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Author Topic: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....  (Read 52651 times)

WLJ

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RocketMan

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #51 on: January 24, 2022, 10:34:12 AM »

Interesting how Ukraine's foreign ministry has said the State Department's decision to evacuate some embassy personnel from Kyiv is "premature" and an example of "excessive caution."

Edited to add that the EU is not following the US lead in evacuating embassy staff.  It appears that the US is the only big player evacuating staff.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

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Ben

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #52 on: January 24, 2022, 10:56:34 AM »


Edited to add that the EU is not following the US lead in evacuating embassy staff.  It appears that the US is the only big player evacuating staff.

I wonder how much of the evacuation is related to Afghanistan and PR?
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #53 on: January 24, 2022, 11:10:31 AM »

I wonder how much of the evacuation is related to Afghanistan and PR?
Quite a bit I think.  I already heard at least one radio show jokingly refer to the helicopters pulling people out of the Ukrainian embassy. 
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Ben

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #54 on: January 24, 2022, 11:29:08 AM »

Interesting:

Quote
Jennifer Griffin
@JenGriffinFNC
From State Dept call: “Given that the President has said military action by Russia could come at any time. The US government will not be in a position to evacuate US citizens. So US citizens, currently present in Ukraine should plan accordingly.” Arrange commercial flights.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

Ron

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #55 on: January 24, 2022, 02:22:04 PM »

Our foreign policy has rarely been in line with the desires of the voters.

 
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead

WLJ

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #56 on: January 24, 2022, 02:42:59 PM »

Forget the Russians, COVID!

U.S. State Dept. website gives a second reason to avoid traveling to Ukraine (in case the threat of a Russian invasion isn’t enough)
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2022/01/24/u-s-state-dept-website-gives-a-second-reason-to-avoid-traveling-to-ukraine-in-case-the-threat-of-a-russian-invasion-isnt-enough/

"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
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WLJ

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #57 on: January 24, 2022, 03:28:11 PM »

Russian navy planning on conducting live fire exercises 150 miles off the coast of Ireland and Ireland is not a happy camper.

Quote
The area - off the west coast of Europe - is far from any of Russia's permanent naval bases, and is also near several critical transatlantic data cables, which defence experts have warned Russia could pose a risk to.

Ireland tells Russia live-fire naval exercise is 'not welcome'
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60113233
« Last Edit: January 24, 2022, 03:41:59 PM by WLJ »
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Jim147

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #58 on: January 24, 2022, 04:48:26 PM »

We have 8,500 troops on alert to be sent to help NATO and in other news we just put two carrier groups in the China Sea.

Hope no one bumps into the wrong thing and this all goes sideways.
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BobR

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #59 on: January 24, 2022, 07:16:41 PM »

Pretty standard SOP, poll numbers heading into the darkest part of the basement, stock market shedding points like a Huskie sheds fur in the spring, interest rates and inflation making strides to the sky. Hey, let's divert a while. IMO, Democrats are quick to send troops into harms way, and even quicker to forget about them and their injuries when they return.

bob

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #60 on: January 24, 2022, 08:25:13 PM »

We have 8,500 troops on alert to be sent to help NATO and in other news we just put two carrier groups in the China Sea.

Hope no one bumps into the wrong thing and this all goes sideways.

Taiwan Intercepts Massive Swarm Of Chinese Military Aircraft As ‘Weak’ Biden Tested Around World
https://www.dailywire.com/news/taiwan-intercepts-massive-swarm-of-chinese-military-aircraft-as-weak-biden-tested-around-world?utm_campaign=dw_newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_source=housefile&utm_content=non_member
Quote
“The latest Chinese mission included 34 fighters plus four electronic warfare aircraft and a single bomber,” Reuters reported. “Taiwan sent combat aircraft to warn away the Chinese aircraft, while missile systems were deployed to monitor them.”
Fun times.  IMO, the US has a much stronger obligation to help Taiwan than The Ukraine. 
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bedlamite

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #61 on: January 24, 2022, 10:13:18 PM »

Is defenestration possible through the overton window?

Lennyjoe

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #62 on: January 25, 2022, 07:47:40 PM »

A news report noted that Biden is contemplating sending 5000 US soldiers to Ukraine... Could we please just not involve ourselves here?

What would that say to our NATO alliance?  How about outside of Ukraine instead but close enough to get Russias attention

Ben

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #63 on: January 26, 2022, 09:40:52 AM »

Germany "helps" Ukraine. When I read the English translation, it first sounded like they were sending 5000 troops and I was like, "Whaaaat? That's pretty ballsey!"

