Armed Polite Society

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

R.I.P. Scout26

Author Topic: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America  (Read 244 times)

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34,970
Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« on: May 03, 2021, 01:21:45 PM »

Biden wants to use contractors to track "extremist chatter" by Americans online. Given their definition of "extremism", expect some new members to start signing up on APS I guess.

https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2021/05/03/but-you-know-trump-was-a-dictator-biden-admin-blasted-for-considering-the-tracking-of-extremist-chatter-by-americans-online/

Quote
The Department of Homeland Security is limited in how it can monitor citizens online without justification and is banned from activities like assuming false identities to gain access to private messaging apps used by extremist groups such as the Proud Boys or Oath Keepers.
Instead, federal authorities can only browse through unprotected information on social media sites like Twitter and Facebook and other open online platforms.
The plan being discussed inside DHS, according to multiple sources, would, in effect, allow the department to circumvent those limits. A source familiar with the effort said it is not about decrypting data but rather using outside entities who can legally access these private groups to gather large amounts of information that could help DHS identify key narratives as they emerge.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/03/politics/dhs-partner-private-firms-surveil-suspected-domestic-terrorists/index.html
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

WLJ

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,527
  • I am not a cat
Never Underestimate The Power Of The Stupid Side

MillCreek

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16,789
  • APS Risk Manager
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2021, 01:31:39 PM »

I would imagine that the NSA or other Federal agencies have been monitoring keywords in this forum and other groups for a long time.  I don't know about live people joining/listening/informing since that seems like quite an investment of FTEs to do that.  I would further suspect that to get around any domestic restrictions, various Federal agencies would ask their counterparts in foreign countries to do the monitoring and report back.  The 5/9/14 Eyes system.
_____________
Regards,
MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

Angel Eyes

  • Lying dog-faced pony soldier
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,538
  • You're not diggin'
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2021, 01:32:02 PM »

Perhaps Biden can use the same foreign intelligence services that Obama did.

"We have put together, I think, the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics."
                            - Joe Biden

"But even Dr. King’s assassination did not have the worldwide impact that George Floyd’s death did."
                            - also Joe Biden

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34,970
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2021, 01:41:42 PM »

I would imagine that the NSA or other Federal agencies have been monitoring keywords in this forum and other groups for a long time.  I don't know about live people joining/listening/informing since that seems like quite an investment of FTEs to do that.  I would further suspect that to get around any domestic restrictions, various Federal agencies would ask their counterparts in foreign countries to do the monitoring and report back.  The 5/9/14 Eyes system.

As the article mentions, it is theoretically illegal for the gov to set up false identities to participate in forums such as this without some documented cause and hoops to jump through. It certainly doesn't mean they haven't done it anyway.

Also, I doubt they'll need to hire contractors to start infiltrating groups they view as extremist. It's not like Biden is going to call up Tetratech or Battelle to bid out an infiltration contract. Biden's goons can "contract" with any of the left wing whacko organizations out there that have already been inflitrating as members of gun forums, patriot forums, etc. That way they get someone with the politics they want that are conducive to ratting out neighbors. Maybe antifa will put in a bid.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

WLJ

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,527
  • I am not a cat
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2021, 01:48:17 PM »


Also, I doubt they'll need to hire contractors to start infiltrating groups they view as extremist. It's not like Biden is going to call up Tetratech or Battelle to bid out an infiltration contract. Biden's goons can "contract" with any of the left wing whacko organizations out there that have already been inflitrating as members of gun forums, patriot forums, etc. That way they get someone with the politics they want that are conducive to ratting out neighbors. Maybe antifa will put in a bid.

Plenty of SJWs who already gleefully do this for free
Never Underestimate The Power Of The Stupid Side

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 11,015
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2021, 02:01:35 PM »

Sounds like a job for Jack Dorsey or Mark Zuckerberg.  Especially when you consider they are already doing much the same work on their respective platforms for the .gov.
“Don’t be so open-minded that your brains fall out.” - G.K. Chesterton

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

How many Democrats does it take to fix a problem?  No one knows because it's never happened.

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26,790
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2021, 02:42:06 PM »

https://babylonbee.com/news/biden-relocates-20000-national-guard-troops-to-inner-cities-to-snipe-menthol-cigarettes-out-of-peoples-mouths
Biden Relocates 20,000 National Guard Troops To Inner Cities To Snipe Menthol Cigarettes Out Of People’s Mouths

Quote
Soldiers will also be trained in advanced take-down techniques to subdue any menthol offenders. BLM and the ACLU have applauded the move and have welcomed increased enforcement of their cities as long as it's not done by the local police.

https://babylonbee.com/news/hunter-biden-relieved-after-learning-dad-only-cracking-down-on-menthol
Hunter Biden Relieved After Learning His Dad Only Cracking Down On Menthol

“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Ron

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,177
  • like a tree planted by rivers of water
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2021, 03:53:41 PM »

I thought the deep state had repurposed the Post Office for that task.
The wish not to believe can influence as strongly as the wish to believe.

