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Author Topic: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!  (Read 987 times)

HankB

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California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« on: October 11, 2021, 10:12:15 AM »

Yep.

If you want a gas powered leaf blower, lawn mower (walk behind or rider), pressure washer, chain saw, weed wacker, or anything else using a small gas engine for off road use, it looks like you're going to be out of luck; Kalifornia enacted a law banning the sale of anything but "zero emission" small engines. Which essentially means battery powered.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/california-law-bans-small-off-174600432.html

The law apparently doesn't ban currently owned devices, but I foresee a time when people make road trips into neighboring states to buy power tools, in much the same way as some do to buy ammunition. One wonders if Kali will soon put up customs inspection facilities at all border crossings. (Except the southern ones, of course.)
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Ben

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2021, 10:34:14 AM »

While suburban homeowners with smaller yards could get by with battery run mowers, I wonder how this will affect landscapers? If their next new lawn tractor costs double what their old one did, some guys might be going out of business.

I will say that I love my Ryobi 40v weed wacker and leaf blower combo. Plenty of power, and with two batteries, by the time I run both batteries out, I'm ready for a break anyway. Of course they were my choice, and not mandated.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

MechAg94

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2021, 10:43:01 AM »

While suburban homeowners with smaller yards could get by with battery run mowers, I wonder how this will affect landscapers? If their next new lawn tractor costs double what their old one did, some guys might be going out of business.

I will say that I love my Ryobi 40v weed wacker and leaf blower combo. Plenty of power, and with two batteries, by the time I run both batteries out, I'm ready for a break anyway. Of course they were my choice, and not mandated.
I was considering an electric weed eater myself.  I haven't started looking.  Just thinking I need to get one and I don't want to mess with gas.  Corded would work for me.
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Ben

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2021, 10:49:46 AM »

I was considering an electric weed eater myself.  I haven't started looking.  Just thinking I need to get one and I don't want to mess with gas.  Corded would work for me.

I highly recommend getting one that is in a manufacturer's "interchangeable" series. My Ryobi stuff is in the Ryobi one+ series, so the weed wacker can take lots of attachments, and there are a bunch of different garden tools that all run on the same battery. I'm pretty sure all the major brands have similar series of lawn equipment.
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MillCreek

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2021, 10:50:27 AM »

I also have the Ryobi 40 volt blower and weed whacker, and they do have the power.  I also have a Ryobi two-stroke power head, and I keep that with a rotating saw blade to keep down the woody brush in the back part of our lot.
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Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
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MechAg94

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2021, 10:52:41 AM »

Quote
The new law will ban the sale of all off-road, gas-powered engines, including generators, lawn equipment, pressure washers, chainsaws, weed trimmers, and even golf carts. Under the new law, these machines must be zero-emissions, meaning they will have to be either battery-powered or plug-in, according to the Los Angeles Times.

How does this affect tractors?  From what I know, farmers use lots of small engines and such not to mention ranchers and others.  The article only talks about lawn care.  What about air compressors and welding machines used for industrial work?  I don't know if they realize just how much small engines are used.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2021, 10:56:57 AM »

I highly recommend getting one that is in a manufacturer's "interchangeable" series. My Ryobi stuff is in the Ryobi one+ series, so the weed wacker can take lots of attachments, and there are a bunch of different garden tools that all run on the same battery. I'm pretty sure all the major brands have similar series of lawn equipment.
I will keep that in mind.  If nothing else, might make battery replacements later easier to do.

I already have a 120VAC blower and a 120VAC edger.  Both work just fine.  I have had the edger a few years.  I have had the blower for 15 years.  I have had to change the blade on the edger once so far.  Probably need to do it again before next Spring.  My 100 foot extension cord reaches the entire yard.  In the past, 120VAC stuff wasn't very capable as it wasn't meant for serious work.  But I haven't shopped around yet so I don't what choices are available.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2021, 11:01:40 AM »

California law bans small off-road gas engines, including lawnmowers and chainsaws
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/california-law-to-ban-small-off-road-engines
Quote
The new law will ban the sale of all off-road, gas-powered engines, including generators, lawn equipment, pressure washers, chainsaws, weed trimmers, and even golf carts. Under the new law , these machines must be zero-emissions, meaning they will have to be either battery-powered or plug-in, according to the Los Angeles Times .
I didn't even think about generators.  I think people will figure out a lot more places where small engines are used.

Quote
The new rule will be implemented by January 2024, or as soon as regulators determine is "feasible," whichever date is later. The California Air Resources Board has already started working on executing the law, which is a lengthy process scheduled to conclude early next year, per the outlet.
Doesn't go into effect until 2024.
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Ben

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2021, 11:03:53 AM »

Golf carts and "off-road". Hmm. ATVs, dirt bikes, and side by sides are also gas powered. I wonder if this is the nose under the tent for recreational stuff too?
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WLJ

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2021, 11:10:32 AM »

I'm sure California's electrical grid is up to the task to charge all these electric vehicles, engines, and whatnot 
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MillCreek

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2021, 11:10:56 AM »

I bet there will be exceptions for governmental agencies and emergencies.  I can't see the Forest Service, National Parks or CalFire using battery chainsaws to cut a fire line or do trail maintenance 20 miles in from the road or trailhead.
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MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
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zahc

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #11 on: October 11, 2021, 11:12:27 AM »

California has been at war against dirt bikes and ATVs for as long as I can remember. It's sad of course because sports like motocross and dune riding were practically invented in California, but CA doesn't seem to care. Like the Taliban, any cultural or economic collateral damage just doesn't matter if it gets in the way of ideology.
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Boomhauer

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #12 on: October 11, 2021, 11:27:42 AM »

How does this affect tractors?  From what I know, farmers use lots of small engines and such not to mention ranchers and others.  The article only talks about lawn care.  What about air compressors and welding machines used for industrial work?  I don't know if they realize just how much small engines are used.