But no, they are actually sending 5000 helmets. Which is kind of the opposite of ballsey. They look like they're doing something, yet doing so without pissing off Russia to where they lose that energy they need.

https://www.epochtimes.de/politik/ausland/ukraine-fordert-flugabwehrraketen-deutschland-schickt-5-000-schutzhelme-a3698949.html
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DittoHead

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #64 on: January 26, 2022, 12:45:02 PM »

How about outside of Ukraine instead but close enough to get Russias attention

That's exactly what is under consideration. The fox news article (which the trash NYpost article is based on) makes that clear.
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Nick1911

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #65 on: January 26, 2022, 01:26:36 PM »

What would that say to our NATO alliance?  How about outside of Ukraine instead but close enough to get Russias attention

Ukraine isn't part of NATO.

I suppose if it makes everyone feel better, NATO members can send equipment and troops to nearby NATO countries.  Romania, Poland, Slovakia, etc.  I doubt it will matter.  I suspect if Russia takes over  the rest of Ukraine, they will stop there regardless.

Ron

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #66 on: January 26, 2022, 07:58:21 PM »

https://www.rt.com/russia/547454-nato-russia-response-stoltenberg/

Quote
NATO has said it “will not compromise” on potential expansion into Ukraine, Georgia, and other former Soviet republics, as this clashes with the “core principles” of the alliance, Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg told reporters on Wednesday.

The alliance’s response, which Stoltenberg said all 30 members agreed upon, was delivered to Moscow earlier in the day by the US ambassador, alongside Washington’s separate written note.

The US has asked Russia to keep the contents of its response private.

I'm confident NATO is willing to fight down to the very last US soldier.
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Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead

MillCreek

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #67 on: January 26, 2022, 08:28:54 PM »

https://www.rt.com/russia/547454-nato-russia-response-stoltenberg/

I'm confident NATO is willing to fight down to the very last US soldier.

Ain't that the truth.
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dogmush

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #68 on: January 26, 2022, 08:44:14 PM »

https://www.rt.com/russia/547454-nato-russia-response-stoltenberg/

I'm confident NATO is willing to fight down to the very last US soldier.

I am confident in that as well........oh..........well *expletive deleted*it.

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #69 on: January 26, 2022, 10:01:48 PM »

“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #70 on: January 26, 2022, 10:02:11 PM »

“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

MechAg94

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #71 on: January 26, 2022, 10:03:46 PM »

I guess some memes are better than others.  Some are just okay.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

Nick1911

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #72 on: January 26, 2022, 10:09:45 PM »

Prediction time:  What do you think will come of the Ukraine/Russia conflict?

I suspect Russia will attack, but am not at all confident about it.  If Russia were to back off now, Ukraine would just redouble its efforts to join NATO - which doesn't serve Russia's goals.  It seems that if Russia attacks and occupies Ukraine, the sanctions from the international community will be mostly economic, from NATO block members.  Russia's biggest trading partners are China, Netherlands, Germany, Belarus and Turkey.   Will China care much?  Doubt it.  The other four will, but Russia sells them lots of energy.  How much hardball can they play with that dependence?

I suppose it's possible that this move is just theater to scare NATO from even considering Ukraine as a NATO state.

French G.

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #73 on: January 26, 2022, 10:16:32 PM »

I guess the real question is can the world establish an order where nuclear powers cannot operate on a because I can basis? Russia has already violated the territory of many of it's neighbors and just dares the world to do anything. Can actions like that be deterred? At what point being backed into a corner would they use nukes? Russia seems to be a great test case, they have a fragile economy and three ports. Close the pipelines, close the banks, blockade the ports. Or do they do what they want? China watches, tomorrow Taiwan, next week their new colony of Africa. I don't think war in Ukraine helps a damn thing but how do we get nations to adhere to civil behavior?
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Nick1911

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Re: War in Eastern Europe, what's it good for ....
« Reply #74 on: January 26, 2022, 10:29:11 PM »

I guess the real question is can the world establish an order where nuclear powers cannot operate on a because I can basis? Russia has already violated the territory of many of it's neighbors and just dares the world to do anything. Can actions like that be deterred? At what point being backed into a corner would they use nukes? Russia seems to be a great test case, they have a fragile economy and three ports. Close the pipelines, close the banks, blockade the ports. Or do they do what they want? China watches, tomorrow Taiwan, next week their new colony of Africa. I don't think war in Ukraine helps a damn thing but how do we get nations to adhere to civil behavior?

I was thinking about this very topic last night.  Ultimately, the nuclear powers states can more or less do whatever they want to non-nuclear states.  They are holding all the cards.  Lets say Russia pulled a WWII Germany approach, and started eating countries.  Would the other nuclear power states really risk a nuclear war over Russia eating Ukraine?  Kazakhstan?  Belarus? ...Finland?  I don't think so.  I'm not even sure about a NATO member - would NATO actually engage in a nuclear war with Russia if they invaded, say, Poland?
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