022/06/04/msnbcs-chris-hayes-trips-over-the-founders-while-slamming-deranged-interpretation-of-the-2nd-amendment/
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Pb

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #473 on: June 04, 2022, 02:51:35 PM »
The idea that the Constitution was written to give the government a monopoly on violence 180 degrees opposite to what it actually says.  Of course the Second was written so regular joes could shoot agents of the state.  That is exactly who the Americans had been fighting for seven years!


Hawkmoon

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Re: Looks like Biden is Ready to Move on Gun Control
« Reply #474 on: June 04, 2022, 03:25:07 PM »
Show me actual due process before confiscating any property and VERY severe penalties (huge fines and felony level jail time) for false/malicious reports and I'll start listening.

Their argument is that being allowed to argue -- two weeks after the confiscation -- that you should get your guns back is sufficient due process.

I don't agree, but apparently state courts in some states that already have these laws have bought into that, hook, line, and sinker.
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