Author Topic: Deadbolts...  (Read 1162 times)

K Frame

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Deadbolts...
« on: August 24, 2021, 10:22:38 AM »
The deadbolt (and handset) on my front door are really starting to show their age -- about 25 years old at this point. The deadbolt is particularly worrisome...

So I'm figuring it's time to replace both. They're Titan Kwiksets, which at the time were highly regarded and tested.

So, hive mind, what's the best out there today?

I'm not talking Medeco or anything that high priced. Just good security at decent prices.

I tried replacing the deadbolt with an electronic version a few years ago but I've got really narrow spacing between the handset and the deadbolt so it just didn't work.
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dogmush

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2021, 11:32:53 AM »
After watching too many of Lockpicking Lawyer's videos, as well as being realistic about the construction of the doors and windows in my home, I came to the conclusion that spending very much on locks for residential doors is futile.

I like Schlage, and go with "not the cheapest POS on the store shelves", but got deadbolts from the box store, so they aren't great.  YMMV

Ben

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2021, 11:36:45 AM »
After watching too many of Lockpicking Lawyer's videos, as well as being realistic about the construction of the doors and windows in my home, I came to the conclusion that spending very much on locks for residential doors is futile.

I like Schlage, and go with "not the cheapest POS on the store shelves", but got deadbolts from the box store, so they aren't great.  YMMV


What he said.

I had an Abloy on my condo front door in Santa Barbara, but here it's just higher end Schlages that have at least some protection from bumping. Otherwise everything else security-wise for door hardware is focused on the door frames.
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K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2021, 12:14:32 PM »
My door frames are already hardened, so I'm not too terribly worried about that.

I'm more worried about the prospect of the lock being bumped.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2021, 02:22:03 PM »
After watching too many of Lockpicking Lawyer's videos, as well as being realistic about the construction of the doors and windows in my home, I came to the conclusion that spending very much on locks for residential doors is futile.

I like Schlage, and go with "not the cheapest POS on the store shelves", but got deadbolts from the box store, so they aren't great.  YMMV

Another ditto. Decent quality to ensure mechanical and cosmetic durability, but nothing special beyond that. Also a fan of Schlage.

Blind deadbolts and a solid core door are about as good as it gets for residential. Anything more is wasteful overkill as door and window locks are preventives against casual or opportunistic entry only. They're no hindrance to purpose or plan. Besides, the weakest point of entry is usually a window and most homes have a lot more of those than doors. More serious efforts mean getting into things like window bars and such.

Brad
« Last Edit: August 24, 2021, 04:28:17 PM by Brad Johnson »
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JTHunter

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2021, 04:49:21 PM »
My door frames are already hardened, so I'm not too terribly worried about that.

I'm more worried about the prospect of the lock being bumped.

By "bumped", I assume you mean "picked" and I don't know of any lock that can prevent that for long without being outrageously expensive.
My main entry door is into the kitchen from my carport and it has two locks (both Schlage) with a deadbolt and the doorknob itself.  They also use the same key for both.
As you have already hardened your door, the only improvements I can imagine are ones that only function when you are there as they block access with braces or brackets.
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Ben

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2021, 04:59:40 PM »
By "bumped", I assume you mean "picked" and I don't know of any lock that can prevent that for long without being outrageously expensive.


Bumping is technically different than lockpicking. I've bumped locks just because a key fit it, without resorting to a bump key. I became interested in it (and it's why I got the Abloy at my old place) because I locked myself out once and the locksmith showed up, grabbed a key blank, and bumped the lock in like 0.5 seconds.

https://youtu.be/BwZM8fKOV1I
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Jim147

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2021, 05:20:48 PM »
I'm sure I've said this before but I just do the good midrange stuff to keep kids from screwing with my stuff. If I'm not here and they want in they can hook a chain to any door and pull it off with their truck and nobody will know.
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Bogie

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2021, 09:44:27 PM »
Put bars on your windows.
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tokugawa

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2021, 12:55:42 AM »
Schlage Primus is a step up, they can be bumped, apparently, but it will take a special key- they are controlled.

Security is an onion- lot's of layers.
Garage doors are  easy to lift unless the pull release is blocked.
Windows are easy to break ,anti break film is surprisingly effective and cheap. Nice to keep glass off the floor after an earthquake too.
 

K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2021, 07:12:36 AM »
"Blind deadbolts and a solid core door are about as good as it gets for residential."

What the hell is a blind deadbolt?

And yeah, I realize that the nice, big, glass patio door in my enclosed backyard is a bigger security risk than my front door, but I still want to go with something at least competent.

Someone's ass wiggling through one of my front windows is a FAR greater "tell" that something is wrong that someone walking up, bumping the lock, and walking in as if they either have a key or have been let in.

And my front door is insulated steel with small windows set high up -- no threat of someone popping a window and reaching through.
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Ben

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2021, 07:43:27 AM »

And yeah, I realize that the nice, big, glass patio door in my enclosed backyard is a bigger security risk than my front door, but I still want to go with something at least competent.


That may be less of a risk than you think (other than a fenced in area letting them take their time). I've seen some videos of people trying to break through them. I think a standard front door with no security enhancements would be easier.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2021, 08:27:45 AM »
What the hell is a blind deadbolt?