Who can escape their own cognitive biases?

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,367
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2021, 03:56:25 PM »

Whoa!

Quote
The Department of Homeland Security is limited in how it can monitor citizens online without justification and is banned from activities like assuming false identities to gain access to private messaging apps used by extremist groups such as the Proud Boys or Oath Keepers.

So wishing to be faithful to an oath to support and defend the Constitution is now an "extremist" position? Has something about the Oath Keepers changed in recent years?

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,367
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2021, 03:58:00 PM »

Perhaps Biden can use the same foreign intelligence services that Obama did.

Or Hilary. There's a guy names Steele  who might be looking for a gig.

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 23,367
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2021, 04:01:25 PM »

I thought the deep state had repurposed the Post Office for that task.

I think that was an internal realignment of priorities. It's much easier and more fun to sit in front of a computer all day watching porn surfing for terrorists than it is go actually go out and track down people who commit mail fraud.

WLJ

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9,527
  • I am not a cat
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2021, 04:02:13 PM »

Don't forget weaponizing the IRS
Never Underestimate The Power Of The Stupid Side

Nick1911

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7,493
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2021, 05:57:52 PM »

It seems the federal government is trying very hard to create the enemy they need to justify.... their upcoming actions?

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 34,970
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2021, 06:07:01 PM »

It seems the federal government is trying very hard to create the enemy they need to justify.... their upcoming actions?

Seems like they'd like to create another Waco. Which, while I was typing this I decided to remind myself of the circumstances and found this ATF link to the incident:

https://www.atf.gov/our-history/remembering-waco

It was 1992, so different laws may have applied, but the ATF's own list of what they raided for showed nothing illegal:

Quote
136 firearms, including assault rifles and handguns
700+ magazines for those firearms
200,000+ rounds of ammunition
110 upper and lower receivers for AR15/M16 rifles
Grenade-launcher attachments for AR15/M16 rifles
400+ empty M31 rifle grenades, along with black powder and other explosive chemicals

Any of the groups (e.g., Three Percenters, Oath Keepers) that are being labeled as "white supremacist extremists" might have that much stuff at a weekend get together.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

Nick1911

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7,493
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2021, 06:19:11 PM »

Seems like they'd like to create another Waco. Which, while I was typing this I decided to remind myself of the circumstances and found this ATF link to the incident:

https://www.atf.gov/our-history/remembering-waco

It was 1992, so different laws may have applied, but the ATF's own list of what they raided for showed nothing illegal:

Quote
136 firearms, including assault rifles and handguns
700+ magazines for those firearms
200,000+ rounds of ammunition
110 upper and lower receivers for AR15/M16 rifles
Grenade-launcher attachments for AR15/M16 rifles
400+ empty M31 rifle grenades, along with black powder and other explosive chemicals

Any of the groups (e.g., Three Percenters, Oath Keepers) that are being labeled as "white supremacist extremists" might have that much stuff at a weekend get together.

That is interesting.  If anything, it really highlights that they were being careful to follow laws.  If not, why would the M31's not be assembled?  Why wouldn't they have improv grenades etc?  It suggests they wanted capability without actually breaking the law.

griz

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,509
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2021, 06:21:16 PM »

I never went to law school, but please explain this to me:  If it's illegal for the federal government to spy on citizens, entrap them, or track them by questionable means, how would it be legal for them to hire somebody to do it?
Sent from a stone age computer via an ordinary keyboard.

RoadKingLarry

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 18,850
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2021, 06:40:55 PM »

Any of the groups (e.g., Three Percenters, Oath Keepers) that are being labeled as "white supremacist extremists" might have that much stuff at a weekend get together.


That is interesting.  If anything, it really highlights that they were being careful to follow laws.  If not, why would the M31's not be assembled?  Why wouldn't they have improv grenades etc?  It suggests they wanted capability without actually breaking the law.

Don't forget that no outside agency/organization was ever allowed to see the weapons the ATF seized.


The long wall is against the mustache.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26,790
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2021, 09:12:12 PM »

I never went to law school, but please explain this to me:  If it's illegal for the federal government to spy on citizens, entrap them, or track them by questionable means, how would it be legal for them to hire somebody to do it?
It probably makes freedom of information act requests more difficult. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Pb

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2,619
Re: Tracking "Extremist Chatter" in America
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2021, 09:16:55 PM »

I never went to law school, but please explain this to me:  If it's illegal for the federal government to spy on citizens, entrap them, or track them by questionable means, how would it be legal for them to hire somebody to do it?

Shut up, the government explained.