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Author Topic: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident  (Read 8178 times)

WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2021, 10:09:18 AM »

He probably is a hypocrite and terrible person, but being anti-gun while using a gun a in movie isn't automatically hypocritical.
Acting involves pretending to do things you might not personally endorse such as murder, rape, or eating pineapple on pizza.

Murders and rapists are usually the villain(s) of the movie while Alex likes to plays the hero with a gun. Different message IMHO. The villain you're suppose to hate the hero the opposite.
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2021, 10:12:54 AM »

I saw that mentioned on another site. I had never heard or read that prior to this incident. How does that work?

Much like cordex mentioned earlier with his blank firing 8mm 1911, they don't have barrels/chambers/cylinders that match ammunition dimensions.  Often times you can watch a movie and see that the dimensions of the barrel or the cylinder holes are off proportion if you have a sharp eye.
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castle key

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2021, 10:22:36 AM »

September 2017, Baldwin "tweeted" about a police shooting in Huntington Beach, Ca.

Of course he knew no facts of the police shooting but never the less proffered his opinion....

"I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone..."  -Alec Baldwin
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sumpnz

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #28 on: October 22, 2021, 10:30:59 AM »

Given that many pistol rounds are less than half filled with powder (hence all the warnings about double charging when reloading), seems like a prop gun that only can chamber a pretty short blank round would be easy-ish to design.  Feeding might be a challenge for semi-auto.  But that would make it impossible to chamber a live round, even if a smaller caliber. 

Be interesting to see what charges get filed, and against who.

cordex

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #29 on: October 22, 2021, 10:31:37 AM »

I saw that mentioned on another site. I had never heard or read that prior to this incident. How does that work?
My understanding is that there are a handful of different types of guns used on set.
1. Non-firing dummy guns.  These are often cast in rubber of varying durometer or plastic then painted, and can be used as stunt rifles where someone needs to be hit with one, or carried by extras, etc.  Some are really nice hero pieces made from metal, but they cannot fire and can be handled without particular care.  If these are "fired" in the movie, it done via CGI.
2. Guns that cycle safely but do not fire.  Green-gas powered blowback airsoft type guns with no pellets are an example of this, as are some CO2 BB guns.  No projectile leaves the barrel, and no gunpowder is burned.  CGI is used for muzzle flash.
3. Dedicated blank firing prop guns.  These use cartridges for which regular ammunition will not chamber.  As mentioned, the one I had was 8mm.  These can be "front firing" which means it vents to the front out the barrel (which also necessitates additional precautions and standoff distance between the actor and what they are pointing the gun at) or "top firing" which means the vents come out the top of the gun and the barrel is completely blocked off.  You still have to be careful about the gasses that come out the top but your standoff distance can be much shorter.
4. As dogmush mentioned, some still use real firearms professionally converted to shoot only blanks.  Not sure I'd agree that they are the most convincing on film - they'll still typically use CGI to add muzzle flashes because directors prefer the drama of huge fireballs over what a blank usually produces.  Nor are they the cheapest option (certainly not per round fired), but they can be more convincing to the actors.  These can be converted a number of different ways, but if they are semi-auto they have to have a barrel restriction (often welded in) to cycle, and often have locking lugs ground down and so forth.  These can be the most dangerous option as depending on how they are converted they may still chamber live rounds, and depending on how the muzzle restriction is installed that could come flying out as a projectile.

Jim147

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #30 on: October 22, 2021, 11:02:03 AM »

Seems one live round was in the pistol. The police are not ruling as accidental or murder yet.

It's on some New Mexico news site that I already closed.
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #31 on: October 22, 2021, 11:03:46 AM »

Notice the MSM keep saying the gun misfired instead of discharged, accident or accidental and so on
Misfire gives the impression it's the gun's fault.
Fits a pattern.
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #32 on: October 22, 2021, 11:07:05 AM »

"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
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MechAg94

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #33 on: October 22, 2021, 11:18:14 AM »

How would a live round make its way into a prop gun?  Wouldn't they have specific ammo boxes used to load blanks?  I would think that ammo would be checked beforehand and verified. 

Could some ammo be around from people playing around on off time? 
Or could there be a poorly made blank that expelled solid pieces? 

Supposedly Baldwin was heard asking why he was given a hot gun.  Did he do something reckless thinking the gun was unloaded?
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brimic

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #34 on: October 22, 2021, 11:20:36 AM »

Fnckwits shouldn’t be handed guns or gun shaped objects.

I’m wondering if there’s a chance that he had one of the few privileged California CCW permits that only go to high profile liberals and he mixed up his own carry gun with a ‘prop’ gun?
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brimic

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #35 on: October 22, 2021, 11:24:37 AM »

I’ve read that witnesses stated that Baldwin said something like “ I should shoot you two”, a moment before shooting.

Would this make it pre-meditated, considering that he said it prior to pointing a gun at a person(s) and pulled the trigger? It would certainly illustrate intent, whether the gun was loaded or not (guns are always loaded!)
"now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb" -Dark Helmet

"AK47's belong in the hands of soldiers mexican drug cartels"-
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brimic

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #36 on: October 22, 2021, 11:27:45 AM »

Given that many pistol rounds are less than half filled with powder (hence all the warnings about double charging when reloading), seems like a prop gun that only can chamber a pretty short blank round would be easy-ish to design.  Feeding might be a challenge for semi-auto.  But that would make it impossible to chamber a live round, even if a smaller caliber. 

Be interesting to see what charges get filed, and against who.