Deadbolt with no visible exterior hardware. Operable only from the interior.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
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MechAg94

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2021, 09:30:36 AM »
Bumping is technically different than lockpicking. I've bumped locks just because a key fit it, without resorting to a bump key. I became interested in it (and it's why I got the Abloy at my old place) because I locked myself out once and the locksmith showed up, grabbed a key blank, and bumped the lock in like 0.5 seconds.

https://youtu.be/BwZM8fKOV1I
So is the Mul-T Lock brand that guy mentions any good?  Just curious.  Changing out deadbolt locks is relatively easy.
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K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2021, 09:41:09 AM »
Deadbolt with no visible exterior hardware. Operable only from the interior.

Brad

Yeah, no. I don't lock the handset on my door unless I'm going away for awhile. I use the deadbolt.
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Brad Johnson

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2021, 09:42:46 AM »
Yeah, no. I don't lock the handset on my door unless I'm going away for awhile. I use the deadbolt.

Blind deadbolts are usually in addition to existing latch/deadbolt setups, not in place of.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
-HankB

Ben

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2021, 10:04:20 AM »
So is the Mul-T Lock brand that guy mentions any good?  Just curious.  Changing out deadbolt locks is relatively easy.

I know nothing about it. It just happened to be in the first short video I found on bumping locks.  =)
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K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2021, 10:56:27 AM »
Blind deadbolts are usually in addition to existing latch/deadbolt setups, not in place of.

Brad

I currently have a locking handset with a separate cylinder deadbolt.

You're saying a third hole in the door for a blind deadbolt?

No.

I don't live in New York City...
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Bogie

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2021, 11:01:11 AM »
I'm sort of considering a "safe" style, with four bolts that extend to the four edges of the doorframe...
 
I don't live in New York either.
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tokugawa

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2021, 01:00:11 PM »
Security film is good for glass doors. I tested some 8 mill film on some  windows we replaced- put them in a enclosed trailer and threw bricks at them. The first impact broke the non filmed side, and made a divot in the other pane, it took several throws to break thorough and even then it was a ragged brick sized hole, rather than all the glass coming out. Much like a car windshield, though obviously not as tough.
 Hanita was the brand.
 http://hanitacoatings.com/films/US/products/safety-zone

 If you are not concerned about bump keying (and I really have no idea if this is a common attack or not) any good mid level dead bolt would probably be ok.
 The common attacks seem to be-
 Kicking the door hard enough to break the strike from the jamb,
 Prying the door edge and jamb apart to release the bolt engagement,
or breaking a hole in the door or adjacent wall and reaching through to turn the bolt.

 Reinforcing the strike and jamb fixes the first, having a stiffener in the wall on the jamb side corrects the second,
(I don't know why builders don't put a piece of 3/4" ply between the studs to create a shear panel at door edges, it also makes for a hard thing to punch through to get at the interior latch)
 and having a strong thick door solves the last.

K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #20 on: September 09, 2021, 08:28:15 AM »
I think I have finally found an electronic deadbolt that will work with my door set up... the Ultralog series (there are 3 or 4).

The biggest problem I've had in finding an electronic lock is the spacing between the deadbolt and knob on my door is VERY tight. While most exterior parts would fit, the interior parts extended down too far and would interfere with the knob.

The Ultraloqs appear to have the same bottom spacing on both the interior and exterior units.

But, I'm not finding a lot of industry style reviews, but I am finding a lot of good customer reviews (hopefully they're actual reviews and not bots).
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K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2021, 09:43:55 AM »
OK, Woot had the Ultra Loq U Bolt on sale... $80, as opposed to $100+ they normally go for, so I sprang for one.

It's satin nickel, which I really don't care for, but that's OK.

I'm going to try to use it on my front door. If the spacing isn't right (the front door has a VERY narrow center spacing for some reason) I'll use it on the patio door.
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Ben

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2021, 10:32:47 AM »
Let us know how it works. I have a cheaper Kwikset on my shop's man door (not so much for theft as for me losing a key) and while the lock works fine, it took me forever to chisel out space correctly for the lock to open and close. If it hits the least bit of resistance from rubbing along the side of the doorframe, it won't lock, even though using the backup key, it locked fine. Counting seasonal wood swelling, it probably took me six months before I had everything aligned right so it had perfect clearance.

I really want to put one on my front door, but don't want to go through all that again, because the front door is already really tight. I might, like you, then put it on my patio door, where I don't mind an ugly install if I really have to get jiggy with wood removal. I just want to have one keyless lock on the house.
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K Frame

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2021, 10:40:01 AM »
My main consideration is that I'd really like to have a way of getting into the house if I lose my keys and my neighbors aren't home.

And being able to give my contractors a one time use code is nice, too.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Deadbolts...
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2021, 11:16:25 AM »
So is the Mul-T Lock brand that guy mentions any good?  Just curious.  Changing out deadbolt locks is relatively easy.

Never heard of Mul-T Lock. As an architect, I always preferred to specify Schlage, with Sargent being the preferred alternate.

NOT the Schlage line you can buy at Lowe's or Home Despot. Buy from a locksmith.
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