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Author Topic: Afghanistan  (Read 9596 times)

Ben

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #50 on: August 15, 2021, 10:18:31 AM »

"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

WLJ

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #51 on: August 15, 2021, 10:35:53 AM »

Meanwhile the MSM spin machine has gone into plaid looking for ways to blame Trump 150%
“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.”
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WLJ

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #52 on: August 15, 2021, 10:43:23 AM »

Think it was Joy Reid that said a few days ago that conservatives are worse than the Taliban
“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.”
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French G.

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #53 on: August 15, 2021, 12:20:03 PM »

So much for the idea that the ANA will dig in and stop them before Kabul. 90 days huh? At this point I have to stop enjoying the train wreck and hope that we get our people out safely.
AKA Navy Joe   

I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #54 on: August 15, 2021, 12:47:46 PM »

Quote
hope that we get our people out safely.

What difference at this point does it make?
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

WLJ

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #55 on: August 15, 2021, 02:07:49 PM »

  The South Vietnamese fared pretty well until our kongress stopped funding their efforts.   

From Wiki

Quote
On 15 March 1973, Nixon implied the US would intervene again militarily if the North launched a full offensive, and Secretary of Defense James Schlesinger re-affirmed this position during his June 1973 confirmation hearings. Public and congressional reaction to Nixon's statement was unfavorable, prompting the U.S. Senate to pass the Case–Church Amendment to prohibit any intervention.[90]:670–2
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War

Guess who was sworn in as a Senator in 1973?

I need to see if I can find how he voted on that
“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.”
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WLJ

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #56 on: August 15, 2021, 02:11:16 PM »

“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.”
~George Carlin

AZRedhawk44

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #57 on: August 15, 2021, 03:50:39 PM »

The bottom line as I see it...
 
No insurgency against an occupying power is going to trust us from now on. First we did that in Vietnam... And a generation later, in the 'Stan.

2 generations later.

You forget about the Kurds, too, in Iraq.  That's the middle generation.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
--Lysander Spooner

I reject your authoritah!

dogmush

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #58 on: August 15, 2021, 04:16:18 PM »

And the Flag's down:
https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/15/politics/us-embassy-kabul-afghanistan/index.html

I think the plan to leave a consulate in country is being reconsidered now that the Afghan government is in Turkmenistan.

MechAg94

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #59 on: August 15, 2021, 04:50:02 PM »

Why wasn't the embassy evacuated while we still had troops there?  I guess they assumed the ANA would hold up for a few more days?
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #60 on: August 15, 2021, 04:51:00 PM »

2 generations later.

You forget about the Kurds, too, in Iraq.  That's the middle generation.
Is the solution to continue to occupy the country for another 20 years?  Better to not make empty promises in the first place or attempt using the military for nation building. 

This entire situation sucks, but I feel like the mistakes were made in 2002 and later as every successive President failed to stop mistake and get out. 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2021, 05:11:14 PM by MechAg94 »
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

HeroHog

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #61 on: August 15, 2021, 05:04:13 PM »

Check out this interesting take on it all: https://youtu.be/MPJzZY2iXgM
I might not last very long or be very effective but I'll be a real pain in the ass for a minute!
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dogmush

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #62 on: August 15, 2021, 05:26:47 PM »

Why wasn't the embassy evacuated while we still had troops there?  I guess they assumed the ANA would hold up for a few more days?

We still had troops there. We just added more last week so that we could guarantee holding Kabul airport in the face of any friskyness.

dogmush

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #64 on: August 15, 2021, 06:30:08 PM »

Could be worse, we aren't  pulling people off roofs in Hueys and out to an aircraft carrier offshore.

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #65 on: August 15, 2021, 06:47:30 PM »

Yet...
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

Angel Eyes

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #66 on: August 15, 2021, 06:58:56 PM »

Could be worse, we aren't  pulling people off roofs in Hueys and out to an aircraft carrier offshore.

