30 Super Carry

[zxcvbob]

Meh, use blue dot. Concealed subcompact pistol, flamethrower and flashlight all in one.

I tried Blue Dot in .30 Carbine revolver loads.  Blew two case heads off.  (did the same thing with .357 Magnum) That's not a big deal in a revolver, except it was a bitch getting the stuck cases out, but could be tragic in a semiauto.  I don't use Blue Dot anymore.

[HeroHog]

Blue Dot (IIRC) and Hercules were my "go-to" powders for 9mm. Real nice Snap to it in a +P+ load!

[zxcvbob]

Blue Dot (IIRC) and Hercules were my "go-to" powders for 9mm. Real nice Snap to it in a +P+ load!

Ise Hercules the same as Herco?  I love Herco in revolver cartridges; never tried it in 9mm because it's so bulky I didn't think a full load would fit.

[HeroHog]

Ise Hercules the same as Herco?  I love Herco in revolver cartridges; never tried it in 9mm because it's so bulky I didn't think a full load would fit.

I don't think so. It was a Hot pistol powder. Quick burning. 5 grains behind a 115 gr 9mm was fairly potent.

I must be misremembering the powder name: https://www.alliantpowder.com/general/about_us.aspx

Bullseye perhaps? I know it was discontinued in the 80/90s. My memory SUCKS!

[K Frame]

Blue Dot (IIRC) and Hercules were my "go-to" powders for 9mm. Real nice Snap to it in a +P+ load!

Hercules was a powder manufacturer. They never had a specific powder called Hercules.


"I don't think so. It was a Hot pistol powder. Quick burning. 5 grains behind a 115 gr 9mm was fairly potent."

What you're describing does sound like Herco. Although not an optimal powder for 9mm, I know some people who did use it.

[K Frame]

I would be worried about amping up one of the old small cartridges in a blowback  gun.  The Tokerav is (I think) locked breech, but it's not a particularly small gun.

There are certain size limits that come with locking lugs that can hold 50k psi of chamber pressure.

The Tokarev TT30 and TT33 pistols both use the same locking system as the 1911.

[HankB]

. . .
What you're describing does sound like Herco. Although not an optimal powder for 9mm, I know some people who did use it.

Though I never tried it myself, I remember reading articles extolling the virtues of Herco for loading 9mm P. Newer powders seem to have displaced it somewhat, but my old Speer and Sierra loading manuals show some of the highest 9mm P velocities were delivered by Herco.

(I usually used 700-X or SR-4756 for loading the 9 since I bought them in large cannisters - up to 12 lbs - for loading shotshells.)

[T.O.M.]

Back towards the original topic. I just watched this video about the 30 Super Carry:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJBDWAj4h44&t=283s

In the video, they say that the caliber was designed to fill a gap between .380 and 9mm.  Say that it will allow for 9mm performance from .380 sized handguns, or an increase in capacity for bigger guns.  They show full sized 1911 handguns from Nighthawk custom in the new round, with 12 round capacity in the magazines.  They are talking ballpark 20% increase in mag capacity.  At the same time, an LCP with 9mm power would be interesting.

Might actually be worth keeping an eye on...

[Devonai]

I'd be interested in a S&W Shield.  Here in CT I can theoretically get +10-round mags by virtue of my military service, but in practicality the shops rarely have any in stock.  My last trip to Maine, for example, I was finally able to buy some Beretta PX4 9mm 17-rounders that have been on my wish list for almost three years.

Anyway, ten rounds in a flush-fit Shield mag would be of interest to me.

[MechAg94]

I am curious about the muzzle blast and such considering this will be a higher pressure round.  Considering one of the guns planned for it is a S&W Shield Plus, that is a pretty short barrel.  Hopefully, we will see some reviews and shooting video soon. 

SHOT show is this week so I expect it to be there.

[dogmush]

As far as I know we still haven't gotten around F=ma.

350 ft-lbs in a small gun is going to be snappy, kinda no matter what.  In a 9mm sized gun it gives you a couple  more rounds, but with the P365/Hellcat guns, that's less of an issue then it used to be.

I predict some of these will sell, ammo will be pricey, they won't get shot much, and fade away.

[MechAg94]

As far as I know we still haven't gotten around F=ma.

