Author Topic: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident  (Read 42106 times)

WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #75 on: October 22, 2021, 07:21:11 PM »
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dogmush

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #76 on: October 22, 2021, 07:31:19 PM »
As much as we all hate Mr. Baldwin and his politics, when making jokes it is worth remembering that someone's wife, and two children's mother was killed in this incident. I'm sure those children would rather have their mother then any number of solid memes.

Don't  be an ahole to make cheap internet points. 

Bogie

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #77 on: October 22, 2021, 07:38:36 PM »
Did anyone mention the propane or gas-op stuff? Usually used for full auto...
 
I wonder if this would have happened if an outfit like Stembridge had been involved. Odds are they low-budgeted, and asked if anyone knew anyone where to find the right kind of <real> guns...
 
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #78 on: October 22, 2021, 07:51:26 PM »
As much as we all hate Mr. Baldwin and his politics, when making jokes it is worth remembering that someone's wife, and two children's mother was killed in this incident. I'm sure those children would rather have their mother then any number of solid memes.

Don't  be an ahole to make cheap internet points.

Precisely why I posted the url only and not the image itself. To leave it to the individual whether or not they wanted to see it. I will remove the url if requested.
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #79 on: October 22, 2021, 08:00:39 PM »
Ironically I was just viewing a video on the German attitude toward war jokes during the war.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #80 on: October 22, 2021, 08:10:42 PM »
If I remember correctly, he was shooting blanks from a 1911 in "The Hunt for Red October".  I could be wrong but those scenes didn't look like CGI shooting to me.

But they were.  And the scene exhibited poor gun handling, too.

First, Ryan crawled along that suspended cable tray with his finger on the trigger.

When he shot the bomber, he fired five shots. Five shots from an M1911 in an enclosed space like that would have left him deaf (at least temporarily) and literally in pain. Don't ask me how I know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kaBIMuW74Q
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #81 on: October 22, 2021, 08:18:50 PM »
According to this Baldwin was handed the gun by the assistant director and told it was safe to use

Court records released on Friday raise new questions regarding the fatal shooting involving Alec Baldwin
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2021/10/22/court-records-released-on-friday-raise-new-questions-regarding-the-fatal-shooting-involving-alec-baldwin/
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #82 on: October 22, 2021, 08:30:45 PM »
According to this Baldwin was handed the gun by the assistant director and told it was safe to use

Court records released on Friday raise new questions regarding the fatal shooting involving Alec Baldwin
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2021/10/22/court-records-released-on-friday-raise-new-questions-regarding-the-fatal-shooting-involving-alec-baldwin/

More proof evidence that there were serious problems on that set. From an earlier link:

Quote
Regardless of what may have happened, members of the union IATSE say that multiple gun safety protocols were breached.

'We have a hard and fast rule that no live ammunition ever goes into a prop truck or set at any time. We just don't do it. If you see bullets on set they are complete dummy rounds and are in no way functional.

'This goes back to Brandon Lee. There's protocol.

'Many, many people had to fail at the protocols we set on place for this to happen,' Zachary Knight, a member of the IATSE Local 44 union, told DailyMail.com on Friday.
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bedlamite

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #83 on: October 22, 2021, 08:31:21 PM »
Obviously, it's Trump's fault.  ;/

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Angel Eyes

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #84 on: October 22, 2021, 09:07:33 PM »
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ConstitutionCowboy

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #85 on: October 22, 2021, 09:46:59 PM »
There is a picture of 5-in-1 blanks at the link Hawkmoon posted.

At a glance they don't look much different from a RN cartridge. I imagine a real cartridge could have easily been misidentified as a blank.

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Hawkmoon

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #86 on: October 22, 2021, 10:09:03 PM »
Misfire is going to be the term since he is antigun.

Yeah.

And that's unfortunate, because it's going to send the wrong message. In fact, the firearm apparently functioned perfectly. Baldwin pulled the trigger, the gun fired, and the bullet went where it was aimed. No "mis"fire anywhere. But multiple examples of poor gun handling, lack of observance of safety protocols, and outright negligence.
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Jim147

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #87 on: October 22, 2021, 10:43:22 PM »
Even though I had been already been taught  before I remember gun safety in elementary school. If he had know about safety this would have never happened.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #88 on: October 23, 2021, 12:24:54 AM »
I am very disappointed to see that on The Firing Line -- a pro-gun, pro-2A forum -- there are apologists who already want to cut Baldwin some slack.

Quote
Let's not beat up on Alec too much just because he has been anti-gun in the past. There is a lot of blame to go around.

While I am certain there is blame to spread around, there's a reason why we are taught that when someone hands us a firearm, WE clear it -- even if we just watched the other guy clear it. In the final analysis, a woman is dead and her child has lost its mother because Alec Baldwin cocked the gun, pointed the gun at her, and pulled the trigger.

How much slack am I supposed to cut him?
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #89 on: October 23, 2021, 12:29:14 AM »
As much as we all hate Mr. Baldwin and his politics...

