Author Topic: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade  (Read 33013 times)

WLJ

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #225 on: May 09, 2022, 09:43:23 AM »
Quote
    Caroline Reilly (@ms_creilly), a reporter for @RewireNewsGroup, has called for more arson attacks against anti-abortion groups & suggested an escalation to deadly political violence. pic.twitter.com/OBoE4DJbX5

    — Andy Ngô 🏳️‍🌈 (@MrAndyNgo) May 9, 2022
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2022/05/09/blue-check-pro-abort-reporter-deletes-account-after-being-dragged-mercilessly-over-tweet-calling-for-more-violence-against-pro-life/
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dogmush

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #226 on: May 09, 2022, 09:43:49 AM »
^^^The article noted that the Governor was asked about Plan B and IUDs as candidates for being banned and he declined to specifically answer.


^^Did he read a checklist on how to lose support of moderates?

Pb

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #227 on: May 09, 2022, 09:51:33 AM »
^^^The article noted that the Governor was asked about Plan B and IUDs as candidates for being banned and he declined to specifically answer.

I don't know I about IUDs, but I think there is some evidence that Plan B only prevents ovulation.

Jim147

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #228 on: May 09, 2022, 09:58:54 AM »

^^Did he read a checklist on how to lose support of moderates?

Just like Mitch saying that if Roe falls abortion could be outlawed at the federal level.

They must have had a meeting and said hey looks like we are going clean up in the midterms we better get on the game to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
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MechAg94

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #229 on: May 09, 2022, 10:03:32 AM »
^^^The article noted that the Governor was asked about Plan B and IUDs as candidates for being banned and he declined to specifically answer.
Just to be clear for those like me that don't follow some details, the "Plan B" is also known as the morning after pill. 

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charby

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #230 on: May 09, 2022, 10:13:57 AM »
I don't know I about IUDs, but I think there is some evidence that Plan B only prevents ovulation.

How an IUD works

How Plan B works
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sumpnz

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #231 on: May 09, 2022, 10:16:21 AM »
The thing that gets sticky about birth control among hard-core anti-abortion crowds is that some are considered tantamount to abortion.  I’m not even talking Plan B which absolutely is an abortifacient - that’s the whole point of it.  Some birth control methods, like the copper IUD, don’t reliably prevent sperm from passing or an egg from being released by the ovary.  So conception can (and often does) occur, with the birth control device preventing implantation.  Which is essentially causing an abortion.

Not necessarily saying such birth control is worthy of banning but it is something that will come up for debate eventually in some states once Roe and Casey are officially out of the way.  To make birth control (of any type) illegal again SCOTUS would probably need to overturn Griswold too.

dogmush

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #232 on: May 09, 2022, 10:23:23 AM »
I understand the biology of it, but convincing the majority of the middle of the road Americans that an IUD is on the same level as a third trimester abortion is not only a losing battle, but likely to loose a lot of support for *any* abortion restrictions.


Ben

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #233 on: May 09, 2022, 10:29:47 AM »
I understand the biology of it, but convincing the majority of the middle of the road Americans that an IUD is on the same level as a third trimester abortion is not only a losing battle, but likely to loose a lot of support for *any* abortion restrictions.

I don't have a strong understanding from the philosophical side, but when I did the quick lookup of Plan B and Europe, I read a few statements from religious groups, which seemed to be, "IUD OK", but "Plan B not OK".
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sumpnz

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #234 on: May 09, 2022, 10:55:35 AM »
I don't have a strong understanding from the philosophical side, but when I did the quick lookup of Plan B and Europe, I read a few statements from religious groups, which seemed to be, "IUD OK", but "Plan B not OK".

There are 2 basic types of IUD.  One is copper, the other is plastic and impregnated (heh) with birth control hormones. 

The latter is generally as acceptable to pro-lifers as regular  oral birth control.  Basically it allows for the same hormones to be used to prevent ovulation but at much lower dose because it’s more targeted. 

The former, the copper one, is what pro-lifers tend to object to because while it is somewhat effective at keeping sperm from finding the egg it’s not THAT good at that, and it has a secondary effect of preventing successful implantation of a fertilized egg.

Re: dogmush’s point, I’m not sure how banning a couple specific birth control methods will go over.  It’ll probably be a state by state thing.  But in general I’d agree that attacking birth control now is poor timing at best.

Pb

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« Last Edit: May 09, 2022, 12:13:08 PM by Pb »

fifth_column

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Pb

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #237 on: May 09, 2022, 11:57:54 AM »
deleted

charby

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #238 on: May 09, 2022, 11:58:10 AM »
Pro-choice opinions expressed in a mostly peaceful way:

https://www.foxnews.com/us/wisconsin-anti-abortion-group-molotov-cocktail-arson-attack

Both sides have had their fair share of violent nutters.
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MechAg94

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #239 on: May 09, 2022, 12:03:41 PM »
There are 2 basic types of IUD.  One is copper, the other is plastic and impregnated (heh) with birth control hormones. 

The latter is generally as acceptable to pro-lifers as regular  oral birth control.  Basically it allows for the same hormones to be used to prevent ovulation but at much lower dose because it’s more targeted. 

The former, the copper one, is what pro-lifers tend to object to because while it is somewhat effective at keeping sperm from finding the egg it’s not THAT good at that, and it has a secondary effect of preventing successful implantation of a fertilized egg.