Why would they care? They hate all blue collar/farmers.

Guys remember it’s not about logic in CA it’s about emotional autistic screeching. Y’all make the mistake of trying to apply logic to that kind of insanity.
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MechAg94

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2021, 11:49:39 AM »

Why would they care? They hate all blue collar/farmers.

Guys remember it’s not about logic in CA it’s about emotional autistic screeching. Y’all make the mistake of trying to apply logic to that kind of insanity.
Agreed.  I wasn't asking about the leftists.  Just about how far reaching the law is. 

It seems to be pretty much banning everything gas powered.  Now I am wondering if there are exceptions for diesel, propane, or other fuels (probably not). 

The people making the laws and even writing the articles have no idea what working people actually do.  All they see is the lawn maintenance guys so that is all they think about (and that is just the journalists).  The same thing has been seen when some of these people talk about illegal immigration.  They start talking about house cleaning people and nannies since those are the only illegal immigrants they see.
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French G.

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2021, 12:14:04 PM »

Generator ban and people will die. Some need home health equipment or air conditioners to live. Lack of gas powered fire pumps ought to be a hoot too.
AKA Navy Joe   

I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

French G.

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2021, 12:18:12 PM »

The generator part is amazing in the natural disaster state. Even on a good day that bans food trucks, outdoor festivals, a fair amount of RVs, race tracks... A huge amount of revenue and fun.

Mobile welding and construction, the list goes on. Wow.
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Jim147

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2021, 12:25:18 PM »

It was nice of them to put some money off to the side to help the landscapers get new equipment.

If they devide it evenly it's a whole $600 for each business. They have no idea how much commercial zero emission equipment will cost.
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Ben

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2021, 12:43:35 PM »

Now I am wondering if there are exceptions for diesel, propane, or other fuels (probably not). 

It's funny (sad funny, not funny funny) that CA was the lame ass state that pushed diesel emissions restrictions to the whole country (and world, if you include ships dropping cargo in the US) at great cost to all the users, not to mention the headaches of Tier4, and a decade later, they're gonna eliminate the "clean diesel" that they forced on everyone.
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sumpnz

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2021, 12:55:44 PM »

What’s the cc (or cu. in.) cutoff for what constitutes a “small” engine?

Nick1911

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2021, 01:33:24 PM »

They have left themselves many outs.  There's the actual legal change adds the following:

43018.11. (a)
(1) By July 1, 2022, the state board shall, consistent with federal law, adopt cost-effective and technologically feasible regulations to prohibit engine exhaust and evaporative emissions from new small off-road engines, as defined by the state board. Those regulations shall apply to engines produced on or after January 1, 2024, or as soon as the state board determines is feasible, whichever is later.
(2) In determining technological feasibility pursuant to paragraph (1), the state board shall consider all of the following:
      (A) Emissions from small off-road engines in the state.
      (B) Expected timelines for zero-emission small off-road equipment development.
      (C) Increased demand for electricity from added charging requirements for more zero-emission small off-road equipment.
      (D) Use cases of both commercial and residential lawn and garden users.
      (E) Expected availability of zero-emission generators and emergency response equipment.
(b) Consistent with the regulations adopted pursuant to this section and relevant state law, the state board shall identify, and, to the extent feasible, make available, funding for commercial rebates or similar incentive funding as part of any updates to existing, applicable funding program guidelines for districts to implement to support the transition to zero-emission small off-road equipment operations.

MillCreek

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2021, 02:21:46 PM »

Zero-emission generators.  I have looked at those Jackery and other battery banks.  If I lived in an area where solar charging was feasible, I would be thinking about them.  As it is, they would be good for charging up the small electronics, but you are not going to be running anything with a decent wattage for very long.
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Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

castle key

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2021, 06:12:02 PM »

Are you allowed to have an electric powered generator?
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dogmush

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2021, 06:29:20 PM »

All that "technologically feasible " reminds me of the microstamping law.

HankB

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2021, 06:33:48 PM »

Are you allowed to have an electric powered generator?
You'll just use some of the electric power produced by the generator to run the generator's motor. Simple.

(Ain't tapping a perpetual motion machine grand?)

I've got some yard tools (weed wacker, leaf blower, pole saw) that run on 120VAC - like MechAg94,a 100 foot cord lets me reach my whole yard. But I'm NOT impressed with the power of 120VAC pressure washers, and don't expect anything battery operated will work well.
Trump won in 2016. Democrats haven't been so offended since Republicans came along and freed their slaves.
Those who work for a living are being BURIED by those who vote for a living.
Government is a broker in pillage, and every election is a sort of advance auction in stolen goods. - H.L. Mencken
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Perd Hapley

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Re: California Bans . . . Small Engines?!?!
« Reply #24 on: October 11, 2021, 06:43:07 PM »

This member used to have another name, and the name that this member used to have was fistful.
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