Hate his politics, but he was amazing in 30 Rock. Extremely funny and talented guy, when he's not being a raging jerk in his personal and political life.

sumdood on the internet observed that Baldwin has now killed more innocent people than Kyle Rittenhouse.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2021, 02:01:04 AM by Perd Hapley »
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K Frame

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #90 on: October 23, 2021, 08:21:09 AM »
I am very disappointed to see that on The Firing Line -- a pro-gun, pro-2A forum -- there are apologists who already want to cut Baldwin some slack.

While I am certain there is blame to spread around, there's a reason why we are taught that when someone hands us a firearm, WE clear it -- even if we just watched the other guy clear it. In the final analysis, a woman is dead and her child has lost its mother because Alec Baldwin cocked the gun, pointed the gun at her, and pulled the trigger.

How much slack am I supposed to cut him?


What, you mean that even on directed forums there are people who aren't lock step with the program?

That they have DIFFERENT opinions?

Oh the horror!
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #91 on: October 23, 2021, 09:02:15 AM »

What, you mean that even on directed forums there are people who aren't lock step with the program?

That they have DIFFERENT opinions?

Oh the horror!

Yes, I do consider the fact that in a group of people who purport to be knowledgeable about firearms there are some who don't think deliberately cocking a gun, pointing it at another person, and pulling the trigger is unsafe to be rather horrible.

Some things are legitimately matters of opinion: what color you prefer, whether or not you like pineapple on pizza, etc. Other things are not legitimately matters of opinion -- even though some people hold divergent opinions about them. Pointing guns at people and pulling the trigger "IMHO" falls in the latter category.
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cordex

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #92 on: October 23, 2021, 09:14:26 AM »
One reason people can have different opinions about this situation is that there may actually have been a valid movie reason he pointed and fired a gun directly at the people he shot. I guarantee it was not the actor’s responsibility to check that the gun was properly prepared for that scene.  Expecting actors to be competent to check every stunt and prop is unreasonable.

The difference is that movies are not real life, and in movies actors are sometimes expected to do things that would be catastrophically stupid in real life. They are, however, assured by experts that it will be fine and they needn’t worry.  In one play I was gun wrangler on, at the end of the scene the actor notices the audience has witnessed his murders and points the gun at them and fires directly toward them. This was okay because he was given a top-firing blank gun and the stand-off was appropriate. It was safe because I had selected the correct gun and walked the actor through the proper way to handle the gun in the scene, and had he shot someone somehow it would have been my fault that it happened, not his.

Totally possible he was doing the wrong thing too, however.  We don’t know yet.

Ron

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #93 on: October 23, 2021, 09:25:09 AM »
What do you call a “prop gun” that fires real cartridges?

It's called a GUN

Time to stop using word magic to make it sound less serious.

It's a real gun used as a prop.

Everyone calling it a "prop gun" obscures the reality that it was a functioning firearm.

The use of "prop gun" to the average person makes it sound like a starter pistol or something less serious than the reality.

Even gunnies are falling into the trap.
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ConstitutionCowboy

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #94 on: October 23, 2021, 09:51:24 AM »
Bottom line? The gun was in AB's hands. He was the one responsible for what was in it. He picked it up(or received it from someone else), and didn't 'clear' it. No amount of huffing and puffing will change that.

Woody
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Jim147

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #95 on: October 23, 2021, 10:25:40 AM »
It seems his stunt double was handed a gun with two live rounds in it earlier in the week.
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HankB

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #96 on: October 23, 2021, 10:42:10 AM »
Allowing LIVE ROUNDS on the set of a movie which includes actors with guns makes about as much sense as allowing cigarettes and matches in a fireworks factory.

If its confirmed that live rounds found their way into a real gun here, SOMEONE needs to go to jail for this.
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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #97 on: October 23, 2021, 10:44:26 AM »
He picked it up(or received it from someone else), and didn't 'clear' it.
when someone hands us a firearm, WE clear it -- even if we just watched the other guy clear it.

Do you think that's how it works on movie sets? I really doubt that even the actors who are knowledgeable about guns do that, that's why they hire experts. If you're insistent that actors strictly follow all gun safety rules, you should probably never watch an old western or John Wick movie or really any movie with guns.
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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #98 on: October 23, 2021, 10:48:17 AM »
Regarding guns on set via the NYT:

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/22/business/prop-guns-baldwin-shooting.html

I was able to read this on my phone, but hit a paywall on the desktop. YMMV.
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WLJ

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Re: Alec Baldwin Firearm Accident
« Reply #99 on: October 23, 2021, 10:49:25 AM »
They keep using the term misfire both for this and the earlier 3 "misfires". If the gun fired it's didn't misfire it fired from my understanding of the term misfire.

But

Quote
misfire
mĭs-fīr′
intransitive verb

1. To fail to ignite when expected. Used of an internal-combustion engine.
2. To fail to discharge. Used of a firearm.
3. To fail to achieve an anticipated result.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=misfire+definition&t=ffsb&ia=definition

I suppose #3 could cover what happened if you look at it a certain way  :O
« Last Edit: October 23, 2021, 11:15:09 AM by WLJ »
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