350 ft-lbs in a small gun is going to be snappy, kinda no matter what.  In a 9mm sized gun it gives you a couple  more rounds, but with the P365/Hellcat guns, that's less of an issue then it used to be.

I predict some of these will sell, ammo will be pricey, they won't get shot much, and fade away.

Either way, I think the SHOT Show Industry day at the range is today.  Hopefully we will see some video and commentary of people actually shooting it. 

[lee n. field]

As far as I know we still haven't gotten around F=ma.

350 ft-lbs in a small gun is going to be snappy, kinda no matter what.  In a 9mm sized gun it gives you a couple  more rounds, but with the P365/Hellcat guns, that's less of an issue then it used to be.

I predict some of these will sell, ammo will be pricey, they won't get shot much, and fade away.

So, .327 Federal Magnum for pocket autos?

[Ben]

So, .327 Federal Magnum for pocket autos?

Is that like .357mag for derringers?

https://youtu.be/CKu0RXCB6G4

[HankB]

So, .327 Federal Magnum for pocket autos?

The .327 almost equals the .357 for kinetic energy - momentum and impact aree, though, are less. That's because the .327 operates at 45,000 PSI vs. 35,000 PSI for the .357. (Not going to get into the apparent disparity between loads at the PSI vs. CUP pressure limits for the .357.) 

Similarly, the .30 Super Carry almost equals the 9mm P for kinetic energy - and again, momentum and impact area are less.

The .30 Super Carry seems to be not quite as potent as the .327, but then you get into things like barrel length, cylinder gap of a revolver vs. solid pistol barrel, etc.

I don't expect to see +P or +P+ loads for the .30 SC, but if you throw those into the mix, the 9mm pulls further ahead. (Disclaimer: some 9mm P pistols should not be used with +P or +P+ ammo.)

I don't see the .30 SC as a bad round, it's just one of those rounds (like the mutually incompatible short .300 mag rifle rounds Ruger, Win, & Rem introduced) that really don't seem to have much point.

Is that like .357mag for derringers?

https://youtu.be/CKu0RXCB6G4

Notice in the link the guy had his hand over the muzzle(s) of that pistol when he closed the action?

[lee n. field]

I don't see the .30 SC as a bad round, it's just one of those rounds that really don't seem to have much point.

Kind-a the point I was trying to make.  Yet another round, in a market swarming with them.  If you've never bought a gun before, you might listen to the salesman and buy one. 

(At least with a .327 Federal gun, you can shoot the smaller .32 revolver rounds (if you can find them).  I don't see .32 anything much around here.)

[MechAg94]

I have one of the Beretta 81 pistols in 32 ACP with a 12 round capacity.  Those shoot pretty good.  I am trying to picture that pistol with a hotter round and having trouble.  Something to think about.

I met a guy at my range with a big Ruger Blackhawk in 327 Mag.  It had no recoil, but the muzzle blast was substantial with a 5" or 6" barrel.  I never fired one out of a pocket revolver. 

[K Frame]

"I have one of the Beretta 81 pistols in 32 ACP with a 12 round capacity.  "

Same. I absolutely love it.

[Hawkmoon]

I don't expect to see +P or +P+ loads for the .30 SC, but if you throw those into the mix, the 9mm pulls further ahead. (Disclaimer: some 9mm P pistols should not be used with +P or +P+ ammo.)

What's a 9mm P pistol?

[WLJ]

What's a 9mm P pistol?

I would assume P for Parabellum

[WLJ]

Not much here other than oooohs and aaahs

30 Super Carry SHOT Show 2022 Range Day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z03nP5SuOg

[T.O.M.]

https://youtu.be/GP_c1Pp2JUI

Here is a video from TFB.  Includes a short quote from Gun Jesus.  Everyone says it's just like shooting a 9mm.  No mention of excessive blast.  Just extra rounds in the magazine.

[MechAg94]

The guns do look like they are recoiling sharply, but it is hard to tell from the video. 

I guess we will see what things look like once terminal ballistics info starting coming out and ammo pricing/availability is more apparent. 

[Devonai]

Having fired the Kel-Tec P40 and a Scandium-framed .357 snubby, recoil is relative.

[WLJ]

Anyone seen any 30SC vs 9mm gel tests that aren't basically an ad for the round?