No, we're using Chinooks and Blackhawks

https://youtu.be/aKPZ0Ldn9Bw


Top: Saigon 1975
Bottom: Kabul 2021



[ETA: the Chinook sure has had a long service life]

"Tastes kind-of like cherry cough syrup and swimming-pool water, with a hint of puke."
                   - Paul Harrell describes Red Bull

Hawkmoon

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #67 on: August 15, 2021, 07:20:55 PM »

Check out this interesting take on it all: https://youtu.be/MPJzZY2iXgM

Made very little sense, IMHO. I think Dogmush was far closer to the mark.

We saw the same thing in Vietnam. Most of the Vietnamese people were not especially interested in who ran the government. All they wanted was to be allowed to continue their subsistence existence, preferably without the U.S. and China engaging in a proxy war on their turf.

WLJ

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #68 on: August 15, 2021, 07:33:55 PM »

Not the Babylon Bee

Quote
    The President is to be commended for the clarity of purpose of his statement on Afghanistan and his action. The Taliban must know the world is watching its actions. We are concerned about reports regarding the Taliban’s brutal treatment of all Afghans, especially women and girls.

    — Nancy Pelosi (@SpeakerPelosi) August 15, 2021
Quote
    The U.S., the international community and the Afghan government must do everything we can to protect women and girls from inhumane treatment by the Taliban. As we strive to assist them, we must recognize that their voices are important and respect their culture.

    — Nancy Pelosi (@SpeakerPelosi) August 15, 2021
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2021/08/15/nancy-pelosis-statement-on-biden-and-the-taliban-is-one-for-the-tone-deafness-record-book/

“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.”
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JTHunter

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #69 on: August 15, 2021, 07:35:50 PM »

So much for the idea that the ANA will dig in and stop them before Kabul. 90 days huh? At this point I have to stop enjoying the train wreck and hope that we get our people out safely.

It's Saigon all over again.
And the U.S. is tucking its tail and running.  You know Russia and China are watching this with both delight and thorough scrutiny.
  [popcorn]  :facepalm:
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MechAg94

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #70 on: August 15, 2021, 08:09:57 PM »

It's Saigon all over again.
And the U.S. is tucking its tail and running.  You know Russia and China are watching this with both delight and thorough scrutiny.
  [popcorn]  :facepalm:
Do you think we should hang around and continue our occupation just so we can say we didn't run? 

Never mind.  This whole situation sucks.  I think the outcome was inevitable ever since W. Bush started the nation building effort (and whatever else they planned to do).  IMO, the same thing would have happened 15 years ago and would have happened in the future if we had decided to stay.  Now all that remains is seeing if we have the competence to get our people out or if some will fall into the hands of our enemies. 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2021, 11:02:54 PM by MechAg94 »
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Viking

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #71 on: August 15, 2021, 08:30:44 PM »

No, we're using Chinooks and Blackhawks

https://youtu.be/aKPZ0Ldn9Bw


Top: Saigon 1975
Bottom: Kabul 2021



[ETA: the Chinook sure has had a long service life]
Saw someone claiming it's the very same helicopter in both images :O.
“The modern world will not be punished. It is the punishment.” — Nicolás Gómez Dávila

kgbsquirrel

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #72 on: August 15, 2021, 09:28:41 PM »

A reminder for the class that if the Departments of State and Defense had obeyed Trump's direct orders to them (to withdraw from Afghanistan) this would not have happened.  The people who disobeyed direct orders to pull out, lied to the commander in chief about doing so, and then bragged about it in the media, are responsible for this.  Still waiting for them to be punished for the aforementioned, but maybe now illegitimate administration will throw those fellas under the bus to save themselves?  One can dream.

Bogie

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #73 on: August 15, 2021, 09:41:43 PM »

Do you think that maybe we should send an openly gay ambassador over there, just to remind them about who is in charge?
Blog under construction

WLJ

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Re: Afghanistan
« Reply #74 on: August 15, 2021, 09:48:27 PM »

Do you think that maybe we should send an openly gay ambassador over there, just to remind them about who is in charge?

Which reminds me. Is the pride flag currently flying at the embassy ?
“Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.”
~George Carlin
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