Re: dogmush’s point, I’m not sure how banning a couple specific birth control methods will go over.  It’ll probably be a state by state thing.  But in general I’d agree that attacking birth control now is poor timing at best.
In their defense, they weren't attacking birth control.  The news media was just being pushy and trying to make a story where one didn't exist.  The Gov who was questioned gave a non-answer that is being interpreted as meaning more.  Whether it does mean more we don't know. 
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BobR

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #240 on: May 09, 2022, 12:07:32 PM »
Like I said, Plan B apparently does not kill human zygotes:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_contraception#Mechanism_of_action

Which is why the old standby of methotrexate is still used by some providers if less than 8 weeks gestation. It is also used in the case of ectopic pregnancy when trying to preserve the fallopian tube.

bob

MechAg94

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #241 on: May 09, 2022, 12:14:01 PM »
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/mississippi-gov-tate-reeves-on-banning-birth-control-that-is-not-what-we-are-focused-on-at-this-time
Below are some quotes from this article about what the Governor said.  I don't think it means he wants to ban contraception the way it was being portrayed.  I think the news guy was trying to push him into saying that by asking hypothetical questions which he didn't want to answer.  IMO, he was right to avoid it.  There is no perfect answer than could never be twisted.  The Supreme Court opinion is hypothetical until the final ruling is released anyway.   

Quote
"That is not what we are focused on at this time," Reeves said. "We're focused on looking at, seeing what the court allows for, the bill that is before the court is a 15-week ban. We believe that the overturning of Roe is the correct decision by the court."
----------------
On NBC's "Meet the Press," anchor Chuck Todd also asked Reeves whether outlawing abortion in Mississippi would include birth control methods like IUDs, prompting Reeves to say he doesn't think "that it is going to apply to those that choose to use birth control."

"I believe that clearly a life begins at conception," Reeves added.
------------------------------
Later in the interview, Todd brought up the "life begins at conception" quote and asked Reeves whether he would sign legislation to ban contraception if it was brought before him to sign.

"Well, I don't think that's going to happen in Mississippi. I'm sure they'll have those conversations in other states," Reeves said.

"But you're not answering the question," Todd said.

"Well that's always the case. There's so many things we can talk about," Reeves said before highlighting some of the resources his administration is providing for pregnancy resource centers, including adoption resources.
He probably should rethink appearing on networks like CNN in the first place.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #242 on: May 09, 2022, 12:33:34 PM »

Re: dogmush’s point, I’m not sure how banning a couple specific birth control methods will go over.  It’ll probably be a state by state thing.  But in general I’d agree that attacking birth control now is poor timing at best.

Honest question:

Is that what Republican politicians are actually doing, or are we just being influenced to talk about it as if it were?
edit:
I see now some above posts have spoken to that.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2022, 12:58:03 PM by Perd Hapley »
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dogmush

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #243 on: May 09, 2022, 12:46:51 PM »
This is as close as I could find with a quick search: https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article261207007.html

Not exactly a frothing Republican waiting on a hair trigger, but he at least gave a substantive answer.

I think you are probably correct in that the folks who make a living by the column inch have ran out of things to say regarding an opinion that isn't actually out yet, and have veered into hypotheticals, dragging the rest of the online discussion with them.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #244 on: May 09, 2022, 01:14:45 PM »


I think you are probably correct in that the folks who make a living by the column inch have ran out of things to say regarding an opinion that isn't actually out yet, and have veered into hypotheticals, dragging the rest of the online discussion with them.

It's a deliberate attempt to frame GOP politicians. You may recall a reporter asking Romney about banning birth control in 2012, except there was no court case to pin it on. It was completely out of the blue, and I think it sustained its own news cycle at the time.
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dogmush

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #245 on: May 09, 2022, 01:55:23 PM »
Or it's highly emotional people catastrophizing their bugaboos onto their enemies.  Or a little of both.

I'm sure democratic "strategists" exist that attempt to get soundbites on their enemies, but most of these blog authors are too stupid to figure that out.  They already legitimately believe the GOP wants to bring about the Handmaid's Tale (despite not having read it) and are screaming into the void.

MechAg94

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #246 on: May 09, 2022, 01:59:22 PM »
It's a deliberate attempt to frame GOP politicians. You may recall a reporter asking Romney about banning birth control in 2012, except there was no court case to pin it on. It was completely out of the blue, and I think it sustained its own news cycle at the time.
This.  Redirect the discussion to attack Republicans and frame them as the radicals.  Put them on the defensive.
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WLJ

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #247 on: May 09, 2022, 08:18:33 PM »
In case there was any doubt some of them are nuts

Quote
    MSNBC guest says she wants to make sweet love to the SCOTUS leaker, then “joyfully abort the baby." pic.twitter.com/NNSU7B6ahD

    — Real Mac Report (@RealMacReport) May 9, 2022
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2022/05/09/msnbc-comedian-says-shell-joyfully-abort-our-fetus-after-making-sweet-love-to-the-roe-v-wade-leaker/
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #248 on: May 09, 2022, 09:59:18 PM »
"...the baby."
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

WLJ

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Re: Being reported the Supreme Court has voted to strike down Roe v. Wade
« Reply #249 on: May 11, 2022, 11:45:43 AM »
Quote
Bill Kristol
@BillKristol
It's become pretty clear the leaks about internal Court deliberations (if not the draft opinion itself) are from the Thomas-Alito camp, and are designed to weaken the Chief Justice and intimidate any of the newer justices from joining him for fear of seeming weak or unprincipled.
https://twitter.com/BillKristol/status/1524379116828569600?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1524379116828569600%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitchy.com%2Fsarahd-313035%2F2022%2F05%2F11%2Fbill-kristol-thinks-its-pretty-clear-that-leaked-internal-scotus-info-came-from-the-thomas-alito-camp%2F

Oookay  :O
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