Electric air soft guns look very real real and cycle like a real gun… they often cost more than the real gun that it mimics. The production would just have to dub in sounds, which they do anyway.
"now you see that evil will always triumph, because good is dumb" -Dark Helmet

"AK47's belong in the hands of soldiers mexican drug cartels"-
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #37 on: October 22, 2021, 11:28:27 AM »

I’ve read that witnesses stated that Baldwin said something like “ I should shoot you two”, a moment before shooting.

Would this make it pre-meditated, considering that he said it prior to pointing a gun at a person(s) and pulled the trigger? It would certainly illustrate intent, whether the gun was loaded or not (guns are always loaded!)

He's long been known to be a hot head and go off at people. If the above is true a guy named Murphy is having a good laugh.

RIP Halyna Hutchins
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RocketMan

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #38 on: October 22, 2021, 11:31:42 AM »

I don't know how much benefit of the doubt he should be given. He is not only the star of the production, he is also the producer. As producer, doesn't he have some responsibility for everything that happens on the set? Let's face it -- even accepting that he didn't intend to kill Ms. Hutchins, an innocent person (who was working for him) is dead by his hand. We are constantly taught that we own every bullet that leaves our guns. Well, Baldwin owns this one.

In the real world, our normal world, what you say is true.  However, this event occurred in the Hollywood world.  Different rules.
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #39 on: October 22, 2021, 11:34:11 AM »

I just had a crazy thought in my mind straight out of a Columbo episode
What if he actually wanted to kill her and brought a loaded magazine with a live round(s) on top to make it look like an accident, I mean misfire?
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #40 on: October 22, 2021, 11:37:35 AM »

He probably is a hypocrite and terrible person, but being anti-gun while using a gun a in movie isn't automatically hypocritical.
Acting involves pretending to do things you might not personally endorse such as murder, rape, or eating pineapple on pizza.


That's just a bridge too far...
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #41 on: October 22, 2021, 11:39:15 AM »


That's just a bridge too far...

I like pineapple on pizza
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sumpnz

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #42 on: October 22, 2021, 11:42:06 AM »

I just had a crazy thought in my mind straight out of a Colombo episode
What if he actually wanted to kill her and brought a loaded magazine with a live round on top to make it look like an accident, I mean misfire?

Don’t ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

Alec Baldwin is pretty stupid.  I won’t totally discount malice here, but the odds favor stupidity.

WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #43 on: October 22, 2021, 11:44:53 AM »

Don’t ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

Alec Baldwin is pretty stupid.  I won’t totally discount malice here, but the odds favor stupidity.

I agree wholeheartedly why I called it crazy. Think there was a Columbo episode alone those lines though.
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zxcvbob

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #44 on: October 22, 2021, 11:53:52 AM »

Don’t ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

Alec Baldwin is pretty stupid.  I won’t totally discount malice here, but the odds favor stupidity.

Malice and stupidity are not mutually exclusive -- in fact they compliment (complement?) each other.
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Ron

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #45 on: October 22, 2021, 11:58:14 AM »

He probably is a hypocrite and terrible person, but being anti-gun while using a gun a in movie isn't automatically hypocritical.
Acting involves pretending to do things you might not personally endorse such as murder, rape, or eating pineapple on pizza.

Everybody is a hypocrite. Who lives up to their own standards and morality perfectly? 

In this case it is a matter of degrees. If you are anti-gun and gun violence don't make movies glorifying gun use and gun violence.

At the very least don't use your fame and influence to promote your political positions you're being hypocritical about. An actor like Baldwin has the option to choose different scripts. He's not a starving artist taking what he can get.



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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #46 on: October 22, 2021, 11:58:50 AM »

Malice and stupidity are not mutually exclusive -- in fact they compliment (complement?) each other.

Often with a very large helping of ego thrown in
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MechAg94

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #47 on: October 22, 2021, 12:23:23 PM »

Everybody is a hypocrite. Who lives up to their own standards and morality perfectly? 

In this case it is a matter of degrees. If you are anti-gun and gun violence don't make movies glorifying gun use and gun violence.

At the very least don't use your fame and influence to promote your political positions you're being hypocritical about. An actor like Baldwin has the option to choose different scripts. He's not a starving artist taking what he can get.
Everyone is not a hypocrite.  Many admit their failiure, but try live up to a higher standard anyway.  Some people deny their failure and/or argue some legalistic loophole.  IMO, that is an important difference. 
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #48 on: October 22, 2021, 12:36:11 PM »

Quote
‘I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone...'

A 2017 tweet made by Alec Baldwin has resurfaced in which he commented on a police shooting in Los Angeles.

“I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone,” Mr Baldwin wrote, with a link to an article about a Huntington Beach officer who shot and killed a suspect.

    I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone...https://t.co/WE6QsAAXGI
    — AlecBaldwin (@AlecBaldwln____) September 23, 2017
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/alec-baldwin-prop-gun-misfire-rust-live-b1943248.html

Well now you know
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #49 on: October 22, 2021, 12:39:55 PM »

Quote
A prop gun that Alec Baldwin fired on the set of the movie Rust, which killed cinematographer Halyna Hutchins and wounded director Joel Souza, contained a “live single round”, a film union says.
Quote
“A live single round was accidentally fired on set by the principal actor, hitting both the Director of Photography, Local 600 member Halyna Hutchins, and Director Joel Souza,” the union told members.in an email obtained by Variety.

Alec Baldwin: Prop gun that killed Halyna Hutchins contained ‘live single round’, union says
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/alec-baldwin-halyna-hutchins-gun-b1943673.html
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
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